Atrik

Yes, you are probably searching for the autociv.session.minimap.expand.toggle hotkey.

Probably, you just don't like it. Yet to be witnessed a player hiding he's using progui I guess. Maybe the name of the game is to pretend 0ad online games are very serious matter or to call cheaters peoples you don't like losing against idk, I don't understand these reactions. If some people find it useful and some don't, why not make a mod and see if some of the features stands out to be worth to adapt in the main game? I guess it's great if it's tested out on some games. If you maintain it provides such a unfair advantage you cannot stand it, then ban the mod from your games, real cheaters hide game modifications anyway, and enforcing the check with a bool is simply a joke.

All assumptions from your mind ignoring the facts that we have enough games played with players using the mod, that end up with various strategy, boom speed, eco strength to see that what you fear is the fruit of your imagination alone. You guys simply extend the actual features making some action less clicky with a fantasized AI playing for you.

You think only by making assumptions, there are a lot more then building production to the 0ad economy management, and even for this part, similar skills are required in order to achieve results. Well, the skill gap is untouched. I know some players using progui that boom faster then me (or generally stronger eco), and some that boom slower (or generally weaker eco). I think the mood of a player influence his performance more the usage or not of progui. Interfaces are supposed to translate user will into actions, so for the production part, if you like how progui translates your input into actions, then it increase game experience. User Experience (UI/ UX)is the field of trying increase usability, generally by reducing clicks requited to achieve user will. I was already good at booming before using progui, most pro players using it would tell you progui trainer actually slow them down a bit, at least for the time they aren't use to manage it actively very well. So now when you say "ProGUI inherently degrades the gameplay experience", who does it apply to? It's own users? It seems unlikely anybody would have picked it up, notice no improvements, and suddenly pretend to still like it and to start using it. It's true that the trainer could help you optimize production theoretically, in practice, a 0ad game has enough variables to make it insignificant. Getting housed for 15+ sec is very common even in pro games. And impact your eco more then the 0.5 sec gained by using the trainer. It's a small enough unfair advantage. However in general because of the growing divides that this mod seems to create into a already small community, I'm thinking about terminating the project. Some people are getting harassed for using this mod it's simply ridiculous. If seemingly reasonable people like you or @wowgetoffyourcellphone deem it just a cheat comparable to real cheats then I'll do it. I'll know forever that you guys probably just had stupid biases to think the interface exactly as it was in a unrelated game from last century.

Yes, if it was on me, I would have uploaded the mod without compatibility check even on mod.io. It's technically a 100% compatible mod.

Some players could have gaming mouses with click multiplier that could be confused for autosniping. When reported to the team, it was deemed not a cheat, because of how accessible and basic are theses mouses. I don't use this, but I know this is one more thing that could provide far greater advantage then the stupid progui trainer. Well you share your thoughts, I share mine. You have options to totally disable and hide panels. Indeed I don't think worth or don't have a plan to enforce players to disable it. The version on mod.io has compatibility check witch is the best tool we have to do what you said (Even if I think this is just a way to reduce the mod's availability). Ok, let's do something dumb, if you ask me to remove progui from the downloader, I will do it now.

Thank you @seeh!

Never felt the urge to reveal enemy stats, map, or chat just because I had evidences some players do. They are also less detectable by far then using progui trainer, while providing a much greater advantage then having a enhanced queuing system. There is a lot to criticize about progui but one thing it does is to be reasonably modular, with a bunch of options I added from actual player suggestions. So you have probably 50% of the players using it, that don't even have the trainer overlay. Now if the goal is to divide people in distinct group "us vs them" as you said, I don't think this is a good thing to do.

He probably is. I used it too even in tournament matches, I didn't know it was forbidden.

I don't understand if this is a joke from @alre or not. So Piplox is just ordering a group of 3 units, while it's CC queue units with progui's autoqueue? If he used the normal autoqueue, he would also have a chance for a new batch to start producing between two orders. He don't need control groups, or anything special to do order those units. If you want to prove a player is cheating and you looked out so closely just to find this, I guess he's probably not doing anything too weird lol

@seeh I don't have this bug, It's probably not related, can you double check?

I added the option later after introducing this. Please simply patch. And theses bar will be removed by default.

Minor but useful trainer enhancements (5.10): Do not consume resources needed for a building if a player is trying to place one. Don't know why I didn't add this earlier, it was just decreasing playability, maybe vanilla auto-queue should also do this. Customize classes used by the trainer in options. Add/remove a production building class to save screen space. And also enable it for unit if you want (like Hero for Persians, Ships for Athenians)

In this match @leopard plays very well his critical role, and jimo have to hold against @freyyja! commands.txt metadata.json

Makes sens and probably good choice for balance. But since it's AOE dps, it friendly-fires right? Else my guess is that won't be a strategical unit, but one you can just spam because it's just a unit with superior stats.

Solution 1: You could add || cmpIdentity?.HasClass("Minister") at the end of the line: https://github.com/nanihadesuka/autociv/blob/master/simulation/components/AIProxy~autociv.js#L12. Solution 2: ping @nani to try to make him itchy about making this configurable as much as the awesome class selectors hotkeys. So that you could just do it from the settings as you imagined.

If you had some overkill mitigation introduced along side this stance, like what @real_tabasco_sauce is describing here: The concept of sniping would simply disappear, and be replaced with putting all the importance on making efficient/brutal engages. Battle line-like formations would finely make sens for infantry field battle. And hopefully, no formation would be the only go-to formation. Compared to the current meta where you use box formation, even when you have 0 chance of being flanked, where the goal is just to induce overkills. Reminder that this stance or even overkill mitigation won't make the battle 'autoplay' AT ALL. For instance your ranged units placement on the battle field would be really important to reach units you want to focus on, even if you toggle a attack weak stance. They won't move to attack weakest units, they'll simply attack them when they get in attack range. Witch makes you having to decide when you want to trade movement to reach weaker units, and when to not. Now, because sniping is simply a dµmb technical skill, I'll be really glad to trade it for the need of learning better tactical and strategy skills. It's true that you'll have a full sniping cycle doable under less clicks now: unit placement, and stance selection*, but it would then give room to new micro meta or ideally the introduction of new units abilities. *still make sens to attack closest units in a lot of cases: prevent melee to reach you, or to clear front-line fast and make your melees free of movement. So 'attack weak' wouldn't be a stance you'll toggle all the time, especially not with @real_tabasco_sauce unit re-balance.

If any of the current stance like: 'flee' => move away from attacker didn't exist, players feeling would also be that adding such a stance will be automation. 'attack weak' => prioritize attacking weak units in range Is a simple, and more useful stance then 'violent'.

That's right, you can even use few different small piece of software and bind sequences of clicks to a hotkey and get same result as this thread suggestion, even without a gaming mouse. That's the problem with this weak game mechanic: 'sniping'. It's just here in the first place because devs didn't thought about making a feature to change attack behavior, and now players adapted the meta and think the game was intentionally design to make you have to click 120 times as fast as possible as part of the gameplay. No, really, we need to push for the game to dish sniping all together and metas/suggestions for more interesting game mechanics will come up.

For sure, could help. It's not that bad to help the problem, but it's weird to want to avoid so badly any feature that would make sniping simply a unit behavior you can use.

Done, showing the bars is now an opt-in option in 'GUI customization'. I think I also prefer having the minimap optimizing screen space now that I'm used to having the kdr animation in the top panel instead.

Congrats you now have a way to do 5x faster sniping. Very boring however. It's not even as good as unit rebalance as a mitigation if you ask me.

Maybe here : /gui/session/session.xml#L45

I look at it that way: We want to maximize Strategic skills (or decision-bearing actions). We want to minimize Technical actions (or skills in offsetting the interface and game limitations). Sniping is just you wanting your ranged units to attack enemy ranged units but you can only do it by clicking all enemy units. You are offsetting a game limitations with a technical skill. Flanking, engage/retreat, formations, positioning of small units detachments are on the other hand what the game should be about. These are strategic skills, and it would be even more rewarding to have to choose the right one, to counter the enemy, or to play a specific battle tactic. The fact that formations choice for a engage is made irrelevant (you should go for box every time and start sniping) because of the default AI focus isn't really fun.

Agreed, but keeping battle mechanics all revolving around tricking unit AI to make and avoid overkill is simply lame. Well, it probably still is a 'technical skill'. It's definitely a trainable skill to make the right sequence of clicks and to do it very very fast. But I agree, @Dizaka, 'sniping' is actually the one thing dumbing down this game rn. And I don't know that it is any sexy for new players to come to 0ad and be good at 'sniping'. Only to some players that are used to 'sniping', is this mechanic not obviously ridiculous. You aren't going to make anyone wanting to learn 0ad showing off, the currently battle n°1 battle mechanic: sniping (aka mashing keys).