Han China

[artoo]

 

13 hours ago, Dizaka said:

It doesn't sound like princesses were used as offensive units - more about strengthening already mutual bonds of others who were worthy of being strong enough to be allied.

Depending how you look at it, the marriage alliances can be part of a war strategy.

 

The princess moves to the ally, after he asks for stone, he gets a princess who sets up her tent.

I am thinking about giving her an upkeep aura in enemy territory.

 

@Stan

 

The CheckPlacementRestrictions in entity upgrade isn't a boolean? It throws errors with bool. How to use it?

http://docs.wildfiregames.com/entity-docs/trunk.html#component.Upgrade

 

 

 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by artoo

[Stan`]

59 minutes ago, artoo said:

@Stan

The CheckPlacementRestrictions in entity upgrade isn't a boolean? It throws errors with bool. How to use it?

http://docs.wildfiregames.com/entity-docs/trunk.html#component.Upgrade

Nope it just checks for the tags's presence in the XML

<Upgrade>
  <UpgradeName>
    <CheckPlacementRestrictions/>
  </UpgradeName>
</Upgrade>

<Upgrade>
  <UpgradeName>
    
  </UpgradeName>
</Upgrade>

If it's there, then it's enabled, if not then it's not.

[Dizaka]

4 hours ago, artoo said:

Depending how you look at it, the marriage alliances can be part of a war strategy.

True.  My view was that it's more about strengthening bonds with "frenemies" where frenemies are "enemies" who are too strong military wise to be considered enemies and, as such, princesses were used to make these "allies" be not just "allies" but the same kingdom.   That is, the princess was only sent to "worthy" civilizations.  In the context of 0ad I saw allies as the worthy ones.

I didn't view the princesses as being sent to any random kingdom (e.g., any old enemy) - mostly just to kingdoms that are worthy of being allies (in RL kingdoms with which a war campaign would be too expensive).

So to me, based on the Wikipedia pages, the princesses were about diplomacy with civilizations that the Han kingdom wanted to assimilate into their own.

  Anyway, amazing work and cooperation by everyone.

 

[artoo]

4 minutes ago, Dizaka said:

So to me, based on the Wikipedia pages, the princesses were about diplomacy with civilizations that the Han kingdom wanted to assimilate into their own.

Yes, I just wanted to have the princess to serve a purpose if no ally is around.

The tent could also be a princess camp, which upgrades to CC, maybe only means to expand?

 

[Dizaka]

8 minutes ago, artoo said:

The tent could also be a princess camp, which upgrades to CC, maybe only means to expand?

 

Ah that explains your perspective.  What if han couldn't build CCs directly but built "minor CCs" through the princess (especially if princess could not built on enemy territory)?  Before becoming a CC the princess could be a mobile drop-off site since people give gifts to the royalty.  The minor CCs could be upgraded to major CCs if a minor CC is destroyed.

I think Seleucids/Ptolemies may have a CC cap with unlimited minor CCs.

[artoo]

17 minutes ago, Dizaka said:

I think Seleucids/Ptolemies may have a CC cap with unlimited minor CCs.

The princess tent is a mini CC already.

 

17 minutes ago, Dizaka said:

What if han couldn't build CCs directly but built "minor CCs" through the princess (especially if princess could not built on enemy territory)?

 

I had similar thought, only starting CC maybe? The princess can only set up a tent/camp in allied or enemy territory.

 

Am it has small footprint, but could be like this, and bigger footprint, upgradable to real CC ....

Edited November 9, 2021 by artoo

[Dizaka]

I like it. Especially with the parked cart.

I'm not sure about that mini CC looking "han civilized" but I really like where it is going.  I like it especially because it replaces/could replace the traditional CC placement + build mechanic.  Makes the civ more unique (it has a lot of unique mechanics already though).

In nomad games maybe that could be the default start for han - a cart that upgrades to a CC and if you add workers to build it then it builds faster than regular CCs.

 

I think in the "East Mod" han could upgrade their main CC for bigger garrison and firepower.  If that is the case might be possible to do one or the other:

1). Once you upgrade the Han CC to big fort princesses can be upgraded to the starting CC from tents.

2).  You start with the upgraded CC and the tents can upgrade to minor CCs from beginning.

I think footprint if tent should be for bigger CC or some kind of warning provided that you won't be able to upgrade if not enough space.

Edited November 9, 2021 by Dizaka

[artoo]

6 minutes ago, Dizaka said:

In nomad games maybe that could be the default start for han - a cart that upgrades to a CC and if you add workers to build it then it builds faster than regular CCs.

Yeah, nomad would start with princess, who marries another nomad and take over.

 

I think this would have to be play tested intensively before removing the CC and fortified CC build option. See a problem with Ai eventually.

Edited November 9, 2021 by artoo

[artoo]

Like so ...

 

 

[Lion.Kanzen]

@wowgetoffyourcellphone we need your modder wisdom.

How should it look? Like Xiongnu-style military camp?

@Radiotraining

Should it be a nomadic imperial tent for a young lady?

[Radiotraining]

9 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

Should it be a nomadic imperial tent for a young lady?

yeah.. maybe just a tent (with idk.. a campfire in front, very romantic )

The camp looks too militaristic for a charming princess

Edited November 9, 2021 by Radiotraining

[Lion.Kanzen]

https://cfen.si/2014/08/06/princess-jieyou-joins-slew-of-han-dynasty-dramas-releases-trailer/

I only found a soap opera.

[Lion.Kanzen]

ideas that I found over there ...

http://news.everychina.com/wz419452/han_dynastic_diplomacy.html

https://www.chinafetching.com/princess-jieyou-and-feng-liao

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Lion.Kanzen

[artoo]

50 minutes ago, Radiotraining said:

The camp looks too militaristic for a charming princess

 

I sadly can't find a tent with  bigger footprint, probably have to customize current camp and drop the palisades around it.

Sadly, the wagon takes the spot for the romantic fire, maybe drop a bamboo tree too.

I probably shouldn't snatch a Xiongnu tent, but would be easy to adopt the royal yurt without wagon.

Edited November 9, 2021 by artoo

[artoo]

Since the princess has an escort solder, I added a second tent, so to not anger her new husband when they arrive and he only sees one tent.

 

 

[Radiotraining]

anyway .. I think I missed some steps and maybe my question is stupid but.. why the tent? why not just the princess?

I think it would visually more impactful to move an actual character than imagining her inside a tent.

[artoo]

1 minute ago, Radiotraining said:

anyway .. I think I missed some steps and maybe my question is stupid but.. why the tent? why not just the princess?

If someone make her a beautiful clothes, the catafalque could be garrisoned with her, or replaced with her. I just thought it might be too much micro?

[Radiotraining]

 

7 minutes ago, artoo said:

If someone make her a beautiful clothes, the catafalque could be garrisoned with her, or replaced with her. I just thought it might be too much micro?

Mmmh yeah a Little bit ehehehe 

I don't know if it's just for fun, but in any case better stick with one mechanic, otherwise it becomes a bit cryptic (unless it's meant to be some sort of Easter egg that you unlock with some actions) 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Radiotraining

[artoo]

2 minutes ago, Radiotraining said:

I don't know if it's just for fun, but in any case better stick with one mechanic, otherwise it becomes a bit cryptic (unless it's meant to be some sort of Easter egg that you unlock with some actions) 

The mechanics are simple, you probably missed it.

 

The Imperial Ministry produces the princess unit(catafalque).

The princess can only upgrade to a princess camp in allied or enemy territory.

The princess camp has an aura for ally and enemy each(wip), produces females and princess.

You can only have one princess until you upgrade her to camp, which let you build one new princess.

The princess camp can be upgraded to a CC if one imperial court exists and the fiefdom tech is researched.

The idea was, that this could be the only means of the Han to expand.

[Radiotraining]

Yeah.. I read a bit through the posts but I wasn't sure what was the final idea and it flows much better with this synthesis thanks, sorry for the dumb question.. that's my classic! Ahahah 

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Guys, the Princess Camp is a fantasy element that takes the civ so far removed from the other civs that you jeopardize their inclusion. 

[maroder]

1 hour ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Guys, the Princess Camp is a fantasy element that takes the civ so far removed from the other civs that you jeopardize their inclusion. 

while I like the idea and new funny mechanics in general, I have to agree. Better to keep this on a separate branch for now

[artoo]

5 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Guys, the Princess Camp is a fantasy element that takes the civ so far removed from the other civs that you jeopardize their inclusion. 

Yes and no. The camp is a means to implement alliance marriage.

If there was diplomacy options, she would take this route.

 

You can even see her now, and don't have to imagine the beauty.

I think I'll merge the princess branch, I guess the princess can put on very interesting and fun team games.

Edited November 10, 2021 by artoo

[Stan`]

1 hour ago, artoo said:

that you jeopardize their inclusion. 

The important part is this.

[Lopess]

1 hour ago, artoo said:

Yes and no. The camp is a means to implement alliance marriage.

If there was diplomacy options, she would take this route.

 

You can even see her now, and don't have to imagine the beauty.

I think I'll merge the princess branch, I guess the princess can put on very interesting and fun team games.

This camp was very good to congratulate, it reminds me how much it is possible to create new structures using only existing elements. You can create a separate mod with this mechanic, if we think about it there should be an interesting diplomatic mechanic for several civs already present in 0ad, to which in the future you can add them too.