Introducing the Official community mod for 0 A.D. Empires Ascendant

[chrstgtr]

1 minute ago, Fabius said:

Centurions are supposed to be highly proficient individuals so combat proficiency in excess of a champion is a good bar to set I would say.

Yeah, but isn't that the point of al the champions? Champions were the best of the best for all of these extremely powerful civs that excelled in war. 

[Fabius]

3 minutes ago, chrstgtr said:

Yeah, but isn't that the point of al the champions? Champions were the best of the best for all of these extremely powerful civs that excelled in war. 

Hmmm, yes that is a fair point.

[Kampot]

Still there is no easy way to see what are current changes, why this is not available in-game via menu?

Please make it priority or people got confused with so many releases and not utilize all changes. Even looking for them here or some git or whatever is so diffucult. 

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

6 hours ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

@wowgetoffyourcellphone thanks for adding these icons to the development version. Should I change the names of the .png files currently used in the branch to the ones you renamed in the source files? I am worried that the discrepancy could be very confusing if/when the mod should be incorporated into the main game.

Yeah.

[Stan`]

@real_tabasco_sauce Should the poll be updated? What should we do with the previous results? Feature freeze is in a month in theory.

[alre]

2 hours ago, Stan` said:

@real_tabasco_sauce Should the poll be updated? What should we do with the previous results? Feature freeze is in a month in theory.

what about practice?

 

how does everybody feel about changes to cc? I think we could take it a lot further. We haven't seen big changes to the meta in this regard.

[Fabius]

3 hours ago, Stan` said:

@real_tabasco_sauce Should the poll be updated? What should we do with the previous results? Feature freeze is in a month in theory.

well those results are for the previous version which is now released, so It seems reasonable that they get replaced with a new poll regarding features for the next version. Perhaps we need a feature freeze date ourselves and then discuss what all we are going to put on the new list and then post it for voting. Something like that. Otherwise we will all just keep coming up with new ideas lol 

[hyperion]

15 hours ago, alre said:

I think this is also true for acceleration, which could also possibly go away. I don't like the idea of having technologies, by their own description, "increase spead and acceleration". Just say it gets faster.

Acceleration I'd say should be an artist only property, make things looking and feeling good is the only legitimate purpose in my book.

[hyperion]

10 minutes ago, Fabius said:

Perhaps we need a feature freeze date ourselves and then discuss what all we are going to put on the new list and then post it for voting. Something like that. Otherwise we will all just keep coming up with new ideas lol

And only implement the top 5 changes in 0ad proper, so we don't end up changing everything every other release.

[Fabius]

1 hour ago, hyperion said:

And only implement the top 5 changes in 0ad proper, so we don't end up changing everything every other release.

Only taking 5 changes is a bit tight fisted, may as well keep with the community mod then.

Frankly the simple solution is to have one big poll and ask the player base what they want included in the Main AD game from the community mod. Then you don't have to worry.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

@Stan` I'd like to make a few changes to the more recent merge requests (change the names of icons in unit_upgrades) (adjust the centurions a bit as per above comments). I think I should also improve the descriptions on my merge requests to better explain them to voters.

After that, we could update the polls here with the new merge requests and begin voting.

I think while players are using the next version of the community mod over the month, devs could start updating SVN with some of the community mod changes and whatever bug fixes are necessary.

Around feature freeze time, balancers should have a good idea of how to balance the mod content.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

3 hours ago, alre said:

how does everybody feel about changes to cc? I think we could take it a lot further. We haven't seen big changes to the meta in this regard.

Not really a meta shift in TGs, but its overall more helpful. I do see them used more often.

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

@chrstgtr I think a good way to do it would be mixing in some healers, and training swordsmen already rank 2 from the roman army camp. I think it is great because it encourages using the CS swordsmen as damage dealing units rather than meatshield.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

@chrstgtr @Fabius My thoughts on the centurions are that the rank three swordsman is more easily obtained by training using the army camp (rank 2 already). Also, once you have one centurion, the other units nearby will also rank up more rapidly (due to promotion bonus) making it easier to get another centurion. 

The limit of 8 should avoid computational worries, also the auras are non-stacking.

I think it would be better to only affect melee damage, as the roman skirms could get way too strong if there is also a hero. I will also bring their damage back down to 11.

The idea is that these units are "officers" for their army (hence the auras), so it makes sense they should be limited to 8. Since they are quite strong, I would like them to be a little difficult to get, but if they are too obscure in practice, maybe I can expand the upgrade to veteran swordsman too. Maybe spearmen too?

Edited December 6, 2022 by real_tabasco_sauce

[real_tabasco_sauce]

7 hours ago, Kampot said:

Still there is no easy way to see what are current changes, why this is not available in-game via menu?

Please make it priority or people got confused with so many releases and not utilize all changes. Even looking for them here or some git or whatever is so diffucult. 

@Stan` maybe the best approach is to add the changelog I posted earlier to the original topic. I will make a new one for the next version.

[Fabius]

23 minutes ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

@chrstgtr @Fabius My thoughts on the centurions are that the rank three swordsman is more easily obtained by training using the army camp (rank 2 already). Also, once you have one centurion, the other units nearby will also rank up more rapidly (due to promotion bonus) making it easier to get another centurion. 

The limit of 8 should avoid computational worries, also the auras are non-stacking.

I think it would be better to only affect melee damage, as the roman skirms could get way too strong if there is also a hero. I will also bring their damage back down to 11.

The idea is that these units are "officers" for their army (hence the auras), so it makes sense they should be limited to 8. Since they are quite strong, I would like them to be a little difficult to get, but if they are too obscure in practice, maybe I can expand the upgrade to veteran swordsman too. Maybe spearmen too?

A Triari centurion would be awesome. As you say we do get second rank infantry from the army camp which speeds up the process considerably. One could then stick some in a barracks for 2 minutes and you are sorted. Here is an idea though, if you garrison a centurion in a barracks then the XP trickle is increased to show that the centurion is drilling the men to be better lol.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

For cavalry, I am thinking the hp decrease alone should suffice. Might not be necessary to nerf speed.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

40 minutes ago, Fabius said:

A Triari centurion would be awesome.

well I was thinking to just give spearmen a path to centurion as well. I would avoid adding more units.

 

[Fabius]

9 minutes ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

well I was thinking to just give spearmen a path to centurion as well. I would avoid adding more units.

 

Ok, fair point. I think then keeping it to Hastati will be enough.

[chrstgtr]

2 hours ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

@chrstgtr @Fabius My thoughts on the centurions are that the rank three swordsman is more easily obtained by training using the army camp (rank 2 already). Also, once you have one centurion, the other units nearby will also rank up more rapidly (due to promotion bonus) making it easier to get another centurion. 

The limit of 8 should avoid computational worries, also the auras are non-stacking.

I think it would be better to only affect melee damage, as the roman skirms could get way too strong if there is also a hero. I will also bring their damage back down to 11.

The idea is that these units are "officers" for their army (hence the auras), so it makes sense they should be limited to 8. Since they are quite strong, I would like them to be a little difficult to get, but if they are too obscure in practice, maybe I can expand the upgrade to veteran swordsman too. Maybe spearmen too?

I like the idea a lot, I just question whether it ever really gets used. Rank 3 units are rare, especially for melee units. 

[real_tabasco_sauce]

10 minutes ago, chrstgtr said:

I like the idea a lot, I just question whether it ever really gets used. Rank 3 units are rare, especially for melee units. 

I went ahead and allowed spearmen to also access centurion rank. Also, since these units may be trained at rank 2 (via army camp now in phase 2 as well), it should be easier to get them. Also, since centurions make it easier to rank up, they can snowball a little.

Also, I adjusted it so the damage aura only affects melee units, while the promotion effect applies to all soldiers.

Edited December 6, 2022 by real_tabasco_sauce

[alre]

it would be nice if roman hastati were more survivable and oriented to ranking. if you think about roman doctrine of war, a lot of it revolved around keeping their men alive. contrary to most of their relatives, ordered retreat was pretty important to romans.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

8 minutes ago, alre said:

it would be nice if roman hastati were more survivable and oriented to ranking. if you think about roman doctrine of war, a lot of it revolved around keeping their men alive. contrary to most of their relatives, ordered retreat was pretty important to romans.

well centurions in part accomplish this only for rome, since you would want to retreat elite soldiers to heal some and to complete their 12 second upgrade to centurions. Once you have a centurion, the whole army (30m aura) is oriented towards ranking and promotion.

Edited December 6, 2022 by real_tabasco_sauce

[alre]

38 minutes ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

well centurions in part accomplish this only for rome, since you would want to retreat elite soldiers to heal some and to complete their 12 second upgrade to centurions. Once you have a centurion, the whole army (30m aura) is oriented towards ranking and promotion.

I was adding to that. ranking is one thing, survivability is another.

[real_tabasco_sauce]

@wowgetoffyourcellphone could you perhaps update "heavy_shot.png" to "lead_shot.png"?

I like the improved contrast and metallic look of this one:

Also, "cavalry_heavy_draw.png" is yet to be added i think:

Lastly, "sword_handguard.png":

 

Edited December 6, 2022 by real_tabasco_sauce