overcorrected archers

[LetswaveaBook]

I hope to get the RC working for me next weekend.

 

I don't worry for Persians as they get archers to provoke fights and citizen skirmishers as well.

[alre]

2 hours ago, ValihrAnt said:

Camels are nowhere near to their strength in A23. They now have lower move speed, less range and less accuracy. So javelin cavalry can actually catch them now and towers can actually range them, that's quite a big difference. To make it even worse, they can't harass food without being ranged by the CC anymore too.

And the same thing about archers. How can you say that they are worse than in A23 when just about everything is better for them now? Their lowered range and accuracy are remedied by technologies and otherwise they've got more damage, more speed, skirmishers being slower and no phase up bonuses which gave extra time for opposing units with greater dps to close the distance. As I said, I'd be more worried about them still being by far the strongest ranged infantry unit.

Fair enough, I guess I couldn't remember the true infantry speed. We will eventually see if archers are still OP or severely UP as I think instead.

However, I think camels are still impossible to deal with by units with lesser range, which was the point in question. They can escape anywhere without problems in A25.

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

26 minutes ago, LetswaveaBook said:

I don't worry for Persians as they get archers to provoke fights and citizen skirmishers as well.

Well and then theres the cav :D. Yea for sure Persians will also be good.

[Freagarach]

7 hours ago, Yekaterina said:

In A25, if you just make your archers stand still in a formation, they will be mowed by javelins, cavalry or melee for sure. This even applies for players who use only archers and no melee in A24, but to a lesser extent.

However, in A25, if you make your archers dance or dodge the incoming melee units by formation change, then the enemy will be mowed by your arrows. 

1. Put archers in a close order, maybe moving them slightly

2. When the enemy melees and javelins charge in, split the formation into two equal parts and move them out of the way, opening a lane for their troops to walk into. 

3. Walk the archers sideways for 60 metres, then order the archers turn around and shoot, perhaps from 50 metres away, use melee units to keep the enemy busy, while emerging more melee from gaps in your archer formation, so that enemy javelins or melee can't reach your archers on the side. 

This is a difficult manoeuvre, but if you can pull it out successfully then it will make archers OP.

Lo and behold, the kind of stuff one wants in a Strategy game!

Edited August 6, 2021 by Freagarach
Double click.

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

To be honest, I am very exited for this Sunday :D. Since I still have not gotten the SVN build to work, this Sunday will be my first time trying it out in a real TG.

[chrstgtr]

17 hours ago, Freagarach said:

Lo and behold, the kind of stuff one wants in a Strategy game!

Agreed...formation dancing (changing formations quickly) has needed work for awhile...with that said, I won't believe the posted comment until I see it executed against a good player. 

[Dizaka]

2 hours ago, chrstgtr said:

Agreed...formation dancing (changing formations quickly) has needed work for awhile...with that said, I won't believe the posted comment until I see it executed against a good player. 

I like strategy in strategy games.  The question would be is such a strategy the equivalent of 1 hero dodging 120 slingers and being unkillable.  It appears to be the same thing, however, on a substantially smaller scale requiring more control and planning.

Also, just played Mauryas and they feel the same.  Probably still a tier 1 civ imo.  Might depend on how well skrim kill elephants.

Edited August 7, 2021 by Dizaka

[Yekaterina]

3 hours ago, chrstgtr said:

Agreed...formation dancing (changing formations quickly) has needed work for awhile...with that said, I won't believe the posted comment until I see it executed against a good player. 

Rauls used it on me and decimated my javelin cav + spearman + pikeman formation (which is normally quite invulnerable in direct confrontations with an army of similar size). Pro TGs often ban archers so it is rare to see good players using archers on each other. One of the A24 approaches is to bring 100 archers with 11 elephants and no melee. Not sure if this will work in A25. 

[Dizaka]

43 minutes ago, Yekaterina said:

One of the A24 approaches is to bring 100 archers with 11 elephants and no melee. Not sure if this will work in A25. 

This strategy only works in mins 15-18.  The earlier the more effective.  Afterwards, elephants as melee tanks/dps are not really usable due to their squishines.

Anyway, this strategy (not 100 archers, more like 50/50 mix with spear and sword) still seems valid in a25.  Moreso for Mauryas than any other civ.

Edited August 7, 2021 by Dizaka

[alre]

6 hours ago, Dizaka said:

Also, just played Mauryas and they feel the same.  Probably still a tier 1 civ imo.  Might depend on how well skrim kill elephants.

maurya had a very good economy in A24. now that's gone.

[seeh]

On 06/08/2021 at 8:09 AM, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

To be honest, I am very exited for this Sunday :D. Since I still have not gotten the SVN build to work, this Sunday will be my first time trying it out in a real TG.

Linux ? https://snapcraft.io/0ad

Edited August 7, 2021 by seeh

[Yekaterina]

1 hour ago, alre said:

maurya had a very good economy in A24. now that's gone.

War elephant and archer walkspeed are still there. It is also a 5-house civ that some players really care about. 

[alre]

point is that archer walk speed is not there anymore.

[Dizaka]

I think archer walk speed decrease would be least impactful to Mauryas b/c of worker elephants.  However, "resource walk speed" and "walk speed" should be two different attributes to prevent resource speed balancing from impacting military balancing. 

If other civs ever get 'carts' then archer civs at disadvantages ....

Edited August 7, 2021 by Dizaka