===[TASK]=== Kushite Units, Unit Textures, and Unit Props

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Body texture references for infantry and cavalry.

 

[Sundiata]

"the cobra piece on the forehead" is only for royals... Sign of divine rulership... That's Taharqa, by the way...

Edited August 13, 2017 by Sundiata

[Sundiata]

Those primitive looking, painted units should only be used for Nuba mercenaries. Meroitic urban population, which was very large ( 25 cities and towns between Maharaqqa and Napata alone, Northern half of Kush), would not have appeared like this...

The Thyreos shield featured in one of the pics, is very plausible, for at least some individual soldiers returning from Ptolemaic Egypt, or captured from Galatian mercs used by the Ptolies, but the exact reference eludes me, so it should be used sparingly, if at all.

I'm not familiar with the reference behind the shield carried by those "Kulus Bomani"

Those irregularly shaped hide-shields of the "Mistophoroi Kushitoi" are based entirely on Tuareg hide shields from West-Africa, which is wrong. Hide shields for Kushites should be oval-shaped, made of oxhide or alternatively wicker, (or both).

 

[wackyserious]

These are the Nubian shields from Aristeia mod

Is the shape fine, or does it need to be more rounder? Maybe like the Gallic oval shield used by the Thracians units?

[Sundiata]

@wackyserious Yeah, needs to be oval or round, not pointy like that. Their textures are all a bit too fantastical for my taste. I prefer to stick to what we know: elephant-, rhino-, hippo- or ox-hide or wicker- round-shields or oval shields.

New Kingdom Egyptian inspiration is also good (wooden shields covered in animal hide: cow or leopard), for infantry.

For cavalry, I'd advice round-shields though, like the shield carried by this old-school Beja warrior:

Spoiler

This hairstyle and attire is the exact reference for Beja (Blemmeye) camel-mercs, by the way. .

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Sundiata

[Lion.Kanzen]

3D model

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Looks like Egyptian-style quilted corselets are a no-go, @Sundiata?

[wackyserious]

Oval, like this one?

[Lion.Kanzen]

@Sundiata you need some kind of special symbol in the shields?

 

[Sundiata]

@wowgetoffyourcellphone "Looks like Egyptian-style quilted corselets are a no-go,",   Kushite style quilted cotton corselets should definitely be used for ranking Meroitic cavalry and infantry. Just not for Beja (Blemmye) mercenary units.

@wackyserious very nice, just scale down the leopard skin texture because it's too big like that, and replace the giraffe skin with cow-hide, like the Medjay:

Spoiler

Cow-hide shield texture should be the basic shield texture for Nubian infantry, before ranking to leopard skin.

 

If you look well, four of the Nubian, oval, cow-hide shields can be seen here on a painted chest from Tutankhamen's tomb. The more elaborate Egyptian shield design can be used for the Napatan temple-guard (axemen)

I also noticed you corrected the color of their heads, nice...

Also try to avoid the zebra skin you used in some the earlier versions. Thanks!

@Lion.Kanzen for the moment, I don't think we need shield symbols..

Edited August 14, 2017 by Sundiata

[wackyserious]

I found some cow and zebra hide (The ones below) in the base game texture folder (it uses the Thureos mesh)

Here is a comparison of the basic oval shield mesh vs. the thureos mesh (Bottom w/ texture already part of the base game)

There are two variations of the thureos mesh in the game, one that is slightly curved and one that is not.

I am wondering if we could use the slightly curved thureos mesh for the kushites?

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

I'd go with the curved thureos. It gives more depth to the shield. They need a version without the central spine though. @stanislas69, you up for that?

Edited August 15, 2017 by wowgetoffyourcellphone

[wackyserious]

Transferred the new textures to the thureos mesh.

[Stan`]

Sure thing anyone knows the same name ?

[wackyserious]

File path for the curved thureos

props/shield/ptol_thureos_curved.dae

[Stan`]

Thanks !

[Sundiata]

@wackyserious I'm really loving the work! Great job! Large oval shields like that, would have had a pole running down the middle of it, for stability purposes, so the central spine really isn't that bad..

But why the zebra hide? I've never seen any kind of reference for Kushites doing anything with zebras whatsoever... It looks more like a stereotype. Zebras never inhabited that part of Sudan, only the southern tip of South Sudan, south of the marshes, called the Sud, South of Kushite control.

The cowhide is 100% perfect! The cowhide shield is what most base level infantry would have used, and should be the standard shield.

[Stan`]

@wackyserious @wowgetoffyourcellphone Here is the thureos without metal bar. And the UV Layout in case you'd need it.

File: thureos_curved_no_metal.dae

Spoiler

 

Edited August 15, 2017 by stanislas69

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

6 hours ago, Sundiata said:

But why the zebra hide? I've never seen any kind of reference for Kushites doing anything with zebras whatsoever... It looks more like a stereotype. Zebras never inhabited that part of Sudan, only the southern tip of South Sudan, south of the marshes, called the Sud, South of Kushite control.

 

Sooooome artistic license? 

[wackyserious]

I should change it then, I saw the zebra hides in the vanilla game textures and thought that they were appropriate, since they are grouped with the cow hide texture.

[Sundiata]

I just think it's better to take that artistic licence when you really need it/don't have a choice. 

But if you guys really like it, I'm not going to oppose it. It's not ugly or anything, it looks really cool. I'm just nitpicking to get as many details right. 

 

[LordGood]

Why take artistic licenses where its unnecessary? I can understand if you don't have the full picture and need to make a leap of faith between historical sources. Even so, keeping hold of things that can be inferred from surrounding contemporary sources and the environment will keep you on the right track generally.

Romanticism and exoticism will eventually lead to the "Hollywood problem" we try to avoid here lol

^{though we could have half naked spartans and zombie ninja persian immortals}

[Stan`]

Quote

^{though we could have half naked spartans and zombie ninja persian immortals}

I support that

[Lion.Kanzen]

Min 3:12 Hollywood Kushites?

Spoiler

 

 

[Sundiata]

@Lion.Kanzen Quite literally, "Hollywood Kushites" lol...

Spoiler

If you look closely, they even gave one of the spearmen coming over the ridge, a Zulu shield... I'm sure it was zebra skin.

But to be fair, some of their soldiers would have looked a bit similar... Nuba mercs...