Doctor Moist Posted August 18 Report Share Posted August 18 (edited) I don't get it. It has everything that a good Real Time Strategy game need. Its fun to play with friends and random people. Yet, there aren't many big youtube channels dedicated to this game. Even the subreddit has only a couple thousand members. Don't get me wrong, I love the community. They are some of the least toxic and most helpful RTS players I know. But darn it would be so much better if it was a bit more bigger. The major reason I could think of is poor marketing. I did not know that this game existed 2 months ago, the main reason being there is no advertisements or any promotions for the game. Which would make sense since the game is open source. Can we raise some money using fundraiser to promote the game. I feel like that could snowball into a wider playerbase. Edited August 18 by Doctor Moist Title spelt wrong 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 18 Report Share Posted August 18 I assume this is you as well https://www.reddit.com/r/0ad/comments/1evje50/why_is_the_0_ad_community_so_small/ Well a pain point that has been raised is the fact the game is labelled alpha, so a lot of people feel like it will not be playable or it is not worth their time. Sure we're not doing paid advertisements, but I'm not sure that would significantly increase the player base. In two years the reddit went from 2K followers to 4K, we gained a few thousand followers on every platform, save for instagram who only reached 623 followers. If you have enabled the in game feedback you'll appear in our records that show that less than a fifteenth of the players play multiplayer. We only get about 1.5k users per day. So less than 150 play mp. I don't think other games such as Widelands, SuperTuxKart, Zero K, Warzone 2100, and Bar are fairing much better than we do. We reached out to some youtubers, but most of them prefer to play age of empires. Some say the lack of official discord doesn't help. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Moist Posted August 18 Author Report Share Posted August 18 Yes that was me on reddit. 8 minutes ago, Stan` said: Sure we're not doing paid advertisements, but I'm not sure that would significantly increase the player base. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm no expert. The way I found out about games like Raid and War Thunder are solely from advertisements. And I feel like they have contributed to a major part of the games' success. Also doing ads could pull in some new enthusiastic devs too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 18 Report Share Posted August 18 2 minutes ago, Doctor Moist said: Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm no expert. The way I found out about games like Raid and War Thunder are solely from advertisements. And I feel like they have contributed to a major part of the games' success. Also doing ads could pull in some new enthusiastic devs too. How did you find out about 0 A.D.: Empires Ascendant? Maybe ads would help a bit, but there is no one in the team with such marketing experience. I'm not quite sure, where it would be the most worthwile to spend money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantha Posted August 18 Report Share Posted August 18 (edited) I'm not an expert on marketing either, but I believe the official social media accounts could and should be more active. As Stan said, the follower numbers on various platforms are actually decent. A post every few weeks or so announcing a new feature, polling the players or asking a question could help a lot. Without assigning any blame, I find this community somewhat isolated. I've seen several people say the project of 0 A.D. is simply dead and given up on. Which is obviously totally wrong, but if they aren't checking the forums or play multiplayer they actually have no way to know. This at least could be solved by writing a social media post every now and then. Just my two cents. Edited August 18 by Vantha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Moist Posted August 18 Author Report Share Posted August 18 39 minutes ago, Stan` said: How did you find out about 0 A.D.: Empires Ascendant? One of my friends used to play a lot of Age of Empires and he started searching for an alternative and eventually found this game. Then he introduced it to our friend group. It was basically just word of mouth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 18 Report Share Posted August 18 @Vantha well the biggest problem has always been sourcing posts. I don't mind posting stuff from time to time but the biggest stuff happening right now is not really user facing. All the social media managers we had struggled with getting information. There is also the fact we can't have a clear roadmap when everything depends on stars being aligned and devs being present. If someone appears spends three months making an encyclopedia that becomes the flagship feature you cannot really plan for it 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real_tabasco_sauce Posted August 18 Report Share Posted August 18 1 hour ago, Stan` said: Vantha well the biggest problem has always been sourcing posts. I don't mind posting stuff from time to time but the biggest stuff happening right now is not really user facing. All the social media managers we had struggled with getting information. @wowgetoffyourcellphone and I have been working on some player facing stuff: https://gitlab.com/real_tabasco_sauce/cimbri-refinement 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 1 hour ago, real_tabasco_sauce said: @wowgetoffyourcellphone and I have been working on some player facing stuff: https://gitlab.com/real_tabasco_sauce/cimbri-refinement If we can get some new shield textures, we could easily start marketing this on our social media accounts. 3 hours ago, Stan` said: We reached out to some youtubers, but most of them prefer to play age of empires. And sadly our most active Youtubers have gone quiet over the past year or 2. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmzerocold Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 this is only my opinion 0.ad needs 1- Readiness for steam / or similar platforms Game is still considered as Alpha , so it means there are still many things in the game that require change/add/improvment , once they (0AD team ) reach to the point that ok now we can consider game stage as Beta then they can consider it for Steam. 2- Discord official server This is something i believe would help, but for some reasons not happend yet , maybe same reasons as steam ? but i personally perfer to communite on discord platform it can create a load on Project team, but here community can help and join as moderator to support and manage discord community 3- More support from community This is a community driven project , they are not hired ( if i am not wrong ) so it means whatever they do on this project is based on Love and they need to sacrifice their personal time to do anything on this project ... here maybe if the project team where they need help ask very specific and post it then get help faster to close it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Player of 0AD Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 A major flaw of the game is the performance lag, and in multiplayer there are also network lag and the problem that you cannot load matches after a crash or a break. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 1 hour ago, dmzerocold said: Discord official server There is one Discord listed at https://linktr.ee/wildfire_games For steam ideally we'd support campaigns, better moderation tools, dedicated servers as I pointed out less lag. Ideally we'd support CJK Arabic Bengali and other languages out of the box Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmzerocold Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 6 hours ago, Player of 0AD said: A major flaw of the game is the performance lag, and in multiplayer there are also network lag and the problem that you cannot load matches after a crash or a break. True its major , 5 hours ago, Stan` said: There is one Discord listed at https://linktr.ee/wildfire_games its not official right ? what i mean is an official discord server for 0 A.D from wildfire game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 1 hour ago, dmzerocold said: its not official right ? what i mean is an official discord server for 0 A.D from wildfire game Well it depends what you mean. If you expect all the developpers to use it, it will never be official. See this thread. Else it's the biggest discord, save for the Hyrule one. And it's linked on our website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Player of 0AD Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 19 hours ago, Stan` said: I don't think other games such as Widelands, SuperTuxKart, Zero K, Warzone 2100, and Bar are fairing much better than we do. For Widelands this is a big understatement, it lets 0AD look huge and thriving. In my opinion it's much less fun to play, but at least it has some significant advantages (no problem with performance lag, saveable and loadable multiplayer matches, replays work with loaded matches....) Both projects could learn something from each other, but Widelands should learn more from 0AD than the other way around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfHassen Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 21 hours ago, Stan` said: If someone appears spends three months making an encyclopedia that becomes the flagship feature you cannot really plan for it Now hold on it's been more than 3 months... and flagship feature? You give us too much credit. Although @Vantha's new UI when finished is going to be REALLY cool. I think the naval update I heard @wowgetoffyourcellphone was working on to be more of a flagship feature. (Didn't mean for that to be a joke, the navy update if it's actually happening (I hope it will) will be cool. Talking about social media, quotes from the articles + screenshots and art would be a really cool marketing material I think, like one a day or so leading up to the alpha with the encyclopedia. (Maybe this alpha? Don't know how long the encyclopedia UI will take to be merged, but after that it won't take too long to get the roughly half of the game's articles in it.) 6 hours ago, Stan` said: Else it's the biggest discord, save for the Hyrule one. And it's linked on our website. I didn't see that on our website, did you mean the linktree? 13 hours ago, Stan` said: we'd support campaigns I'll write them if people will do the technical stuff and map design. I have an outline for a tutorial somewhere... I can help with at least one third of one of the three things we need to get done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grautvornix Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 What might give us some push is a good review articles in major magazines such as c't in Germany (sorry my perspective). I never saw any review in there. The beauty of 0AD is its historically largely accurate background, its really, really, really beautiful graphics, and a gameplay that can be either simple in SP (as I am playing), and very demanding in MP tournament style. You can play it with a mouse alone as well as with sophisticated key settings. Both can be fun. It is adaptable to your individual capability and is always fun! If it is not, change the settings, select a stronger AI, download one of the various mods, or go and join an MP. The only (small) complaint one might have is that it appears a tiny wee bit more complicated to install new maps (except for those offered via mod.io). I can only speculate why we don't have more new maps: Is it possibly map making that is too complicated? (admittedly never tried myself) Did we break compatibility too often (in the past) so older maps are not playable anymore? Is the mod.io release process to stringent? (saw quite a few maps outside mod.io) Do we have too high standards? Having played several versions of settlers before, I enjoyed MANY user-generated maps, e.g. collected by https://www.siedler-maps.de/ (in Germany at least, active since >25 years and counting). So it is possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 20 Report Share Posted August 20 12 hours ago, ShadowOfHassen said: I didn't see that on our website, did you mean the linktree? I did 12 hours ago, ShadowOfHassen said: On 19/08/2024 at 8:36 AM, Stan` said: I'll write them if people will do the technical stuff and map design. I have an outline for a tutorial somewhere... I can help with at least one third of one of the three things we need to get done. There is @SciGuy42 's campaign. But it probably needs some map improvements, fact checking etc. also I haven't checked the code but probably needs the 12 hours ago, Grautvornix said: What might give us some push is a good review articles in major magazines such as c't in Germany (sorry my perspective). I never saw any review in there. If you know people we can. I recently made an interview with the Linux Professional Institute (LPI) 12 hours ago, Grautvornix said: Is it possibly map making that is too complicated? (admittedly never tried myself) The scripting part requires filesystem and some programming knowledge (javascript) 12 hours ago, Grautvornix said: Did we break compatibility too often (in the past) so older maps are not playable anymore? Yeah we did break it at least 7 times and updating the maps requires some scripting knowledge (it can be automated and it is for the most part, but that's complicated for the average user) 12 hours ago, Grautvornix said: Is the mod.io release process to stringent? (saw quite a few maps outside mod.io) It can be since every map needs to be validated by wfg. (at each update) 12 hours ago, Grautvornix said: Having played several versions of settlers before, I enjoyed MANY user-generated maps, e.g. collected by https://www.siedler-maps.de/ (in Germany at least, active since >25 years and counting). So it is possible. Settlers 5 is one of my childhood games. It's also how I got into modding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfHassen Posted August 20 Report Share Posted August 20 2 hours ago, Stan` said: There is @SciGuy42 's campaign. But it probably needs some map improvements, fact checking etc. also I haven't checked the code but probably needs the I also think for the best campaigns we need support for all kinds objectives ie gat 800 wood etc as well as dialog and cinematic support in a very easy package. (Also basic scripting) Back to marketing I have two random and silly ideas. Idea number one could we team up with some of the other open source games and make a short of group project for advertising. idea number too which might not work could we talk to one of the Linux podcasting networks Tux digital or Jupiter broadcasting and do something with them? Also off topic is there any podcasts specifically about open source gaming? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 20 Report Share Posted August 20 14 minutes ago, ShadowOfHassen said: 3 hours ago, Stan` said: I also think for the best campaigns we need support for all kinds objectives ie gat 800 wood etc as well as dialog and cinematic support in a very easy package. (Also basic scripting) Have you played the tutorial? Cinematic support is there (not simple but all trailers are made with it) dialogue text I'm not sure. 16 minutes ago, ShadowOfHassen said: Back to marketing I have two random and silly ideas. Idea number one could we team up with some of the other open source games and make a short of group project for advertising. Most of them don't care about that. Some despise social media and FAANG + Microsoft most of them are doing that for the tech part 17 minutes ago, ShadowOfHassen said: idea number too which might not work could we talk to one of the Linux podcasting networks Tux digital or Jupiter broadcasting and do something with them? Sure podcasts are fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfHassen Posted August 20 Report Share Posted August 20 8 minutes ago, Stan` said: Have you played the tutorial? A long time ago. Probably need to do it again. 9 minutes ago, Stan` said: Sure podcasts are fun. I have no connections whatsoever with any of them but that might be a way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 20 Report Share Posted August 20 19 minutes ago, ShadowOfHassen said: A long time ago. Probably need to do it again. Point being that a few stuff is there already, and it can be expanded. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantha Posted August 20 Report Share Posted August 20 Should anything be initiated for an expanded tutorial, I am willing help with the technical side of things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeTe Posted August 21 Report Share Posted August 21 1) I heard from few sources that campaign and casual players are very big majority in RTS games, so i guess investing into campaings and singleplayer is good strat. 2) Lag is big issue of 0AD - i'd set it as super high priority although I know it's very hard. Work done so far is just awesome, 0AD is cool game, but dude that lag is really ruining everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted August 21 Report Share Posted August 21 18 hours ago, Vantha said: Should anything be initiated for an expanded tutorial, I am willing help with the technical side of things IIRC Silier started something see They are gone now so you can take over if you feel like it or start from scratch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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