celtic reference

[Genava55]

17 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

@Alexandermb

 

 

https://www.deviantart.com/dewitteillustration/art/Reconstruction-of-North-Bersted-helmet-50BC-807452367

Edited January 20, 2020 by Genava55

[Genava55]

 

[Genava55]

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/qAmrOa

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/gJNNVG

Spoiler

I love how he used this sword belt from Axel Guttman robbery collection. It really fits nicely to a Britonnic warrior!

Edit: here is why I find this belt suits perfectly the Britonnic esthetic:

https://www.ancient-origins.net/news-history-archaeology/celtic-chariot-0011046

https://balkancelts.wordpress.com/2019/06/29/celtic-chariots-and-chariot-elements-from-wales/

Edited February 9, 2020 by Genava55

[AeternaTristitia]

Those are some very good looking materials to work on.

[Genava55]

The defense of the Ynys Môn (Anglesey)!

Tacitus account:

Quote

 

Britain was in the hands of Suetonius Paulinus, who in military knowledge and in popular favour, which allows no one to be without a rival, vied with Corbulo, and aspired to equal the glory of the recovery of Armenia by the subjugation of Rome's enemies. He therefore prepared to attack the island of Mona which had a powerful population and was a refuge for fugitives. He built flat-bottomed vessels to cope with the shallows, and uncertain depths of the sea. Thus the infantry crossed, while the cavalry followed by fording, or, where the water was deep, swam by the side of their horses.

On the shore stood the opposing army with its dense array of armed warriors, while between the ranks dashed women, in black attire like the Furies, with hair dishevelled, waving brands. All around, the Druids, lifting up their hands to heaven, and pouring forth dreadful imprecations, scared our soldiers by the unfamiliar sight, so that, as if their limbs were paralysed, they stood motionless, and exposed to wounds. Then urged by their general's appeals and mutual encouragements not to quail before a troop of frenzied women, they bore the standards onwards, smote down all resistance, and wrapped the foe in the flames of his own brands. A force was next set over the conquered, and their groves, devoted to inhuman superstitions, were destroyed.

 

The druid helmet from the illustration is based on the Aylesford bucket. 

 

[Genava55]

https://www.facebook.com/samara.parcarcheologique/

Photos:

Spoiler

 

 

[Genava55]

Edit: Meme

Spoiler

 

Edited February 21, 2020 by Genava55

[Alexandermb]

On 1/20/2020 at 2:52 PM, Lion.Kanzen said:

@Alexandermb

Need, help im lost, been studying from 5am to 1am non stop

[asterix]

On 7/23/2019 at 1:30 PM, Genava55 said:

real-life Asterix

I knew I was real back then and now.

[Genava55]

6 hours ago, Alexandermb said:

Need, help im lost, been studying from 5am to 1am non stop

Do not worry, it is not urgent. Focus on your studies.

[Genava55]

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by Genava55

[Alexandermb]

maybe a front perspective of the crest in SVG could make it easier to apply boolean (engravement on mesh) and make the crest.

[Genava55]

Edited February 25, 2020 by Genava55

[Genava55]

 

In French:

Playlist (although the titles are wrong):

https://www.dailymotion.com/playlist/x4xmn4

Légères perturbation en Centre-Gaule - le film
Unsettled outlook for Central Gaul (French with English subtitles)
https://vimeo.com/54526897

Edited February 26, 2020 by Genava55

[Genava55]

In the first video, the soundtrack from 2m56s to 4m37s comes from the artist "The Ambient Composer" and is called "The Green Tavern".

[Genava55]

On 2/8/2020 at 10:37 PM, Genava55 said:

I love how he used this sword belt from Axel Guttman robbery collection. It really fits nicely to a Britonnic warrior!

Actually, contrary to the description from the webpage of Axel Guttman robbery collection, it is not a sword-belt but a feminine belt...
 

On 2/25/2020 at 5:54 AM, Alexandermb said:

maybe a front perspective of the crest in SVG could make it easier to apply boolean (engravement on mesh) and make the crest.

I found a good view of the transversal crest

[Ultimate Aurelian]

On 3/27/2020 at 10:18 AM, Genava55 said:

Actually, contrary to the description from the webpage of Axel Guttman robbery collection, it is not a sword-belt but a feminine belt...
 

Maybe it could be used for Boudicca ?

[Ultimate Aurelian]

@Genava55 A Gallic statue of unclear date, depicting a cuirass with a distinct pattern (Bronze age holdover ? Import from Romans ?) :

https://www.ancient.eu/image/10811/warrior-of-grezan/

Edited May 13, 2020 by Ultimate Aurelian

[Genava55]

2 hours ago, Ultimate Aurelian said:

@Genava55 A Gallic statue of unclear date, depicting a cuirass with a distinct pattern (Bronze age holdover ? Import from Romans ?) :

There are several statues of this kind in Southern Gaul, close to the Mediterranean Sea. This is due to the influence of the Iberians and of the Etruscans, maybe because of the Elisyces described by Herodotus. However, they cannot be more recent than the 5th century BC, after that the La Tène culture overwhelm the region. They could be incorporated as mercenaries or regional units but that's all. This is not really Gallic, their Celtic character is not sure, this is why I don't rely a lot on the material found in Entremont and Roquepertuse that much. Those are local particularities.

https://musee-fenaille.rodezagglo.fr/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/dossier-de-presse-celtes-final-web.pdf

[Ultimate Aurelian]

7 hours ago, Genava55 said:

There are several statues of this kind in Southern Gaul, close to the Mediterranean Sea. This is due to the influence of the Iberians and of the Etruscans, maybe because of the Elisyces described by Herodotus. However, they cannot be more recent than the 5th century BC, after that the La Tène culture overwhelm the region. They could be incorporated as mercenaries or regional units but that's all. This is not really Gallic, their Celtic character is not sure, this is why I don't rely a lot on the material found in Entremont and Roquepertuse that much. Those are local particularities.

https://musee-fenaille.rodezagglo.fr/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/dossier-de-presse-celtes-final-web.pdf

The text says it was a leather cuirass with a cardiophylax rather than a solid cuirass; might be a reference for Viridomarus ?

Some examples:

Etruscans and Romans:

E

     EB Picenian warriors with leather armor:

Illyrian:

 

[Genava55]

For French speaking people, a channel with several conferences about the La Tène and Hallstatt iron ages:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCp-zXMnTNdK9A1X784NdV8A/featured?fbclid=IwAR2ykLqCg6at9WHO0iMc43b6ZPpwx-tC0DB67r7gsHeYT5HcdAxznKOhov8

 

[Genava55]

 

[Genava55]

 

[Nescio]

On 6/25/2018 at 6:39 PM, Genava55 said:

Beside the temple/sanctuary/wonder discussion, I would like to suggest a modification with the tavern. Firstly, it is very cliché and I don't see the link with a religious war fanatic. Secondly, I have a simple suggestion to change that:  creating a banquet/feasting building (the Celicnon) by lightly modifying the actual building of the gallic temple.

Feasting is a practice linked with important social, political, and economic functions. Aristocrats were probably trying to recruit and impress the others in these places.

On 8/9/2018 at 10:48 AM, Genava55 said:

What bothers me the most is the name and the idea behind. Making the tavern as a key building for the Celts is kinda a cliché about barbarians. Especially I don't see the link between "naked fanatics" and alcohol. 

On 9/22/2019 at 12:38 PM, Genava55 said:

Taverna:

Even if I like the building, I think the idea to make it an important structure of the Gauls falls in the cliché category. Feasting is an important part of the Celtic tradition, it is an institution that has huge impact on social and political processes in the society. Although it is not what everybody imagines with a small group of persons in an auberge/albergue like in the 1st movie of Lord of the Rings (The Prancing Pony). This kind of tavern could have existed but is related more to the merchants and artisans community and have little importance in the Celtic society. The game is skipping a lot of economical complexities so I do not know how this building could be include, although mods that are modifying the game to make it a city builder could use it.

On 12/18/2019 at 10:56 PM, Genava55 said:

Another good point of the article is the common view of primitive and simplicity increasing together the more we look in the past. Simply to enable a bit of introspection and retrospection, I will ask a question about something we talked a few weeks ago about civilization with population bonus in 0 AD. Where did the idea come from that the Celts should have a population bonus? This is an interesting question because it puts the finger on different things we have inherited from the ancients about "barbarians". The same for the idea to put a tavern as representative of a civilization. This is not a critic and I put the guilt of all this in the failure of the academic system to share knowledge outside its own sphere and of the media to have almost zero interest to promote knowledge.

Celtic things are not really my cup of tea, you're the expert. The tavern does seem to be problematic, though; do you think it should be removed? If so, what to do with the naked fanatics?

Edited June 19, 2020 by Nescio
one more

[Genava55]

1 hour ago, Nescio said:

The tavern does seem to be problematic, though; do you think it should be removed?

Taverns are indeed a very particular thing in the Gallic society and they appeared mostly around the 1st century BC with the Roman influence growing through trading. Taverns are often associated with amphorae storage, mostly filled with wine. There was one in the oppidum of Corent. Although the material found there is associated with strong Mediterranean influence and it could be owned by merchants, even Roman merchants.

The tavern made by Stan is based on the shape of the tavern found in Lattara dated to the early Roman occupation of Gallia Narbonnensis. Lattara itself is not a typical "La Tène" oppidum, the town has been strongly influenced by Etruscans and Greeks. Although, if he was inspired by the shape of the building, he made a much more Gallic depiction of the tavern.

Personally I have no issue with his depiction. The only thing is that in the Gallic society, there is no use of a tavern from a traditional perspective. There is a strong custom in Celtic societies for hospitality, a bit like Xenia in ancient Greece. Most of the respectable travelers would have been welcomed in the houses of Gallic freemen and aristocrats. Probably that the taverns arise with the increasing trade and also probably for the establishment of merchant guilds or networks across Gallic and Roman societies.

So I don't see which use it could have excepted in the case of campaign scenarios. It could be recycled to another thing, this is another option. There are Gallic houses with courtyards and actually the depiction made by Stan falls better in this category (the heads at the entrance, the weapons, it suggests a warlike aristocratic house). I think the building can still be useful for people wanting to portray a Gallic oppidum.

2 hours ago, Nescio said:

If so, what to do with the naked fanatics?

Either the act to put themselves naked is a religious vow to grant them the Gods favor in battle or it is a way to prove their bravery in the eyes of their peers.

So the easiest ways to give access to their recruitment for the player is the temple, the fortress or the barracks. This is uninspired but at least it doesn't require new mechanics.

The core of the problem is that from a historical perspective there are no barracks and no archery ranges in the Gallic society. There is no building dedicated to the recruitment of a specific warrior since it is a warrior society. Maybe there was some kind of storage for the weapons during the Oppida period (150 - 30 BC) since there are hints of general draft in the Gallic Wars accounts. So it means anyway there is no proper way to depict how it was really happening in the Gallic society with the game mechanics. So if someone wants particularly to create a specific barracks for Naked fanatics, I cannot disagree with it since it is the same situation with the regular barracks.