Civ: Scythians

[Lion.Kanzen]

3 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

And Goths will have nomadic elements too.

Hybrid.

[Lion.Kanzen]

Saka / (Wusun)

Heavy mace cavalry.

I'm not sure if it is an elite unit.

The armor has Asian influence.

Edited March 5, 2022 by Lion.Kanzen

[Ultimate Aurelian]

 

Possible material for religious buildings:

 

The Scythian Ares'' cult

Quote

Every district in each of the governments has a structure sacred to Ares; namely, a pile of bundles of sticks three eighths of a mile wide and long, but of a lesser height, on the top of which there is a flattened four-sided surface; three of its sides are sheer, but the fourth can be ascended.

Every year a hundred and fifty wagon-loads of sticks are heaped upon this; for the storms of winter always make it sink down. On this sacred pile an ancient scimitar of iron is set for each people: their image of Ares. They bring yearly sacrifice of sheep and goats and horses to this scimitar, offering to these symbols even more than they do to the other gods.

Of enemies that they take alive, they sacrifice one man in every hundred, not as they sacrifice sheep and goats, but differently. They pour wine on the men's heads and cut their throats over a bowl; then they carry the blood up on to the pile of sticks and pour it on the scimitar.

They carry the blood up above, but down below by the sacred pile they cut off all the slain men's right arms and hands and throw these into the air, and depart when they have sacrificed the rest of the victims; the arm lies where it has fallen, and the body apart from it.

 https://www.academia.edu/11582741/Scythian_sanctuaries_of_Ares_archaeological_date_and_Herodotus_testimonies_in_English_

Kremenivka sanctuary, unlike Herodotus' description it was made of stone. Possibly because of lack of wood in the area, or there was a wooden structure that did not survive.

Scythian Sauna

Quote

They make a booth by fixing in the ground three sticks inclined towards one another, and stretching around them woollen felts, which they arrange so as to fit as close as possible: inside the booth a dish is placed upon the ground, into which they put a number of red-hot stones, and then add some hemp-seed. … The Scythians, as I said, take some of this hemp-seed, and, creeping under the felt coverings, throw it upon the red-hot stones; immediately it smokes, and gives out such a vapour as no Grecian vapour-bath can exceed; the Scyths, delighted, shout for joy, and this vapour serves them instead of a water-bath; for they never by any chance wash their bodies with water

 

Kurgan stelae (Could be cult statue or part of  wonder)

[Alar1k]

Idea for fourth Scythian hero: name: Palacus/Palakus, son of Skilurus - he could be an economic/booming option

First buff could be something to boost his own troops "Supply the lines" - all Scythian citizens get +15% move speed and +15% gather rate while Palakus lives - movement speed applies to movable drop-site as well

 

Second buff - "For war and glory": -20% research time for all tech while he lives

Third buff - "Master the horse lords" - reduces the cost of cavalry by 10(or 15) %

Fourth trait - Palakus rides his war horse (insert name) when upgraded

[Ultimate Aurelian]

Maybe there could be a Indo-Scythian themed hero?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maues

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

2 hours ago, Ultimate Aurelian said:

Maybe there could be a Indo-Scythian themed hero?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maues

Potential look for him:

https://jfoliveras.artstation.com/projects/nYW3Ko

[Ultimate Aurelian]

Detail of a headdress portraying Artimpasa (or a high priestess) surrounded by priestesses. On the right there is a beardless man with a Rhyton, who might represent an Enaree.

Herodotus' description:

Quote

The Enarees, who are hermaphrodites, say that Aphrodite gave them the art of divination, which they practise by means of lime-tree bark. They cut this bark into three portions, and prophesy while they braid and unbraid these in their fingers.

 

Edited March 23, 2022 by Ultimate Aurelian

[alre]

On 20/03/2022 at 5:25 PM, Ultimate Aurelian said:

 

is this guy jerking off?

[Gurken Khan]

52 minutes ago, alre said:

is this guy jerking off?

To me it looks like he's holding a broom.

Probably would be interesting/entertaining to watch you take a Rorschach test.

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

I've recently fixed the Scythian civ on DE's git repo:

• Fixed Actors.
• Scythian Cavalry can now build structures, just like infantry can.
• Scythians start matches with Cavalry replacing Infantry, so:
  • 4 peasants
  • 2 Cavalry Archers
  • 2 Cavalry Axemen
  • 1 Cavalry Scout
  • 1 Captured Horse (Capturing Horses gives a bonus to cavalry training)
• Scythian peasants now use bows and arrows to hunt and defend themselves.

[Lion.Kanzen]

On 23/03/2022 at 8:55 AM, alre said:

is this guy jerking off?

It's looks like a guitar. ( Artistic perspective).

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Possible Forge techs

 

TOWN

Goldsmithing (Special Tech)
- Traders +25% trade profit per trip

Pair 01a
Akinakes (all melee units attack)
vs.
Fletching (all ranged units and buildings)

Pair 02a
Linen Armor (all units Hack Armor)
vs.
Wicker Shields (all units Hack Armor)

CITY

Pair 01b
Iron Hatchets (Axe units Melee Attack)
vs.
Composite Bows (Bow units Range)

Pair 02b
Scale Armor (all units Hack Armor)
vs.
Clad Shields (all units Pierce Armor)

Pair 03a
Peytral (Cavalry Hack armor)
vs.
Chamfrons (Cavalry Pierce armor)

Single 1a
Cavalry Lances (Spear Cavalry melee attack)

EMPIRE

Single 03b
Cataphract Horse Armor
- Champion and Hero Cavalry +2 hack and crush armor

Single 1b
Cavalry Pikes (Spear Cavalry melee attack; extra hack range; small splash radius)
 

[Lion.Kanzen]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarim_mummies

the features of the mummies share ancestors with the Scythians.

Not long thereafter, tribes speaking an Iranian language, whom the Greeks called Scythians, conquered the Cimmerians and in turn became lords of Ukraine. According to Herodotus, who is the principal source of information on these events, the Scyths (or at least some of them) claimed to have migrated from the Altai Mountains at the eastern extreme of the Western Steppe. This may well be so, and some modern scholars have even surmised that the barbarian invasions of China that brought the Western Zhou dynasty to an end in 771 BC may have been connected with a Scythian raid from the Altai that had occurred a generation or two before Scythian migration westward to Ukraine.

--------++

Chinese sources about the Scythians.

https://depts.washington.edu/silkroad/texts/hhshu/hou_han_shu.html

 

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I also read some customs of these people.

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https://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/article/150522-scythians-marijuana-@#$%-wars-kurgan-archaeology

Belinski asked criminologists in nearby Stavropol to analyze a black residue inside the vessels. The results came back positive for opium and cannabis, confirming a practice first reported by Herodotus. The Greek historian claimed that the Scythians used a plant to produce smoke "that no Grecian vapour-bath can surpass … transported by the vapor, [they] shout aloud."

[...]Gass thinks the scene of the old man slaying the young warriors could be a reference to the "@#$% Wars" reported by Herodotus, who wrote that Scythians spent 28 years on the warpath against neighboring Persia. When they finally returned home, the marauders found intruders in their tents—the @#$% children of the Scythians' lonely wives and their slaves. Perhaps the slaughter that ensued was deemed important enough to commemorate in solid gold.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/2500-year-old-chinese-cemetery-offers-earliest-physical-evidence-cannabis-smoking-180972410/

 

In 440 B.C., Herodotus, an ancient Greek writer popularly dubbed the “father of history,” included an account of ritualistic cannabis use in Book IV of his acclaimed Histories. Recounting the funeral ceremonies of a nomadic Eurasian civilization, the historian reports, “The Scythians, as I said, take some of this hemp-seed, and … throw it upon the red hot stones.” When the hemp began to smoke and release a vapor, the “Scyths, delighted, shout[ed] for joy.”

----

https://www.thoughtco.com/scythians-in-the-ancient-world-116905

 

We don't know where each group lived, but they lived in the area from the Danube River to Mongolia on the East-West dimension and southward to the Iranian plateau.

 

 

The name Scythians and Sacae applied to themselves was Skudat 'archer'.

Later, the Scythians were sometimes called Getae.

 

The Scythians are also divided into:

 

Sacae,

Massagetae (may mean 'strong Getae'),

Cimmerians, and

Getae.

The Appeal of the Scythians.

The Scythians are connected with a variety of customs that interest modern people, including the use of hallucinogenic drugs, fabulous gold treasures, and cannibalism [see Cannibalism in ancient myth]. They have been popular as the noble savage from the 4th century B.C. Ancient writers eulogized the Scythians as more virtuous, hardy, and chaste than their civilized contemporaries.

 

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[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Interesting idea for a Steppe Shrine:

 

Quote

The only god to which Scythians built sanctuaries was the war-god, the Scythian "Arēs," to whom a high place was made out of a pile of brushwood, of which the three sides were upright and vertical and the fourth side formed a slope on which worshippers could walk to the top of the high place, which was itself a square-shaped platform on which the god himself was ritually represented in the form of a sword placed pointing upward. The square shape of the platform might have formed a representation of Scythian religion's conceptualisation of the universe as being four-sided while the sword-idol might have been a cosmic axis which united the human and divine worlds.[41][25][5] This tall brushwood high place was a representation of the world mountain.[23] These brushwood high places could be found throughout all regions inhabited by the Scythians, and every year more brushwood was added to the high place to maintain its structure.[5]

 

[Ultimate Aurelian]

Maybe instead of cash crops steppe civs (and possibly some others like Germans) could have a sort of building where they can sell cattle and horses for currency. 

Or some sort of milk/wool mechanic.

[Ultimate Aurelian]

References for weapons and armor: https://pinterest.com/siresasa/ancient-scythian-weapons-only-historically-accurat/ https://pinterest.com/siresasa/ancient-scythian-armour-only-historically-accurate/

Various artifacts (Iconography might be useful):https://fi.pinterest.com/siresasa/scythian-antiquities/

On 04/10/2022 at 5:36 PM, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Interesting idea for a Steppe Shrine:

 

 

It would indeed be a good option for temple or even statue.

From what i can find the Ovoo is a Tengrist costume and was not really used by Scythians.

For the Huns there is only fragmentary evidence about their religion, both could potentially fit.

Seventh century accounts says the Huns on the Caucasus worshipped "T'angri Khan" .

Atilla supposedly owned the ''sword of Mars''; so possibly the Huns absorbed the Scythian/Sarmatian sword cult.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sword_of_Attila

Edited November 24, 2022 by Ultimate Aurelian

[Lopess]

On 04/10/2022 at 5:36 PM, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Interesting idea for a Steppe Shrine:

 

 

Is there any good artistic reconstruction of them?

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

3 hours ago, Lopess said:

Is there any good artistic reconstruction of them?

I've looked and I can't find anything. I think the description is pretty vivid though and rather simple to imagine. What do you think? @Obskiuras

[Obskiuras]

13 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I've looked and I can't find anything. I think the description is pretty vivid though and rather simple to imagine. What do you think? @Obskiuras

Are interesting elements to start. I have to start investigating

[Obskiuras]

I see that they lived in a type of very small tent

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

12 minutes ago, Obskiuras said:

Are interesting elements to start. I have to start investigating

This here is what we are trying to imagine, but there are no images on the internet:

 

Quote

The only god to which Scythians built sanctuaries was the war-god, the Scythian "Arēs," to whom a high place was made out of a pile of brushwood, of which the three sides were upright and vertical and the fourth side formed a slope on which worshippers could walk to the top of the high place, which was itself a square-shaped platform on which the god himself was ritually represented in the form of a sword placed pointing upward. The square shape of the platform might have formed a representation of Scythian religion's conceptualization of the universe as being four-sided while the sword-idol might have been a cosmic axis which united the human and divine worlds.[41][25][5] This tall brushwood high place was a representation of the world mountain.[23] These brushwood high places could be found throughout all regions inhabited by the Scythians, and every year more brushwood was added to the high place to maintain its structure.[5]

 

[Obskiuras]

1 minute ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

This here is what we are trying to imagine, but there are no images on the internet:

 

 

I will do the best i can, i have to investigate thoroughly. I will find something.

[Obskiuras]

Scythian line defense 339 a.c reconstruction

[Obskiuras]

Bingo!

 

Scythian tumb

 

[Obskiuras]

Scythian tower

Scythian statue of women