[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

And a leopard pelt variant specifically for the Mounted hero (Harsiotef):

 

 

 

 

 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

17 hours ago, Loki1950 said:

@Sundiata welcome to the learning cliff  if it gets to slippery I think their may be a few guys that would not mind pounding in a few pitons on the cliff face for you there are literately thousands of YouTube tutorials for blender as well.

Enjoy the Choice    

Yeah, the community has been extremely helpful in many ways! And so has youtube. I'll start playing around with blender very soon  

 

@wackyserious So, that wasn't easy... lol... But I came up with some variations that were satisfying for me. If you could check if it's up to standard for you, you could use it to deck out our cavalry  

 

Variations and PNG files:

Spoiler

 

Tier one citizen cav:

 

Tier 2 citizen cav

 

tier 3 javelin cav:

 

Tier 3 spear cav:

 

Champion cav and mounted hero:

 

 

@Alexandermb Thanks again, that was really helpful! 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

21 minutes ago, Alexandermb said:

Also, @Sundiata  Horse UV.blend
 heres a blend file so you can work on textures, just drag and drop the texture on the left window

OMG, yes, thank you! So I downloaded blender... Hahaha, finally... 144mb (wow...)... I didn't know it could be that straight forward.. 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

35 minutes ago, stanislas69 said:

I can't work much today got a whole day presentation. That's the finals.

Oooh, good luck man!

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@stanislas69 could you perhaps apply the v3.0 texture to the horse so I can see if the adjustments worked? Then I can finish it and continue making simpler versions for citizen cav.

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@wackyserious, version 3.0 (should minimise some of the warping), other minor adjustments..

 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@wackyserious, or anyone who can, could you try out Kush horse texture v2.0 and give me another screenshot please?

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

19 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Some problems on the upper part of the front limbs

Thank you sooo much! I was working blind so now see how it's actually applied.. I'll make some more serious drafts very soon   

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@wackyserious, @stanislas69, could I see what this looks like on our horses? Before I take it any further...

 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

Could someone provide me with a clean texture and another texture with stuff worked in + screenshot of the 3d model horse with stuff, so I know how it turns out and can figure out what goes where on the texture? Horse textures seems complicated, but I want to give it a shot.

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@Alexandermb do you think you can come up with something for the horses, like in the above picture? Props for decorative bands around the neck, chest, sides and back of the horse.. Relatively tight fitting..

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@wackyserious Try to use this as your main reference for horses. Especially where those decorative bands are located around the neck, across it's chest, across the sides and back of the horse. For tiers, you can play around with the material of the bands (leather, bronze, silver), and the amount and shape (solid band, row of discs, row of rectangular plates). 

 

 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

20 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Thoughts?

I saw something similar in the chariot mural depiction of the Kushites which you have posted.

I like it. Those chariot murals were New Kingdom Egyptian (in Kush) though, but fabrics don't survive well, and coloured reliefs from Kush are extremely rare (Sudan is in the rain-belt, so it all just melts away after a while), So Egyptian colour references are fair-game in my opinion (can't think of anything better actually).

 

2 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

Yes, its planned have a elephant with different actors (garrisoned in the tower) . but is an featured not full implemented. similar to wall units.

Those elephant animations in general would be useful for every faction with elephants, by the way...

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@Hannibal_Barca

How about:

Hry hrp nfrw : Commander in chief of cavalry: Cavalry units +1 armor and have movement speed and vision range increased by 15/20%.

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@stanislas69, @wowgetoffyourcellphone, @wackyserious,  @Hannibal_Barca

I suggest replacing the Hero Nastasen with Harsiotef (his father) 

Originally we decided on Nastasen because he defeated an Egyptian naval invasion under Khabash, and claimed to have taken "many fine boats". This would balance a weak Kushite navy with some kind of aura. But this decision has been gnawing at me ever since.

Instead of trying to balance a given weakness (navy), we should emphasise their strength and specialities. What they were most known for... The Kushite love for horses is iconic, and Harsiotef is the best representation of Kushite cavalry might in 0AD's timeframe. He is a more sensible choice, because of his many cavalry campaigns, and he was arguably more powerful (and more known today).

The fact that the hero in question is mounted on a horse makes a cavalry speciality all the more logical, and a naval bonus all the more weird.

Written record of Harsiotef's cavalry engagements, from the Harsiotef stela:

"I sent my infantry and my cavalry against the rebels of Metete"

"I sent my army and my cavalry against the rebels of Mekhuf"

(fighting the chief of the Rehrehsa, who were attacking Meroë (Birawa))
"The chief at my side made him withdraw. He made my army and cavalry safe."

"I sent it [the army], the mutilators, men: 50, together with the cavalry of the four desert lands of Mekhty, which is in Taqotshe; and it slaughtered them"

He also fought as far North as Aswan in Egypt, which means Elephantine and Philae came under Kushite controll during his reign.

Harsiotef himself, offering to Amun of Thebes, and Amun of Napata, from the Harsiotef stela:

 

So basically this guy on a horse (with lance and stanislas' bronze skullcap), renamed as Harsiotef:

 

Full body scale armour is very appropriate for cavalry. The other Hero armour can be for Arakamani on the elephant.

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

13 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

But the liion is for a banner bearer than standard rally point flag.

Indeed.. If only we had wow's battalions, we could put something like that to use  

Anyway, scarab is good...

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

54 minutes ago, stanislas69 said:

Why do you want to make another rally point banner when there is already one in the game ?

The scarab is quite appropriate actually...

Oh, well, oops:

An actual Kushite standard from the Apedemak lion temple in Naqa. Apedemak is a god of war..

 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

Thank youuu!!!

21 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Oh man ... Tribal warfare is brutal! So gorgeous... So lethal...  Props man!

Cavalry looks beautiful! Why are some missing their halters though? The higher tier can have as many as 2 of those blue bands across their chest and one around their neck.

So yeah, those wicker shields should definitely go with those javelin dudes huh?

@wackyserious & @Lion.Kanzen , I'll make a very appropriate, and historical outline for a banner tomorrow  

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

Just now, wackyserious said:

I have to admit, I really enjoyed testing the javelin infantry with wicker shields.

It can be the other way around as well, really, it was just a suggestion... Was thinking the same thing..

 

Just now, wackyserious said:

What about head props or they general appearance (body texture) ?

I thought their semi-nakedness is quite appropriate for these tribal levies?

 

Just now, wackyserious said:

I recently changed the actor files of the cavalry units to suit your suggested appearance per tier.

You know I live for screenshots  

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Architecture revision]

14 minutes ago, LordGood said:

I'm going to take an ax to the ptolemies's architecture eventually. The white CC I imagine would be fine but with houses the risk of muddying form and function. Flat roofs should be easy enough to integrate if handled tactfully

It's completely in your hands  

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

Just now, wackyserious said:

Gameplay-wise, this would cause a problem in distinguishing units. i.e. clubman vs. javelinist (Do you have something in mind that could at least add a level of distinction between them?

Hmmm, perhaps yet another shield-type? Dinka stick fighting "shield" for javelins, the wicker one for clubmen?

 

By the way, check out these Dinka clubs...

 

13 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Lordgood recently added the Kush hairdo and ostrich feather props, I haven't tried them yet but maybe this is worth mentioning in this discussion.

Cewl! I'm curious! Just use the feathers for the archers (for distinction)

 

13 hours ago, wackyserious said:

About Arakamani (Kush_hero_elephant)

What will be his turret?

I don't know exactly, something that looks like this?

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Architecture revision]

Sundiata's selected nitpickery, part 2, houses:

@LordGood

This is not so much a nitpick, but a rather large task. The reason why I think it could be a valuable change is because it can benefit another faction as well: the Ptolemies. 

We should ideally have a flat roof variant for the common houses for the Kushites. "Egyptian" style regular housing was just as common as those vaulted Nubian houses, and often coexist, even in the same building. It would create a more organic domestic look. Currently there's an over saturation of Nubian vaults, but I like how they're used in the other structures and they're fantastic on the current houses (I actually don't want any variant to be removed), it just needs to be nuanced with the addition of some flat roofed models (like 50/50). Mixing in white textures for some of the variants would also be more historical and, add even more nuance, and help blending in a white CC better.

The reason why this would benefit the Ptolemies is that I think they could/should use the same model for their own Egyptian house variants. Unlike the current Kushite houses, the Ptolemaic ones are not very historical, and and I've read people complain about their "architecture" in the youtube comment sections, and even in some of the video's themselves. Some people also say that 0AD is an Age of Mythology clone (obviously not), but especially the Ptolemies bring up this sentiment, and I've come to understand why:

Age of Mythology

 

0AD

...

 

They're basically the same models, with minor variations and a different texture. The fact that this is not based on Ancient Egyptian housing, but rather on the stereotype of Ancient Egyptian houses (inward slanting walls??), makes it even worse.. Especially for a historical game like 0AD. 

So, I ask for:

• Flat roofed Egyptian style variants for Kushite houses to add nuance (some white and some earthy textures)
• Use the same model to replace the Egyptian variants for Ptolemaic houses (with Ptol textures of course) 

This would also be good to illustrate the common ancient Egyptian cultural substrate that runs through both Ptolemaic and Kushite architecture. Similar to how the Hellenic civs use similar type housing. They're both Nile-Valley cultures... I think Ptolemies and Kushites are more than unique enough to merit at least one shared house-variant. 

Kushite flat roofed house from Al Meragh

 

A whole lot more accurate and historical Egyptian houses as inspiration:

Spoiler

Notice how the earthy colours mix well with the white colours

 

Multi-storied apartment blocks were actually common in Ptolemaic Egypt (and Kush)

 

 

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

11 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

What else would use it? tier 1 infantry_clubman?

The clubman are those other Nuba mercs... Better to keep the same shield types for the same unit types (tribal societies tend to use specific equipment as identifying markers). So clubman gets hexagonal wicker, not round wicker..

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

10 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Will these be the same variation for the light cavalry? (cav_javelinist)

What about the Beja shields? Will they use it?

Yes and yes.

Only use the plain variation of the beja shield though, the one with metal boss is for champs.

Wicker round shield is actually an attractive possibility for lower tiers...

[===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props]

@wackyserious so citizen cavalry can be very simple. Something like this?

• tier 1: horse: Just a cloth for the rider to sit on (saddlecloth) / rider: loincloth, bare chest
• tier 2: horse: a saddlecloth and 2 leather bands running across the neck / rider: loincloth and cloth armour 
• tier 3: horse: saddlecloth and 2 or 3 leather bands running across the neck (with cloth fringes), 1 band across it's butt (no fringes) / rider: a long quilted cotton armour (only for spear cav?), perhaps even a cape. The spear/lance can have a fabric tied at the base of the speartip.

I'll discuss royal cav in dept soon.

@Alexandermb's superhero cape might actually come in handy here, for the highest tier spear cav, see reference...

Here's some references, but keep in mind these are mixed citizen cav and royal cav. Keep the fancy stuff (scale armour) for champions (I'll share illustration soon and discuss...):

Spoiler

 

These guys are all wearing capes...

 

Kushite quilted armour on a horse? My guess is yes.. It was mentioned by one of the ancient Greek writers (name slips my mind for now)

 

 

 

This is from the Nubian Christian era Makurian Kingdom in Sudan, a successor to Kush... From the Faras Cathedral

 

Modern Sudanese horsemen:

 

Somewhere else in Africa:

 

Ethiopian horse accoutrements  (easier to reference) are similar in some ways:

 

Some posts on Kushite horse accoutrements, but remember these are for royal cav.