===[TASK]=== Crowd Sourced - Garamantians (Faction)

[Lion.Kanzen]

4 minutes ago, Lopess said:

@Lion.Kanzen

puedes ayudarnos en el emblema civ? 

Este es el emblema civil actual.

 

hay que buscar varias referencias. voy a buscar monedas.

ya voy hacerlo.

@Genava55 you are my researcher number one.

 

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

1 hour ago, Duileoga said:

Buenos días o tardes;

-Ya empecé con los edificios, no son ni bocetos, me están comentando que debo seguir ciertos patrones del juego, así como ponerle un Parapeto a la muralla .

@Genava55 @wowgetoffyourcellphone 

 

Puerta de muralla;

 

Muros de muralla;

Torres defensivas;

(estarán mucho más bonitas y exóticas cuando tengan techo de hojas de palma)

 

Actuales edificios;

 

 

¿What do you think @Sundiata?

 

 

 

 

Disculpen las molestias*

I think the walls would be covered in plaster

[Genava55]

7 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

hay que buscar varias referencias. voy a buscar monedas.

ya voy hacerlo.

@Genava55 you are my researcher number one.

Garamantian inscription with the shape of a hand:

Garamantian tombstone:

 

This is similar to a Carthaginian symbol, called the hamsa.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Genava55
forum messing with pic links...

[Duileoga]

7 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I think the walls would be covered in plaster

Good morning or afternoon;

-I took a good look at the references that Genava gave me. In them you can see a white color in the upper parts, both in the buildings, as well as in the upper part of the gate of the wall, in the margins of doors and windows. That is why the entrance to the wall has whitewashed parts.

 

Sorry for the inconveniences*

[Duileoga]

Buenos días o tardes;

-Avances en los garamantes;

@Lopess @Stan` @wowgetoffyourcellphone @Genava55

 

Edificios/Buildings

 

(I think that with the icon it is easier to distinguish)

(I have to make the icon -camel stable-)

(I have to make the icon-palmera field)

(Horse stable)

(elephant stable)

 

 

 

-We must add , orchards , Libyan camp , stockade and wooden tower , in total there are 23

_¿What do you think?

-Now I'm with the units.

 

 

 

 

Sorry for the inconveniênces*

 

 

 

 

 

-

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

@Lopess  

[Lion.Kanzen]

you have to differentiate the storehouse from the farmstead.

[Lopess]

5 hours ago, Duileoga said:

Buenos días o tardes;

-Avances en los garamantes;

@Lopess @Stan` @wowgetoffyourcellphone @Genava55

 

Edificios/Buildings

 

(I think that with the icon it is easier to distinguish)

(I have to make the icon -camel stable-)

(I have to make the icon-palmera field)

(Horse stable)

(elephant stable)

 

 

 

-We must add , orchards , Libyan camp , stockade and wooden tower , in total there are 23

_¿What do you think?

-Now I'm with the units.

 

 

 

 

Sorry for the inconveniênces*

 

 

 

 

 

-

Very good, in addition to the observations I sent you in the personal messages, can we see a cc a little more traditional for them? Maybe a palace or administrative center, I know it existed but I'm out of references now.

[Duileoga]

Buenos días o tardes;

-Avances casi finales en unidades garamantes;

 

 Unidades Garamantes (25 en total)

ifantería ligera
1.lancero-------------------------------------(¿?)
2.escaramucero-------------------------------------(¿?)
3.hondero-------------------------------------(¿?)

infantería campeona
4.Aristócrata garamante-------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax

infantería auxiliar
5.arquero libio-------------------------------------(¿?)
6.espadachín libio-------------------------------------(¿?)

caballería ligera
7.jinete espadachín-------------------------------------------------------(¿?)
8.jinete escaramucero------------------------------------------------------(¿?)
9.Biga garamante (carro con "2 caballos" y 2 hombres)----------------(¿?)

caballería campeona
10.cuádriga de guerra garamante("4 caballos "y 2 hombres)----------------(¿?)con linotorax

Camellería;
11..dromedario arquero----------------------------------------------------(¿?)
12.dromedario lancero----------------------------------------------------(¿?)

Camellería campeona
13.dromedario campeón--------------------------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax
14.dromedario arquero campeón--------------------------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax

civiles 
15.mujer-------------------------------------(¿?)
16.mercader-------------------------------------(¿?)
17.sacerdote-------------------------------------(¿?)

Unidades marítimas 
18.pesquero-------------------------------------(¿?)
19.Mercante fenicio-------------------------------------(¿?)
20.Birreme cartaginés-------------------------------------(¿?)

asedio
21. Elefante garamante(embestida)--------------------(¿?)
22.Elefante garamante(arqueros)--------------------(¿?)

héroe
23(em cuádriga).-------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax
24(em dromedario).-------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax
25.(com elefante)-------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax

 

 

Fotos;
 

1.lancero-------------------------------------(¿?)

2.escaramucero-------------------------------------(¿?)

3.hondero-------------------------------------(¿?)

4.Aristócrata garamante-------------------------------------(¿?)

(en proceso)

5.arquero libio-------------------------------------(¿?)

(no me salen bonitas ...)

6.espadachín libio-------------------------------------(¿?)

(no me salen bonitas ...)

7.jinete espadachín-------------------------------------------------------(¿?)

8.jinete escaramucero------------------------------------------------------(¿?)

9.Biga garamante (carro con "2 caballos" y 2 hombres)----------------(¿?)

10.cuádriga de guerra garamante("4 caballos "y 2 hombres)----------------(¿?)

11..dromedario arquero----------------------------------------------------(¿?)

12.dromedario lancero----------------------------------------------------(¿?)

13.dromedario campeón--------------------------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax

14.dromedario arquero campeón--------------------------------------------------------(¿?)con linotorax

15.mujer-------------------------------------(¿?)

16.mercader-------------------------------------(¿?)

(el mercader persa)

17.sacerdote-------------------------------------(¿?)

(el sacerdote kushita)

18.pesquero-------------------------------------(¿?)

(el pesquero kushita)

19.Mercante fenicio-------------------------------------(¿?)

(el mercader persa)

20.Birreme cartaginés-------------------------------------(¿?)

(El birreme cartaginés)

 

 

21. Elefante garamante(embestida)--------------------(¿?)

22.Elefante garamante(arqueros)--------------------(¿?)

 

 

 

Héroes;
23(em cuádriga).-------------------------------------(¿?)
24(em dromedario).-------------------------------------(¿?)
25.(com elefante)-------------------------------------(¿?)

-Para hacer los héroes más individuales ;

1. Dromedario con manto más largo.
2. Elefante con dos hombre y armadura de plata.
3. Carruaje con piel de leopardo.

 

 

Referencias;

 

-No encontré referencias para los elefantes , pero , como las culturas vecinas los usaban , en territorio garamante habitaba el elefante norteafricano , no encontré nada de armas de asedio , todas las facciones necesitan armas de asedio y como ustedes me dicen que debo usar más la imaginación ...este es el resultado.

 

(Aún no les puse las capas de pieles y para hacer los auxiliares libios será muy fácil con 4 elementos ptolemaicos y de kush)

 

Auxiliares libios;

 

-Usaría 2 tribus libias para los auxiliares , los " Libios" y los "Adyrmachidae".

 

 

¿Qué opinan? @wowgetoffyourcellphone @Lopess @Ultimate Aurelian @Genava55 @wackyserious @Sundiata

 

 

 

 

Disculpen las molestias*

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Those turbans are awesome and would be useful in the base game as well as mods. 

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

31 minutes ago, Duileoga said:

Auxiliares libios;

Good mercenary options.  

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

On 23/10/2022 at 1:08 PM, Duileoga said:

Perhaps these palm fronds should be dry? 

[Genava55]

Source about the chariots:

https://africanrockart.britishmuseum.org/thematic/chariots-in-the-sahara/

https://www.temehu.com/chariots.htm

https://europabarbarorum.fandom.com/wiki/Merkabim_Garamantim_(Garamantine_Chariots)

 

Herodotus, book 4:
 

Quote

 

Now, concerning the lands inhabited by Libyans, the Adyrmachidae are the people that live nearest to Egypt; they follow Egyptian customs for the most part, but dress like other Libyans. Their women wear twisted bronze ornaments on both legs; their hair is long; each catches her own lice, then bites and throws them away. [2] They are the only Libyans that do this, and who show the king all virgins that are to be married; the king then takes the virginity of whichever of these pleases him. These Adyrmachidae extend from Egypt to the harbor called Plynus. 169.

Next to them are the Giligamae, who inhabit the country to the west as far as the island of Aphrodisias; in between lies the island of Platea, which the Cyrenaeans colonized, and on the mainland is the harbor called Menelaus, and the Aziris which was a settlement of the Cyrenaeans. Here the country of silphium begins, [2] which reaches from the island of Platea to the entrance of the Syrtis. This people is like the others in its customs. 170.

The next people west of the Giligamae are the Asbystae, who live inland of Cyrene, not coming down to the coast, for that is Cyrenaean territory. These drive four-horse chariots to a greater extent than any other Libyans; it is their practice to imitate most of the Cyrenaean customs. 171.

 

Quote

At a distance of ten days' journey again from the Ammonians along the sandy ridge, there is a hill of salt like that of the Ammonians, and springs of water, where men live; this place is called Augila; it is to this that the Nasamones come to gather palm-fruit. 183.

After ten days' journey again from Augila there is yet another hill of salt and springs of water and many fruit-bearing palms, as at the other places; men live there called Garamantes, an exceedingly great nation, who sow in earth which they have laid on the salt. [2] The shortest way to the Lotus Eaters' country is from here, thirty days' journey distant. Among the Garamantes are the cattle that go backward as they graze, the reason being that their horns curve forward; [3] therefore, not being able to go forward, since the horns would stick in the ground, they walk backward grazing. Otherwise, they are like other cattle, except that their hide is thicker and harder to the touch. [4] These Garamantes go in their four-horse chariots chasing the cave-dwelling Ethiopians: for the Ethiopian cave-dwellers are swifter of foot than any men of whom tales are brought to us. They live on snakes and lizards and such-like creeping things. Their speech is like no other in the world: it is like the squeaking of bats. 184.

Another ten days' journey from the Garamantes there is again a salt hill and water, where men live called Atarantes. These are the only men whom we know who have no names; for the whole people are called Atarantes, but no man has a name of his own. [2] When the sun is high, they curse and very foully revile him, because his burning heat afflicts their people and their land. [3] After another ten days' journey there is again a hill of salt, and water, and men living there. Near to this salt is a mountain called Atlas, whose shape is slender and conical; and it is said to be so high that its heights cannot be seen, for clouds are always on them winter and summer. The people of the country call it the pillar of heaven. [4] These men get their name, which is Atlantes, from this mountain. It is said that they eat no living creature, and see no dreams in their sleep. 185.

 

Edited October 27, 2022 by Genava55

[Genava55]

4 hours ago, Duileoga said:

2.escaramucero-------------------------------------(¿?)

3.hondero-------------------------------------(¿?)

What wood are spears and javelins made of?

Edited October 27, 2022 by Genava55

[Duileoga]

40 minutes ago, Genava55 said:

What wood are spears and javelins made of?

-I do not have idea , I relied on the references:

 

 

 

Sorry for the inconveniences*

[Duileoga]

4 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Perhaps these palm fronds should be dry? 

Good morning or afternoon 

 

-They don't seem so dry to me, and buildings with freshly laid green leaves seem prettier than with dry yellowish leaves. Being green seems to me a more beautiful contrast to so much beige brick.

 

Sorry for the inconveniences*

[Lion.Kanzen]

19 minutes ago, Duileoga said:

Good morning or afternoon 

 

-They don't seem so dry to me, and buildings with freshly laid green leaves seem prettier than with dry yellowish leaves. Being green seems to me a more beautiful contrast to so much beige brick.

 

Sorry for the inconveniences*

Cuando están sacas se ven amarillas.

Y por lo general no se ven así.

 

 

 

[Ultimate Aurelian]

8 hours ago, Duileoga said:

-I do not have idea , I relied on the references:

 

 

 

Sorry for the inconveniences*

The picture on the left is from Osprey's Rome's Enemies 5- The Desert Frontier

This is what the caption says:

Quote

Garamante Saharan desert warrior, 1st century BC

This figure is almost entirely based upon a comparison of written sources with later traditional costume. He has the litham face-covering worn by many Saharan tribesmen and the skin cloak is associated with most isolated tribes. His spear with distinctive holes in the blade, was made in the Sudan, and he is otherwise armed with a sling. The huge leather shield would later be known as lamt.

 

[AIEND]

10 小时前，Duileoga 说：

早上好或下午好

 

-它们对我来说似乎并不那么干燥 ，新落下的绿叶的建筑物似乎比干枯的黄叶更漂亮。 在我看来，绿色似乎与如此多的米色砖形成了更美丽的对比。

These leaves may be green when they are first used as a roof, but it only takes a week for the plant cells in the leaves to die and the chlorophyll to disappear, turning the roof a dry yellow color.

[Genava55]

11 hours ago, Duileoga said:

-I do not have idea , I relied on the references:

 

 

 

Sorry for the inconveniences*

 

3 hours ago, Ultimate Aurelian said:

The picture on the left is from Osprey's Rome's Enemies 5- The Desert Frontier

This is what the caption says:

 

It is very probably bamboo. Which grows in the Sub-Saharan region. But I doubt it is plausible for Garamantines.

[AIEND]

32 分钟前，Genava55 说：

 

很可能是竹子。 它生长在撒哈拉以南地区。 但我怀疑这对 Garamantines 来说是否合理。

I also doubt that bamboo will be used as a weapon, not just Garamantines, but Magadha as well.

[Lion.Kanzen]

13 minutes ago, AIEND said:

I also doubt that bamboo will be used as a weapon, not just Garamantines, but Magadha as well.

why?

[Genava55]

20 minutes ago, AIEND said:

I also doubt that bamboo will be used as a weapon, not just Garamantines, but Magadha as well.

I know that some African tribes did use the bamboo for light spears and javelins, like the Zande. But a heavy spear for close-combat in a battlefield, I don't think it would be suitable.

[AIEND]

6 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

为什么？

Based on Chinese experience, military scientists of the Ming Dynasty believed that bamboo could make pike shafts, but only in humid subtropical and tropical areas, and once it reached a dry place, it was easy to become brittle and crack.
In addition, bamboo only has strength if it grows thick enough, while thicker bamboo pikes are not suitable for one-handed use.

Edited October 28, 2022 by AIEND

[AIEND]

6 小时前，Genava55 说：

我知道一些非洲部落确实使用竹子制造轻矛和标枪，比如赞德。 不过战场上近战用的重枪，我觉得不太合适。

The material characteristics of bamboo limit its use, either made of thinner bamboo can throw javelins or light spears, such weapons are often disposable, and there is no need to care too much about the strength of the pole.
Either use very thick and long bamboo to make a pike for both hands (the length of this type of bamboo pike used in China is generally more than 5 meters), but it cannot adapt to the dry environment.