Stan` Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 10 minutes ago, Genava55 said: I was wondering since we were talking about pigments some time ago, aren't those colors too bright ? The image saturation is not helping either. Did they have those crested helmets ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted January 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 14 minutes ago, stanislas69 said: I was wondering since we were talking about pigments some time ago, aren't those colors too bright ? The image saturation is not helping either. The pigments used by Franck Mathieu (it is one of his re-enacted Cisalpine warrior for one of his book) are totally natural. By natural, I mean based on products you can find in the nature and very little chemistry involved (heating, mixing etc.). Is it historically accurate? Maybe not. Some products, although natural, are difficult to get depending of the region, like some specific minerals. Did they were enough trade to get them? We don't have enough evidence for this yet. The colors from this re-enacted warrior is a bit exaggerated by the saturation of the numeric picture yes indeed. Moreover, the pigments are fresh and everything is in a good state, little used. It is maybe the main problem with natural pigments: their durability. In fact it is really easy to get any color from natural plants and minerals, even purple. The problem is that their color and bright doesn't stay long with the humidity. The best and overpriced pigments were the ones that stay longer. Then yes, the colors are general too bright on re-enactors. 27 minutes ago, stanislas69 said: Did they have those crested helmets ? In this case, a Cisalpine warrior, it is really possible to find this kind of crest on a Gallic warrior. There was quite a few Italic equipments found in the burials of Cisalpine Celts, even pilum. This kind of crest is also found on Celtiberian pottery. Probably they were not common on the whole continent for the Gauls. The attested typical Gallic crest are these: And very probably these kinds: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 Update: From a conversation added the first Celtic carnyx: Spoiler Added two new bosses: Spoiler 1 New spina: Spoiler More designs: Spoiler 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 Gonna be rebaking the base wooden textures because i noticed some of the shields has the center of the shield a bit further than others, so i'll be making them again by this guide ive made for them to be more precise: Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 Update: Celtic_Shields.7z Re-Baked again all the base shields, now every piece have the same center front and back texture. improved normals for bosses and spinas. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 Update: Added Two new designs: Spoiler 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDM Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 Hi, thanks for providing evidence on the iron scabbards. I feel more confident that you're right given the circumstances of not having found any leather or wood-core scabbards. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 3 hours ago, Alexandermb said: Update: Added Two new designs: Hide contents Love this, but where is the player color? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 37 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said: Love this, but where is the player color? Im not very good with 2D programs, the artist behind shields after i'll bake the base shape and props is @wackyserious thats why i'm leaving all the layers. I would like to deliver all this new brit/gaul modifications to Alpha 24 with some modification/addition on helmets like correction of meyrick helmet name. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 @Genava55 how long is the scabbard? and swords. Spoiler i'm not sure i would add more details to the scabbard since can't be properly seen from afar. but going from this wooden triangle to a properly scabbard seems like an improvement. Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 Scabbard has to be on the other side btw 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted February 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Alexandermb said: how long is the scabbard? and swords. Between fifty and sixty centimeters for the scabbard and the blade is the average in middle La Tène. The Kirkburn sword of the Britons is a sixty cm scabbard for example. Thus the one you did should be ok with a sixty cm. Late La Tène swords can reach easily 80 centimeters. Edit: I think it is not necessary to make different scabbards for the Celts. In the game, it is hard to see that much the details as you said. You can keep it like this if you want. Just move it to the right side. 5 hours ago, Alexandermb said: i'm not sure i would add more details to the scabbard since can't be properly seen from afar. No need for more details. 5 hours ago, Alexandermb said: but going from this wooden triangle to a properly scabbard seems like an improvement. Clearly yes, your model is nice. Better than I expected for this resolution. Bravo. 2 hours ago, stanislas69 said: Scabbard has to be on the other side btw Yep, he is right. Celts carry their sword on the right side. Edited February 1, 2019 by Genava55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 Move to right side, and reduced the size in base of the image posted in celtic unit textures topic: Spoiler 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 @Genava55 Should i'll proceed with Spears or leave the ones as they are? Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted February 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 4 minutes ago, Alexandermb said: Should i'll proceed with Spears or leave the ones as they are? From what I see there (a screenshoot of wackyserious), the spearhead seems correct. Is there only one? From my point of view, it is not very important, I have the feeling that most of the people won't notice a change on this aspect. If someone thinks it is good to add more variation, you can do one of the bigger spearhead or another spearhead you find interesting. From the schema you quoted or from these reconstitution: Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundiata Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Genava55 said: From my point of view, it is not very important, I have the feeling that most of the people won't notice a change on this aspect. In my opinion, the more detail the better. I can assure you that there are plenty of people who notice and revel in the details of this game. I'm one of them. The more detail an artist is willing to put into it, the better, as long as it doesn't cause too much extra lag. But computers and processors are evolving by leaps and bounds and Pyrogenesis is an ever evolving project. Some of the older models are starting to look outdated, so it's better to always strive for the highest level of detail that's currently feasible, which will help the longevity of the models, as well as the game itself. Edited February 1, 2019 by Sundiata 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 @stanislas69 Made the orles as props to reduce amount of textures needed (Yes i guess i would end making the whole shields modular at somepoint ). Spoiler i imagine shield orles would be used only by elite and champions shields. also the texture is a plain so any modder feeling like they want an orle for their shields just adjust the mesh and the uv to the shield shape and done. No more duplicate textures for shield with metal border. Files with all latest changes:Celtic_Shields.7z 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Alexandermb said: Maybe angle it back slightly (same would go for all scabbards, really)? Edited February 1, 2019 by wowgetoffyourcellphone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Alexandermb said: Files with all latest changes:Celtic_Shields.7z Forgot to change the texture names on shield_E and shield_C. 2 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said: Maybe angle it back slightly? Spoiler X = Actual scabbard, the modified is on the Left slightly modified 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandermb Posted February 3, 2019 Report Share Posted February 3, 2019 Mistletoe Headdres 1: Spoiler 1 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted February 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2019 4 hours ago, Alexandermb said: Mistletoe Headdres 1: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av93 Posted February 5, 2019 Report Share Posted February 5, 2019 While changes unit roster messes with gameplay (and this is a sensitive topic, altough we all could agree that the two handed sword champ should be changed), what we know about the unit models and textures? The teams aproves them and they will be implemented for the next alpha?@stanislas69 @Alexandermb Offtopic 1, but related to art, what about remaining placeholders for seleucids and ptolemies (arab javeliner, camel archer variations, judean slinger IRC)? Offtopic 2, but related to historicity, IMHO, Skiritai commando should be renamed to Skiritai runner (commando refers to a modern unit) (It's the way to avoid multiple short topics) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted February 6, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, av93 said: While changes unit roster messes with gameplay (and this is a sensitive topic, altough we all could agree that the two handed sword champ should be changed), what we know about the unit models and textures? Maybe it should be possible to test it first before to apply it to a new alpha. As I said, I am motivated to find solutions to enhance the gameplay. Historical accuracy is not something always opposite to the gameplay. Any way, clearly the gameplay of the Celtic factions will change significantly however it is not an issue but a necessity I think. Currently the two factions are very similar. 14 hours ago, av93 said: The teams aproves them and they will be implemented for the next alpha? How this process is performed? The approbation I mean. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- By the way, I did some description for the rosters (first page, first post). It is just a sketch for the moment, I don't know if we should add other helmets for the Britons (see Britons thread). Here it is: Gauls roster: Village Swordsman - Cingetos (generic term for warrior fighting in the front line). Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest or tunic / Cape or no cape / Long shield without shield protection Advanced => Berru or montefortino / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest or tunic / Long shield with shield boss Elite => Ciumesti or montefortino / Trousers / Cape or no cape / Leather cuirass / Long shield with shield boss and orle protection Javelin skirmisher - Bagauda (bellicose/fighter) Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest or tunic / No cape / Medium wicker shield Advanced => No helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest or tunic / Medium wooden shield without shield protection Elite => Berru or montefortino helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest or tunic / Medium wooden shield with shield boss Sword cavalry - Eporedos (cavalryman). Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest or tunic / Long shield but with shield boss Advanced => Berru or montefortino helmet / Trousers / Cape or no cape / Leather cuirass / Long shield with shield boss and orle protection Elite => Port, Alesia or Boé helmet / Trousers / Cape or no cape / Chain mail or Leather cuirass / Long shield with shield boss and orle protection Town Champion naked warrior (spearman) - Bariogaisatos (furious spearman). Fast and scary for fresh recruit (bonus against basic version of units ?) General => Ciumesti or montefortino helmet / Naked / Cape or no cape / Medium or long shield with shield boss Spearman - Ambactos (who-is-around, attested word from Caesar for Gallic retinue and clients). Basic => No helmet but leather or textile cap / Trousers / Tunic / No cape / Long shield without shield protection Advanced => No helmet but leather or textile cap / Trousers / Tunic / No cape / Long shield with shield boss Elite => Alesia or Port helmet / Trousers / Cape or no cape / Chain mail / Long shield with shield boss and orle protection Slinger - Selgos (hunter). Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest / No cape / No shield Advanced => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest / No cape / Small rectangular shield Elite => No helmet but leather or textile cap / Trousers / Tunic / No cape / Small rectangular shield City Champion sword horseman - Comaterecos (patrician) General => Alesia, Mihovo, Boé or Foret helmet / Trousers / Cape / Chain mail / Long shield with shield boss and orle protection Archer - Selgos (hunter) - Archers. Upgrade for the slinger! Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest / No cape / No shield Advanced => No helmet but leather or textile cap / Trousers / Tunic / No cape / No shield Elite => Port helmet / Trousers / Tunic / Cape / No shield Champion Lance cavalry - Epouanos (horse-killer). Anti-cavalry special unit. General => Need research and discuss. Need to check if we add other champions. Britons roster: Village Spearman - Catucos (combatant) Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest and body paint / No cape / Medium shield without shield protection Advanced => No helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint/ Long shield with simple shield boss Elite => Coolus or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Tunic (thick?)/ Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Javelin skirmisher - Adretos (who runs fast, attacker). Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest and body paint / No cape / Medium shield without shield protection Advanced => No helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint/ Medium shield with simple shield boss Elite => Coolus or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Tunic / Medium shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Light cavalry with javelins - Marcacos (cavalryman). Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest and body paint / No cape / Medium shield with simple shield boss Advanced => Coolus or Berru helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint/ Long shield with simple shield boss Elite => Coolus or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Tunic (thick?) / Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Town Slinger - Telmiuicos (slinger) Basic => No helmet / Trousers / Naked chest and body paint / No cape / Small shield without shield protection Advanced => No helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint/ Small shield with simple shield boss Elite => Coolus or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Tunic / Medium shield with simple shield boss Lance cavalry - Epossos (horseman, raider or "knight"). Basic => Mill Hill Headband / Trousers / Naked chest and body paint / No cape / Long shield with simple shield boss Advanced => Coolus or Berru helmet / Trousers / Cape / Tunic (thick?)/ Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Elite => Coolus or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Chain Mail / Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Swordsman - Batoros (who-hit-hard, fighter). The Caledonians are described as using longswords and small shield and the Picts are described fighting naked. Basic => No helmet / Trousers or naked / Naked chest and body paint / No cape / Small shield without shield protection Advanced => Mill Hill Headband / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint / Medium rectangular shield without shield protection Elite => Coolus or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint / Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection War-Dogs - Agrocuna (battle/bloody/killer dog) Irish Wolfhound, Scottish Deerhound, English Mastiff, Irish mastiff (breed) City Champion chariot warrior - Esseda (war chariot). The Britons use war chariots with a driver and an elite warrior, they throw javelins from it and continue the fight on foot (possibility for the unit to transport one infantryman ?) General => Berru or Meyrick helmet / Trousers / Cape / Naked chest and body paint or Tunic (thick?)/ Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Champion swordsman - Argos (battle champion, noble) General => Mill Hill Headband or Berru helmet / Trousers / Cape / Chain Mail/ Long shield with complex shield boss and orle protection Champion skirmisher infantryman - Caur (old-Irish for champion). I propose an Irish elite javelinist, with a historical irish shortsword. If the double weapons switch is implanted, it could be an interesting unit. Polyvalent. General => No helmet / Long gaelic dress / Cape / Medium rectangular shield with shield protection Edited February 6, 2019 by Genava55 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted February 6, 2019 Report Share Posted February 6, 2019 22 minutes ago, Genava55 said: How this process is performed? The approbation I mean. Do you see Leonidas pushing the Persian guy over the edge ? Just like that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted February 6, 2019 Report Share Posted February 6, 2019 Which team members care about game design and which don't (no need to build a consensus with folks who have no interest). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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