Auto-Queue for 0 A.D

[azayrahmad]

Auto-Queue is an ability of a building to loop through production queue indefinitely as long as resources and population limits permit it. So instead of training units repeatedly, you can simply set the queue once and set the building to auto-queue. If you played Age of Mythology you probably have used this features. In Rise of Nations it's called Infinite Queue.

I have searched through the forum in case this topic has been discussed before, but I can't find any. So I decided to make a small mod to demonstrate this feature, inspired mostly from RoN's infinite queue. I attached the mod below (also accessible from GitHub). Here is the screenshot of 0 A.D (Alpha 24b release) using Auto-Queue mod. The button is accessible in middle panel at the bottom (command section, beside delete and rally point button).

When the button is toggled on, units in queue will be indefinitely looped. It doesn't work with technologies as they are one time only. 

I know that auto-queue is generally considered as a rather controversial feature in RTS, as it is reducing micro but also can be dangerous if left unattended. I personally think that 0 A.D. vision is to reduce repetitive actions, so this feature is a must. What do you think about adding auto-queuing in 0 A.D?

0AD-Auto-Queue.zip

[Langbart]

22 minutes ago, azayrahmad said:

I have searched through the forum in case this topic has been discussed before

Cool, I like the extra button. Working well.

I know @nani has integrated something like that in its AutoCiv mod. In this video, titled 0AD Mods - AutoCiv Game Enhancer @1min53sec (4/Sep/20), you can see the feature in action.

[seeh]

22 minutes ago, Langbart said:

Cool, I like the extra button. Working well.

I know @nani has integrated something like that in its AutoCiv mod. In this video, titled 0AD Mods - AutoCiv Game Enhancer @1min53sec (4/Sep/20), you can see the feature in action.

i checked tht difference to autoTrain (nani): https://youtu.be/MLF2I6e_o2I

functionality seems the same for autoTrain u use hotkeys and here you use pretty icon. maybe use both together. i use autoTrain like so: https://github.com/sl5net/0ad_autociv_tips_trick_help_collections/blob/master/user.cfg-versions_only-the-middle-of-it/seeh/user.cfg#L55

Edited April 14, 2021 by seeh

[azayrahmad]

Darn it I knew I must not be the only one trying to implement this feature here. I searched for 'queue' and 'auto queue' in this forum and found nothing relevant. 

To answer @seeh's question, yes it is the exact same functionally. The only difference beside the name is that autociv uses hotkey and my proposed mod uses button.

I think I'm going to add hotkey to my mod.

[seeh]

26 minutes ago, azayrahmad said:

Darn it I knew I must not be the only one trying to implement this feature here. I searched for 'queue' and 'auto queue' in this forum and found nothing relevant. 

To answer @seeh's question, yes it is the exact same functionally. The only difference beside the name is that autociv uses hotkey and my proposed mod uses button.

I think I'm going to add hotkey to my mod.

i recommend do this optional. may you could add a feature then we will may use both moods. what about automatically restart if resources (wood, food) i available again (prob difficult? ==> https://wildfiregames.com/forum/topic/28753-autociv-mod-0ad-enhancer/?do=findComment&comment=419896 ) and/or also helpful a global warning message when it stops somewhere

 

Edited April 14, 2021 by seeh

[Lion.Kanzen]

Nice.

[maroder]

It would be good if this is added to the main game. Then there would be no discussion if it is "cheating" using a mod that includes this feature. An extension could be to automatically adjust the auto training batch size to get even more efficient training times.

[Stan`]

You'd have to convince everyone it's not cheating in the first place  

[maroder]

I mean it is only cheating if it gives an unfair advantage to one player. If everybody can use it I hope this would not be a problem The benefits of reducing micro and not having to click on the buildings every few seconds is imo way to great.

[Stan`]

You could also see it the other way as it minimize the micro skills. I personally don't have much opinion on the matter.

[Langbart]

35 minutes ago, maroder said:

It would be good if this is added to the main game. Then there would be no discussion if it is "cheating" using a mod that includes this feature. An extension could be to automatically adjust the auto training batch size to get even more efficient training times.

@azayrahmad will you create a patch for it? https://code.wildfiregames.com/

[Freagarach]

Or better yet, update my outdated and ill-functioning patch: https://code.wildfiregames.com/D2658?

[maroder]

16 minutes ago, Stan` said:

You could also see it the other way as it minimize the micro skills.

True, but to me it seems like that would only bother a small amount of the top players. If your micro skill are only average (which I guess should be true for most players ) and there are often moments in the game where you forget to produce more units, this feature can add more fun / reduce the unnecessary stress. Especially when trying to use the corrals.

Also, efficiently using the batch size to your advantage does still provide a reward for micro-skilled player who like to do it manually.

[maroder]

@Freagarach

Quote

With D2657, it would become possible to let forests grow (autoproduce trees by trees).

that would be really nice

[Auron24015]

1 hour ago, maroder said:

I mean it is only cheating if it gives an unfair advantage to one player. If everybody can use it I hope this would not be a problem The benefits of reducing micro and not having to click on the buildings every few seconds is imo way to great.

If it's cheating for a player to do it.. what about the AI? They do this without the added feature.
I mean, AI needs certain advantages to be given an edge to superior human decision and the like, but still, they are cheating without the buffs they are given on hard/veryhard

Edited April 14, 2021 by Auron24015

[azayrahmad]

1 hour ago, Langbart said:

@azayrahmad will you create a patch for it? https://code.wildfiregames.com/

I never did it before, but I'm going to try.

1 hour ago, Freagarach said:

Or better yet, update my outdated and ill-functioning patch: https://code.wildfiregames.com/D2658?

I think this patch has different purpose than my proposed mod, perhaps I'll try combining it both in another patch.

[Langbart]

Just now, azayrahmad said:

I never did it before, but I'm going to try.

1. Reading the wiki/Phabricator article helped me and it also taught me how to use Arcanist to upload my patch. 
2. You would need someone to review your patch, here is a quote from a former developer describing the situation:

Quote

@elexis (8/Okt/17) wrote at patch D889:

There are hundreds of patches disregarded in the review queue and the number increases steadily since 0AD source was published - even with multiple developers having exclusively worked more than full time on the review queue for years. [...]
The only thing that gets a patch committed is a team member that stops working on his own feature to review something. That often means repeated begging.

PS: Wiki doesn't seem to work properly at the moment, archive.org might be a temporary solution. Also I can't review your patch, I'm just a player/ tester and someone who learns JavaScript by modding the game. I mostly just test patches  for @wraitii or @Freagarach and write my results in Phabricator.

[Freagarach]

I try to prioritise community patches in my Review Queue.

If you have trouble settings things up, feel free to ask! (Easier on IRC: #0ad-dev.)

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Batch Training was introduced to minimize micro (a train time incentive is used to encourage its use as well). Isn't this a competing feature?

[azayrahmad]

On 15/4/2021 at 1:03 AM, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Batch Training was introduced to minimize micro (a train time incentive is used to encourage its use as well). Isn't this a competing feature?

I'd argue that they are complimenting each other. Batch training has gameplay impact though, while auto queue simply let you focus on other things beside 'always creating citizen' micro. 

[Stan`]

31 minutes ago, azayrahmad said:

Batch training has gameplay impact though, while auto queue simply let you focus on other things beside 'always creating citizen' micro. 

I don't see how the latter doesn't have a gameplay impact?

[azayrahmad]

1 hour ago, Stan` said:

don't see how the latter doesn't have a gameplay impact?

I'm sorry that came out wrong. I mean different gameplay impact. Batch training is not so much automation as it is also incentivizing bulk purchase. Therefore both can exist together. 

[Stan`]

Ah sure  

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

I don't mind having auto-queue, but keep in mind that it was introduced once, and then abandoned for almost 20 years now for some reason.  

Could make it a game setup option.  

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

29 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Could make it a game setup option.  

A setup option seems a bit much for me personally when it is just an automation feature.  When Age of Empires II DE came out with multi-queue and infinite reseeding, there was a degree of push-back.  Honestly this is a quality-of-life option that should make the game less micro-intensive, one core value that 0 A.D. aspired for.