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@Yekaterina

Where can I check which names we already have? (I don't want to spam this thread with already known names) Thank you!

Well, I just start with the Seleucids, and we can remove what we already have.

  • Seleucus I Nicator (/səˈljuːkəs naɪˈkeɪtər/; c. 358 BC – September 281 BC; Ancient Greek: Σέλευκος Νικάτωρ, romanized: Séleukos Nikátōr, lit. 'Seleucus the Victor')
  • Antiochus I Soter (Greek: Ἀντίοχος ὁ Σωτήρ, Antíochos ho Sōtér; "Antiochus the Saviour"; c. 324/3 – 2 June 261 BC)
  • Antiochus II Theos (Greek: Ἀντίοχος Β΄ ὁ Θεός, Antíochos II ho Theós; 286 – July 246 BC)
  • Seleucus II Callinicus Pogon (Greek: Σέλευκος Β΄ ὁ Καλλίνικος ὁ Πώγων; Kallinikos means "beautifully triumphant"; Pogon means "the Beard"; July/August 265 BC – December 225 BC)
  • Antiochus III the Great /ænˈtaɪəkəs/ (Greek: Ἀντίoχoς Μέγας; c. 241 – 3 July 187 BC, ruled April/June 222 – 3 July 187 BC)

Oh, you might find these nice overviews quite useful:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Syrian_monarchs#Seleucid_dynasty

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seleucid_Empire#Family_tree_of_Seleucids

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Seleucid_rulers

Sorry if this is shortfalling your expecations/standards for 0 A.D. I am no historian and therefore rely on the a/mentioned sources. Maybe experts here have better hints.

Edited by Ceres
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Mardonius is a notable general who is not included in the Persian list.  Cyrus the Younger is also not represented.  Tissaphernes, a prominent satrap could also be a leader.

At the moment Persia basically just uses monarchs as leaders.  Satraps, princes, and generals would also be reasonable candidates.  I have little to say for the Seleucid and Maurya Empires unfortunately.

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How shall we procees about the Seleucids? Shall I copy all names from the links posted before and filter out what we already have in the game? Shall there then follow a poll, or you do you guys usually take decisions about this? (sorry about my ignorance how things like this work, but I am very willing to learn)

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2 minutes ago, Yekaterina said:

Perhaps we don't have to use all noble names, regular names are also representative of the Ai's nationality.

I think it would be nicer to have names with historic relevance; not a 'Peter Smith' or sth like that to lead the Britons. :P

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Just now, Gurken Khan said:

I think it would be nicer to have names with historic relevance; not a 'Peter Smith' or sth like that to lead the Britons. :P

Of course not peter smith, but any celtic name should be fine, like Bridget, Avalon, Aisling, Gwyneth etc

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we can include someone from the gens Marcia?

 

Why? Because my name comes from that gens Marcio from Marcius.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcia_gens

The gens Marcia, occasionally written Martia, was one of the oldest and noblest houses at ancient Rome. They claimed descent from the second and fourth Roman Kings, and the first of the Marcii appearing in the history of the Republic would seem to have been patrician; but all of the families of the Marcii known in the later Republic were plebeian. The first to obtain the consulship was Gaius Marcius Rutilus in 357 BC, only a few years after the passage of the lex Licinia Sextia opened this office to the plebeians.

 

After this family, the next cognomen of the Marcii was Philippus, a Greek name, which first appears as the surname of Quintus Marcius, the consul of 281 BC; but this may anticipate the adoption of the name by his descendant, for a certain Lucius Marcius of this family is said to have had some connection with Philip V of Macedon; his son, Quintus Marcius Philippus, was consul in 186 BC, and it may therefore have been Lucius who was the first to obtain the cognomen. The initial cognomen of the family may have been Tremulus, since the filiations given in the Fasti link Quintus Marcius Tremulus, consul in 306, and his probable son Quintus Marcius Philippus, consul in 281. Philippus means "lover of horses", and the name had for centuries been associated with the Macedonian kings; Philip II was the father of Alexander the Great. So wide was the fame of this dynasty, that it is not entirely impossible that the name had reached Rome at an earlier date. The Philippi were proud of this association since Lucius Marcius Philippus, the consul of 91, even put the portrait of Philip V of Macedon on the denarii he minted.

 

Some members.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucius_Marcius_Philippus_(consul_91_BC)

 

First Plebian dictator

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaius_Marcius_Rutilus

Consul

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucius_Marcius_Censorinus_(consul_149_BC)

consul in 149 BC, the year of the Third Punic War. He was given command of the Roman fleet, and together with his colleague, Manius Manilius, laid siege to the city; but Marcius had to return to Rome to hold elections for the following year. He was censor in 147

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucius_Marcius_Censorinus_(consul_39_BC)

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25 minutes ago, Yekaterina said:

Of course not peter smith, but any celtic name should be fine, like Bridget, Avalon, Aisling, Gwyneth etc

Yeah, I was too lazy to look up Celtic Names. But when we have persons like Boudica, Dubnovellaunus, Tincomarus, Cartimandua, Verica, Cassivellaunus... I think it's better to take those than some generic Bridget or Gwyneth (or were there historical influential people with those names?).

 

37 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

we can include someone from the gens Marcia?

Sounds like they had some important family members, so why not?

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15 hours ago, Ceres said:

How shall we procees about the Seleucids? Shall I copy all names from the links posted before and filter out what we already have in the game? Shall there then follow a poll, or you do you guys usually take decisions about this? (sorry about my ignorance how things like this work, but I am very willing to learn)

Ok, I will work on the Seleucids and provide a list of names as a proposal. As I lack the historic background, I would like to stick to the names from the available sources, even if they all belong to kings (if this is acceptable for the moment). It will take until next week, though, as I don't have my laptop with me, and doing this on the mobile is (for my eyes ;)) a bit too tiring.

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Seleucid AINames from current (s0600204) sele.json:

		"Seleucus I Nicator",
		"Antiochus I Soter",
		"Antiochus II Theos",
		"Seleucus II Callinicus",
		"Seleucus III Ceraunus",
		"Antiochus III Megas",
		"Seleucus IV Philopator",
		"Antiochus IV Epiphanes",
		"Antiochus V Eupator",
		"Demetrius I Soter",
		"Alexander I Balas",
		"Demetrius II Nicator",
		"Antiochus VI Dionysus",
		"Diodotus Tryphon",
		"Antiochus VII Sidetes",
		"Demetrius II Nicator",
		"Alexander II Zabinas",
		"Cleopatra Thea",
		"Seleucus V Philometor",
		"Antiochus VIII Grypus",
		"Antiochus IX Cyzicenus",
		"Seleucus VI Epiphanes",
		"Antiochus X Eusebes",
		"Demetrius III Eucaerus",
		"Antiochus XI Epiphanes",
		"Philip I Philadelphus",
		"Antiochus XII Dionysus",
		"Seleucus VII Kybiosaktes",
		"Antiochus XIII Asiaticus",
		"Philip II Philoromaeus"

After going through various sources, I have only identified this one from the dynasty not yet included (if I am correct - please check):

Achaeus the Elder

 

Then there are the so-called frataraka, but I am not sure if they should be considered under the Seleucids or rather under the Persians (but the further names below are not included in pers.json). According to the information at Wikipedia, the frataraka were subject to the Seleucid Empire, so I would assume we might consider adding them to the Seleucid AINames.

Baydad (also spelled Bagdates), was a dynast (frataraka) of Persis from 164 to 146 BC.[1][2]

Background (also from Wikipedia):

Quote

Since the end of the 3rd or the beginning of the 2nd century BCE, Persis had been ruled by local dynasts subject to the Seleucid Empire.[3] They held the ancient Persian title of frataraka ("leader, governor, forerunner"), which is also attested in the Achaemenid-era.[4]

See more names under:

Quote

Chronology of the frataraka

The traditional view of the chronology of the frataraka dynasts was originally; Baydad, Ardakhshir I, Wahbarz, Wadfradad I and Wadfradad II.[5] However, recent findings of Persis coins have led to more a likely chronology; Ardakhshir I, Wahbarz, Wadfradad I, Baydad and Wadfradad II.[5][6]

Do you think it adequate to add (all of) them to the list of Seleucid AINames? I.e.:

        "Achaeus the Elder",
        "Ardakhshir I",
        "Wahbarz",
        "Wadfradad I",
        "Baydad",
        "Wadfradad II"

 

Another thought:

Would it be "nice" (and technically possible without too much effort) to show the AINames' faces from the respective coin (if the coin images are free to use) in-game where background info is shown? I mean, when the AI has chosen its leader, maybe the coin face could be shown (like an avatar ;)). If this is a silly idea, please just ignore it. :blush:

Edited by Ceres
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Oh, good to know. Who can take him out?

Is this checked for other civs, too? I mean that names of heroes should not be used for the names of civs' (AI) leaders?

Or why could they not be used both for the leader and for a hero?

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17 minutes ago, Thorfinn the Shallow Minded said:

That leads to a bigger question by and large since a number of heroes are represented in AI names already (See Persians).  I personally don't have a problem with that.

I mean, it wouldn't be a huge deal to just remove 3 ai names per civ. They have plenty others.

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2 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I mean, it wouldn't be a huge deal to just remove 3 ai names per civ. They have plenty others.

In the case of Persia that is three out of twelve, not a small fraction.  Of course provided that other names are supplied to bring the AI names to a more acceptable number, I would have no issue with that proposal, but the immediate problem is that the game needs more, not less variety in some AI names.  

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1 hour ago, Thorfinn the Shallow Minded said:

the immediate problem is that the game needs more, not less variety in some AI names

Is that a real problem? The AI names generally mean nothing (though, I have a proposal to make them mean something, but that's a different thread).

Seems like the minimum number should probably be 8, just in case someone wants to watch 8 Persian AIs fight, as an example.

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Athenians

Spoiler

        "Cimon",
        "Xenophon",
        "Hippias",
        "Cleisthenes",
        "Thucydides",
        "Alcibiades",
        "Cleon",
        "Plato",
        "Aristotle",
        "Cleophon",
        "Thrasybulus",
        "Demosthenes",
        "Peisistratos",
        "Sophocles",
        "Isocrates",
        "Dracon"

 

Britons

Spoiler

        "Prasutagus",
        "Venutius",
        "Cogidubnus",
        "Commius",
        "Comux",
        "Adminius",
        "Dubnovellaunus",
        "Vosenius",
        "Scavo",
        "Cassivellaunus",
        "Lugotorix",
        "Togodumnus",
        "Calgacus"

 

Carthaginians

Spoiler

        "Hasdrubal Barca",
        "Hasdrubal Gisco",
        "Hanno the Elder",
        "Mago Barca",
        "Hasdrubal the Fair",
        "Hanno the Great",
        "Himilco",
        "Hampsicora",
        "Hannibal Gisco",
        "Dido",
        "Himilco Phameas",
        "Hasdrubal the Boetharch",,
        "Hamilcar the Magonid"

 

Epirotes

Spoiler

        "Alexandros",
        "Olympias",
        "Neoptolemos I",
        "Aristomachos",
        "Deidameia II",
        "Arybbas",
        "Admetus",
        "Kallidike",
        "Alkemachos",
        "Xenarchos",
        "Boiskos",
        "Khaon"

 

Gauls

Spoiler

        "Divico",
        "Ambiorix",
        "Ariovistus",
        "Asterix",
        "Acichorius",
        "Cerethrius",
        "Bolgios",
        "Deiotarus",
        "Liscus",
        "Valetiacus",
        "Viridovix",
        "Cativolcus",
        "Cingetorix"

 

Han Chinese

Spoiler

        "Liu Ying",
        "Liu Gong",
        "Liu Hong",
        "Liu Heng",
        "Liu Qi",
        "Liu Che",
        "Liu Fuling",
        "Liu He",
        "Liu Bingyi",
        "Liu Shi",
        "Liu Ao",
        "Liu Xin",
        "Liu Kan",
        "Liu Xuan",
        "Liu Xiu",
        "Liu Zhuang",
        "Liu Da",
        "Liu Zhao",
        "Liu Long",
        "Liu Hu",
        "Liu Yi",
        "Liu Bao",
        "Liu Bing",
        "Liu Zuan",
        "Liu Zhi",
        "Liu Hong",
        "Liu Bian",
        "Liu Xie",
        "Egg Shen",
        "Wang Chi",
        "Lo Pan"    

 

Iberians

Spoiler

        "Audax",
        "Ditalcus",
        "Minurus",
        "Tautalus"

 

Imperial Romans

Spoiler

        "Tiberius",
        "Claudius",
        "Nero",
        "Agrippa",
        "Galba",
        "Gela",
        "Vespasian",
        "Domitian",
        "Commodus",
        "Aurelius",
        "Decimus Meridias Maximus",
        "Lucius Verus",
        "Septimius Severus",
        "Caracalla",
        "Titus Pullo",
        "Lucius Vorennus",
        "Tacitus",
        "Pliny the Elder",
        "Pliny the Younger",
        "Agricola",
        "Josephus",
        "Pescennius Niger",
        "Cassius Dio",
        "Pertinax"

 

Kushites

Spoiler

        "Kashta",
        "Alara",
        "Pebatjma",
        "Shabaka",
        "Shebitku",
        "Qalhata",
        "Takahatenamun",
        "Tantamani",
        "Atlanersa",
        "Nasalsa",
        "Malewiebamani",
        "Harsiotef",
        "Shanakdakhete",
        "Amanishakheto"

 

Macedonians

Spoiler

        "Antipater",
        "Philip IV",
        "Lysander",
        "Lysimachus",
        "Antigonus Gonatas",
        "Demetrius Aetolicus",
        "Philip V",
        "Perseus",
        "Meleager",
        "Leonnatus",
        "Perdiccas",
        "Polyperchon",
        "Neoptolemus",
        "Cassander",
        "Black Cleitus",
        "Admetus of Macedon",
        "Eumenes",
        "Hephaestion",
        "Philotas",
        "Parmenion",
        "Antigonus Monophthalmus"

 

Mauryas

Spoiler

        "Ashokavardhan Maurya",
        "Bindusara Maurya",
        "Dasaratha Maurya",
        "Samprati Maurya",
        "Salisuka Maurya",
        "Devavarman Maurya",
        "Satadhanvan Maurya",
        "Brihadratha Maurya"

 

Persians

Spoiler

        "Bardiya",
        "Artaxshacha I",
        "Darayavahush II",
        "Darayavahush III",
        "Artaxshacha II",
        "Artaxshacha III",
        "Haxamanish",
        "Xsayarsa II",
        "Stateira",
        "Sisygambis",
        "Mardonius",
        "Raoxshana",
        "Artabazus",
        "Hydarnes",
        "Megabyzus"

 

Ptolemies

Spoiler

        "Ptolemy Philadelphus",
        "Ptolemy Epigone",
        "Ptolemy Eurgetes",
        "Ptolemy Epiphanes",
        "Ptolemy Philometor",
        "Ptolemy Eupator",
        "Ptolemy Alexander",
        "Ptolemy Neos Dionysos",
        "Ptolemy Neos Philopater",
        "Berenice Philopater",
        "Cleopatra Tryphaena",
        "Berenice Epiphaneia",
        "Cleopatra Selene",
        "Cleopatra II Philometora Soteira",
        "Arsinoe IV",
        "Arsinoe II"

 

Romans

Spoiler

        "Lucius Junius Brutus",
        "Lucius Tarquinius Collatinus",
        "Gaius Iulius Iullus",
        "Gaius Servilius Structus Ahala",
        "Publius Cornelius Rufinus",
        "Lucius Papirius Cursor",
        "Aulus Manlius Capitolinus",
        "Publius Sempronius Tuditanus",
        "Marcus Cornelius Cethegus",
        "Quintus Caecilius Metellus Pius",
        "Marcus Licinius Crassus",
        "Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus"

 

Scythians

Spoiler

        "Akrosas",
        "Anacharsis",
        "Arimaz",
        "Orix",
        "Gnur",
        "Idantemis",
        "Kanites",
        "Carthasis",
        "Kobos",
        "Lipoksai",
        "Madius",
        "Oktomasad",
        "Satrakis"

 

Seleucids

Spoiler

        "Antiochus I Soter",
        "Antiochus II Theos",
        "Seleucus II Callinicus",
        "Seleucus III Ceraunus",
        "Seleucus IV Philopator",
        "Antiochus V Eupator",
        "Demetrius I Soter",
        "Alexander I Balas",
        "Demetrius II Nicator",
        "Antiochus VI Dionysus",
        "Diodotus Tryphon",
        "Antiochus VII Sidetes",
        "Demetrius II Nicator",
        "Alexander II Zabinas",
        "Cleopatra Thea",
        "Seleucus V Philometor",
        "Antiochus VIII Grypus",
        "Antiochus IX Cyzicenus",
        "Seleucus VI Epiphanes",
        "Antiochus X Eusebes",
        "Demetrius III Eucaerus",
        "Antiochus XI Epiphanes",
        "Philip I Philadelphus",
        "Antiochus XII Dionysus",
        "Seleucus VII Kybiosaktes",
        "Antiochus XIII Asiaticus",
        "Philip II Philoromaeus",
        "Achaeus the Elder"

 

Spartans

Spoiler

        "Dienekes",
        "Agis I",
        "Agis II",
        "Agis III",
        "Agis IV",
        "Archidamus",
        "Pausanias",
        "Agesilaus",
        "Echestratus",
        "Eurycrates",
        "Eucleidas",
        "Agesipolis",
        "Pleistarchus",
        "Lycurgus",
        "Nabis",
        "Cynisca",
        "Archidamia",
        "Agesistrata",
        "Eudamidas II",
        "Demaratus"

 

Thebes

Spoiler

        "Calydnus",
        "Ogyges",
        "Cadmus",
        "Pentheus",
        "Polydorus",
        "Nycteus",
        "Lycus",
        "Labdacus",
        "Pindar"

 

Xiongnu

Spoiler

        "Màodùn",
        "Tóumàn",
        "Lǎoshàng"

 

Zapotecs

Spoiler

        "Ozomatli",
        "Huijatoo",
        "Zaachila",
        "Cosijoeza",
        "Cocijopij"

 

Edited by wowgetoffyourcellphone
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These could be names of Seleucid heroes (local dynasts in Persis, subject to the Seleucid Empire):

Ardakhshir I

Baydad

Wadfradad I

Wadfradad II

Wahbarz

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