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===[TASK]=== Crowd Sourced - Thracians (Faction)


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Here is a tiny A23 mod with six Thracian units (actors, icons, templates; three ranks each), made with existing art assets: thracians.zip [EDIT]: As you can see the swordsmen use the Iberian fa

Edit: Hello all! I meant to reply to this thread with my repository a long time ago but... Here is my Thracian mod with the thracian units that are already in 0 ad and @Stan`'s thracian buildings

Buenas ;   -Creo que la facción tracia podría ser la excepción a la regla de que los edificios no cambian en cada fase , ya que hay muchas referencias diferentes para los tracios y al mismo

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1 hour ago, Hannibal_Barca said:

I'm a bit busy in current and coming days so I don't expect I'll look into this

The key to a civilization is uniqueness and aesthetics

Unique techs and units would be needed, with exotic-looking structures to top

But as I said, I don't have time for this

No problem, just wanted you to be aware of this.

 

56 minutes ago, stanislas69 said:

I could release what I have so far and let people contribute to it :)

giphy.gif

 

32 minutes ago, Alexandermb said:

For me the finishing date was this weak, later updates or changes will have to wait for alpha 24 only 2D and Template changes are missing IIRC so, should i make a base for the shield textures for someone hand paint the patterns with textures like the millenium ad shields?

I'd say go for it! :) I'll see if I can contribute with my measly texture skills...

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14 minutes ago, Alexandermb said:

Closer look

Nice... It's a Dacian temple though, and Stanislas already made a more appropriate Thracian temple.

It is a beautiful structure though... Maybe it could be used as a model for a special building (Thracians had some round structures as well). Just not sure what. 

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Yeah, in the end, I'm not all that particular about separating Dacians culturally from Thracians, as they formed a clear cultural continuum. The term Traco-Geto-Dacii is sometimes used to refer to them as a whole, and Getae and Dacians just seem to be subsets of greater Thrace. I shared those Dacian references last year to get a better idea of the architecture of that region, as some of the Dacian sites are better preserved. So for me, Dacian references are fair game, but they should be used subtly, to fill potential gaps, so that there is room enough to differentiate them from a more explicitly Dacian Kingdom for 0AD's mythical part 2. So units should be mostly/purely "pre-Dacian kingdom" Thrace i.m.o...

On that note, Burebista is an attractive third choice for Hero, the first Thracian king to unite the Getae and the Dacians. A late hero to represent the power shift from the Odrysian kingdom to the Dacians.

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Burebista (Ancient Greek: Βυρεβίστας, Βοιρεβίστας) was a Thracian king of the Getae and Dacian tribes from 82/81 BC to 45/44 BC. He was the first king who successfully unified the tribes of the Dacian kingdom, which comprised the area located between the Danube, Tisza, and Dniester rivers and modern day Romania. In the 7th and 6th centuries BC it became home to the Thracian peoples, including the Getae and the Dacians. From the 4th century to the middle of the 2nd century BC the Dacian peoples were influenced by La Tène Celts who brought new technologies with them into Dacia. Sometime in the 2nd century BC the Dacians expelled the Celts from their lands. Dacians often warred with neighbouring tribes, but the relative isolation of the Dacian peoples in the Carpathian Mountains allowed them to survive and even to thrive. By the 1st century BC the Dacians had become the dominant tribe.

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Spoiler

Burebista:

799595464_BurebistaDacian-Cavalry.jpg.749da4bbd8de76daf174028c57aa7f90.jpg

 

Dacian town, Argedava:

argedava.jpg.7270cea0447674d15748d5374e624efa.jpg

 

Dacian village life:

123429900_Dacianvillage.jpg.703d5a76b0ffe5e9aea39ba2c13d7cb0.jpg

 

The following documentary is quite interesting, although a measure of caution is necessary here. There are some nationalistic undertones, and a reactionary narrative. I understand their frustration as this history is not widely known or discussed, and is often reduced to the term "Barbarians", which clearly doesn't fit with the popular meaning of that word today. They were more advanced than most people give them credit for (like Celts), but there are a few farts in this docu to be aware of. They shamelessly show the ruins of Perpericon, which was an important Thracian city, true, but those ruins date to the Roman period. Questionable historian dude also states that Chinese generals pledged loyalty to the Dacian King Decebalus in his war against the Romans, without even trying to reference it... I mean, dude... But some other incredible things, like the Thracian origin of a number of Greek gods and the importance of Thrace in the Trojan war and Alexanders conquests and the importance of Dacians in Imperial Rome actually checks out (to some degree)..

 

 

 

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I think Dacian architectural references are okay for the Thracians in lieu of good references. As far as units go, I think the Dacian units would at least look distinct from Thracian units:

  • Dacian units are partially influenced by Romans (some chainmail, etc.), Sarmatians (cavalry, head gear, etc.), Celts, and Germans.
  • Dacians would have Roman-type siege weapons.
  • Dacians would have an even more nerfed navy than the Thracians.
  • Thracian units would have a somewhat Greek influence.
  • Perhaps visually, Dacian units would have more long sleeves and long pants, while the Thracians would have short sleeves and pantless tunics. Just a general observation.
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1 hour ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I think Dacian architectural references are okay for the Thracians in lieu of good references. As far as units go, I think the Dacian units would at least look distinct from Thracian units:

  • Dacian units are partially influenced by Romans (some chainmail, etc.), Sarmatians (cavalry, head gear, etc.), Celts, and Germans.
  • Dacians would have Roman-type siege weapons.
  • Dacians would have an even more nerfed navy than the Thracians.
  • Thracian units would have a somewhat Greek influence.
  • Perhaps visually, Dacian units would have more long sleeves and long pants, while the Thracians would have short sleeves and pantless tunics. Just a general observation.

I think your general observations are on point...

I read something about artillery use at some Thracian sites, but need to read up more about that...

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1 hour ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I think Dacian architectural references are okay for the Thracians in lieu of good references. As far as units go, I think the Dacian units would at least look distinct from Thracian units:

  • Dacian units are partially influenced by Romans (some chainmail, etc.), Sarmatians (cavalry, head gear, etc.), Celts, and Germans.
  • Dacians would have Roman-type siege weapons.
  • Dacians would have an even more nerfed navy than the Thracians.
  • Thracian units would have a somewhat Greek influence.
  • Perhaps visually, Dacian units would have more long sleeves and long pants, while the Thracians would have short sleeves and pantless tunics. Just a general observation.

Thracians are more kind Greek and Dacians more Germanic.

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8 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I think Dacian architectural references are okay for the Thracians in lieu of good references. As far as units go, I think the Dacian units would at least look distinct from Thracian units:

  • Dacian units are partially influenced by Romans (some chainmail, etc.), Sarmatians (cavalry, head gear, etc.), Celts, and Germans.
  • Dacians would have Roman-type siege weapons.
  • Dacians would have an even more nerfed navy than the Thracians.
  • Thracian units would have a somewhat Greek influence.
  • Perhaps visually, Dacian units would have more long sleeves and long pants, while the Thracians would have short sleeves and pantless tunics. Just a general observation.

One important thing to keep in mind is that most of what we know of the Thracians is based on Greek sources from the late 5th C BC and most of what we know of the Dacians is based on Roman sources from the early 2nd C AD; a lot can change in 500 years and this could easily explain the "Greek vs Roman"-influence. E.g. Thrace had Roman-style swordsmen when it was a protectorate of Rome during the 1st C BC and AD, until it was reduced to a Roman province by Claudius, after which Thracians formed one of the largest ethnicities in the Roman armies.

It is unknown how exactly Thracian(s) and Dacian(s) are related, but it is clear they formed a continuum. Yes, there were differences, but the most important one is that Thracians lived south of the Danube (and hence most of their archaeology is done by Bulgarians) and Dacians north of the Danube (and thus mostly Romanian archaeologists do the work on them).

7 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

Thracians are more kind Greek and Dacians more Germanic.

Thrace was closer to Greece, so yes, one would expect they were more influenced by them than were the Dacians. After the Celts invaded the Balkans, some of them settled beyond the Danube - a lot of Celtic warrior graves have been found in Dacian area - so Dacians had a stronger Celtic influence than had the Thracians. (I'm not too sure about the Germanic element and would be interested in more information on this.) Furthermore, the closer to the north-east, the higher the Scythian influence on both Dacians and Thracians, up to the point it can become virtually impossible to distinguish them.

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So I noticed something... There exists a type of traditional (vernacular) architecture very similar in both rural Romania and Bulgaria. It's very clearly, pre-Ottoman, pre-Byzantine and even pre-Roman. It looks quite different to Slavic architecture as well... In fact, this type of buildings are very similar to the few reconstructions of village type structures from ancient Thrace and Dacia, and may have served as a source of inspiration for some of the reconstructions. This isn't be the only "remnant" of ancient times, take a look at the Bulgarian Surva Festival and see some pre-Christian traditions alive and well (and that clearly isn't Roman or Greek origin either). The Surva festival also offers a clue for priest/shaman?

Anyway, here's lots of inspiration for you @stanislas69, just avoid the obvious modernisms... Wooden shingles (no ceramic roof-tiles), or thatch and even stone slabs. Lots of wood, but also mud plastered mud brick, rammed earth, wattle and daub and stone are used for the lower storey. 2 stories aren't uncommon (ground floor was often used for animals). Upper floor sometimes have a slight overhang. Relatively steep roofs. Often have a squarish ground plan (though not exclusively so)

Spoiler

First, some Dacian reconstructions from the citadel at ardeu

cetatea-dacica-ardeu-dacian-citadel-romania-traditional-romanian-rural-architecture.jpg.3c72e4f9df437cce01149e9c66bcfe34.jpg

dacian-citadel-ardeu-romania-traditional-romanian-house-rural-eastern-europe.jpg.adb71bee5a6801ab68cee24ff9e68f5f.jpg

 

Regular Dacian house:

reconstruction-romania-traditional-dacian-houses-rural-romanians-1.png.fdcbb428ea597a4a4b6788002340d640.png

 

 

A large selection of the traditional architecture of Romania and Bulgaria (thoroughly mixed, sorry, couldn't be bothered to group it...):

 

map-romania-traditional-romanian-regions-house-regions-romanians.jpg.aac3506c2182afa45271896818f37392.jpg

99f04b7812bd0a8229dbfadfe8389ab3.thumb.jpg.fcbe100394fac5b343fe76a659ef6b5c.jpg

700717773.thumb.jpg.b967902549802d4bbbe24ffae57825fe.jpg

alexdrawingschurchesDSCF3582.thumb.jpg.a3c4ca47a494b20fec2b1061320ec683.jpg

traditional_romanian_house_2_by_aatheone-da6lfk2.thumb.jpg.07697b789eea059b55a4d84385087e93.jpg

ink-hand-drawing-landscape-old-house-romania-traditional-76186925.thumb.jpg.1af4841b00731188210453a1155807bb.jpg

traditional_romanian_house_by_aatheone-da6i1ml.thumb.jpg.2e741f602a6c0ef8e9bf8c0047128689.jpg

06.thumb.jpg.5f487ee2ba86ecb59bbdb600ca42c3f0.jpg

traditional-house-maramures.jpg.09cc22f0f66651aa47aea6ac11f14f78.jpgvoitinel-(Suceava).jpg.2da5aa88745e0d1b0de8390d5ad519dd.jpgcurteni-(Vaslui).jpg.3458c89837ec17fd64392388eec7d38e.jpgpersi-(Ilfov).jpg.a3b1aab2a743bf7f9c9d4103424d1c70.jpgmosoaia-(Arges).jpg.6ecfd8f0e351f31237e30e1146a621ec.jpgvistea-(Brasov).jpg.6d56a18a976d83d0118fda06d1c54e1a.jpgplopi-(Mehedinti).jpg.a06fa8219caa8aabe1e76d519a45b554.jpgmaldaresti-(Valcea).jpg.e93995519d8c757f3aefdaa79f4a1127.jpgcurtisoara-(Gorj).jpg.647468023b76e4d044eb9a935bf358ff.jpgbran-(Brasov).jpg.973a5bb5feb2d3436c82bc8ed6b6d14e.jpgcampu-lui-neag-(Hunedoara).jpg.60441fdf254f73a4bf34b0c5106c0771.jpgcherelus-(Arad).jpg.1f1c6a2396c9b7b1eee02247ab7d4b29.jpgsalciua-(Alba).jpg.00654d5796e02a31ec16efee4042692b.jpgmoiseni-(Satu-Mare).jpg.55544579804532f44ea19795993eb8ad.jpgbogdan-voda-(Maramures).jpg.aafc4efeb63351fd4d8be03e353266c3.jpg

Aschileul-Mare-casa-tarane.jpg.85b60dac1a8be4796ba1e56ce0145db7.jpg

 

Today:

gorjan-romania-traditional-romanian-house.thumb.jpg.6bf7171f52462d3c74cedd812dfc979c.jpg

95b649060443491454da1dc4d38edf85.jpg.9aa0bd436eac4437e5876cba99442bfe.jpg

stock-photo-old-traditional-wooden-house-in-romanian-rural-area-in-sunny-day-100948543.thumb.jpg.62c0df5718c2552dffc526aa7495aa96.jpg

gorj-curtisoara-romania-traditional-romanian-house-rural-eastern-europe.thumb.jpg.dc39f149f94b949bf7dd281017abdfcf.jpg

slide0003_image006.jpg.2d78a740e35993c78cea9cd25355a67b.jpg

e5f711625158f2e022cac9ca735f4a08.thumb.jpg.ebb391ce7a7ffbfbd6e49c81060a4b19.jpg

231248962a5e32c7c88cb706c16713ad.jpg.b389002a14f5afb1afd4481ceff6fd26.jpg

brushlyan-village-m-tarnovo-region-traditional-architecture-balkans-BPCNJY.thumb.jpg.de884b196c656d20ecd912988ff3d324.jpg

1608507761_AnoldhouseinSozopol.thumb.JPG.6970bf1c70a3ff0f11b5466bf71b231f.JPG

jeravna-a-little-bulgarian-museum-village-with-traditional-architecture-BR5KE7.thumb.jpg.15286397fd2c7589745d14e712455902.jpg

d50d0c913bef1d2df3ebe5d87763166c.jpg.a28f93db509d9618ac741704c62e52a9.jpg

94cc295fefd267cce4130071210988e2.jpg.0333df33d78af6436c2dd6356a9581f0.jpg

c5e5f5c5d7cac8a9abfbe570332d4d64.jpg.5a608bab59ac81de0c5ce578bd77e763.jpg

4c157912a45a4c9b72de6dec8707b91a.jpg.dbbfeced165b6321e8a0b52bf2041d39.jpg

b637e726156c4f04022e241765620666.thumb.jpg.4c0f353dd92f194f535a2324cc9f5e7e.jpg

e7b09de7c44e5389135f4fd418be7ddd.jpg.c9f481d1f40775cef7add7cfe2a17b4d.jpg

stock-photo-houses-in-old-traditional-architecture-in-the-historic-town-of-bratsigovo-bulgaria-174264323.thumb.jpg.bb25b0a79d15ea05132542c664ebcc5d.jpg

traditional-bulgarian-house-27879807.thumb.jpg.37d6080a0223faab5dcbe29f4e8ca0e3.jpg

Bulgaria-Brashlyan-05.thumb.jpg.b32fc14009cf78f20ce463f2c4e0550a.jpg

 

 

Like the CC and temple, I was thinking that their dock could have a more pronounced Hellenic influence. There were many Greek cities on the Black sea under Thracian "protection", and could/should be the source of their Hellenized navy. Essentially a Greek dock, but with wooden shingles to tie it in with the rest of the building set. We shouldn't forget that the Danube also runs through their territory and provided them with a Celtic connection, so their trading ship could be Celtic (looking).

I think it would be nice to use thatched roofs for the storehouse and farmstead (only), emphasizing the rural aspect.  

 

Edited by Sundiata
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