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Feedbacks from A26 SVN tests


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43 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

If you trade back and forth between the same resources, the rate behavior increases, so it is pretty easy to generate resources.

Thanks. I’ll have to look, but I thought that arbitrage disappears pretty quickly 

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2 hours ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

If you trade back and forth between the same resources, the rate behavior increases, so it is pretty easy to generate resources.

Seems very gimmicky, Macedonia seldom gets picked in my experience, but that is more underlying issues with their unit roster given current meta than anything else.

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4 minutes ago, Fabius said:

Seems very gimmicky, Macedonia seldom gets picked in my experience, but that is more underlying issues with their unit roster given current meta than anything else.

Macedonians are very powerful this alpha, they get great skirmcav mercenaries and skirm+pike infantry which is great. They have a hero that buffs siege, and their crossbow champions can be very useful to counter pikemen's meat shield effect.

It is actually not that common to use the market exploit because (in my experience) it is not consistent, sometimes I turned 1000 stone into 1700 metal and other times I turned 5000 of each into 7000 of each.

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3 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

Macedonians are very powerful this alpha, they get great skirmcav mercenaries and skirm+pike infantry which is great. They have a hero that buffs siege, and their crossbow champions can be very useful to counter pikemen's meat shield effect.

It is actually not that common to use the market exploit because (in my experience) it is not consistent, sometimes I turned 1000 stone into 1700 metal and other times I turned 5000 of each into 7000 of each.

Interesting insight, honestly when I realized their skirmisher cav was a merc I dropped them, as ranged mercs to me are just metal wastage that could go on champions, the skirmisher cav plus melee cav meta is very potent, but not viable with ranged mercenaries. Also the lack of easy access swords for ram killing.

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4 hours ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

It is actually not that common to use the market exploit because (in my experience) it is not consistent, sometimes I turned 1000 stone into 1700 metal and other times I turned 5000 of each into 7000 of each.

it seems to kind of balance out in games because people realized they can trade 100 wood for like 600 metal for example. But even in that case, it makes the barters crazy for everyone which is really annoying.

Probably the worst possible abuse would be in a 1v1: take mace, rush p2, build stables and market, generate metal -> infinite cav mercs.

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32 minutes ago, Player of 0AD said:

A small trickle might be too small. The power of the ptolemy bonus comes from helping right at the beginning of the game which allows faster growth. Markets might be too late in the game.

Maybe it could be combined with allowing the civs mercs to be trained from the market if their ally is mace. 

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1 hour ago, Player of 0AD said:

A small trickle might be too small. The power of the ptolemy bonus comes from helping right at the beginning of the game which allows faster growth. Markets might be too late in the game.

Well, that was a flaw of the original bonus too, since it required the Market. :shrug:

 

Could be a trickle from the beginning (market not required) like the Ptolemies' food trickle. 

 

34 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

Maybe it could be combined with allowing the civs mercs to be trained from the market if their ally is mace. 

Gotta keep the bonuses at least somewhat historical. "Standardized Currency" makes sense, with a metal trickle, since King Philip reopened a lot of dormant mines during his reign and helped revive the Macedonian economy. 

We have to make a decision soon so it makes it in before commit freeze, which will come whenever the release blockers are all fixed.

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12 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Could be a trickle from the beginning (market not required) like the Ptolemies' food trickle. 

 

Gotta keep the bonuses at least somewhat historical. "Standardized Currency" makes sense, with a metal trickle, since King Philip reopened a lot of dormant mines during his reign and helped revive the Macedonian economy.

Sounds good.

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23 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

Trickle from the beginning sounds good too. It could go to upgrades or mercs. What is interesting to me is how much metal rate would be balanced compared to ptol bonus?

I am unsure. Perhaps balance it by looking how easy it is to gather food compared to metal or something like that.

Or assume the Mack player will always go heavy mercs with a metal trickle. This may be a bad thing.

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17 hours ago, Player of 0AD said:

A small trickle might be too small. The power of the ptolemy bonus comes from helping right at the beginning of the game which allows faster growth. Markets might be too late in the game.

I don't think that using the Ptolemies as a benchmark for balance is a good idea considering that the civilization is currently too strong and often banned from team games.

If you start from game start, at a rate of 1 metal per sec, by minute 10, that 4 x 600 metal = 2400 metal for the whole team. Give all that metal to a ptolemies player with 4 barracks, by minute 11 he will have 40 mercenary infantry. If you get the hero for cheap mercenaries + a iberian bonus, that would be even enough metal for 68 skirmishers mercenary. That bonus is likely to boost the strong civilization even further...

 

I do not like using economic bonuses as team bonuses. If a team pick 4 economic bonuses when the other team has none, the game become very unbalanced with one team being way too fast relative to the other. If your opponent pick the civilizations with economic team bonuses, it forces you therefore to also pick the same civilization if you want to be able to compete. As a result, team games end up being about always picking the same civilizations with economic bonuses (or banning the op ones).

The likely following step is to nerf economic team bonuses until they become barely significant so they can be stacked without being breaking the game. The Iberian bonus used to be -20%, it was nerfed to -10%, some people are still talking about nerfing it even further. 

 

Edited by faction02
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Both the archery and crossbow training upgrades for the Han Chinese are available at the barrack rather than the forge as it is the case for other civilizations. Not sure which of the two options is the best, but I am guessing the difference was not made on purpose.

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10 minutes ago, faction02 said:

Both the archery and crossbow training upgrades for the Han Chinese are available at the barrack rather than the forge as it is the case for other civilizations. Not sure which of the two options is the best, but I am guessing the difference was not made on purpose.

Your guess would be incorrect! =]

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I'm guessing that the reason that my roman cavalry can only hack on a Han archery practice building to destruction and not capture it in the more recent  A26 revisions  is because in the revisions last week allowed me to train roman champion cavalry.  If that is the case I would prefer being able to capture building and simply not have the champion option.  When I'm capturing I prefer to extend the stable territory if the first capture is adjacent to territory I already control.  

At the same time when I capture a Han stable, it cannot train champions even though I have this option with every other civilization's captured stable.

In all honesty I would like to capture the original  recruiting capacities of all my captured buildings, but that I fear is a bridge too far.

At least let us gain the the territory.

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