Empires Apart. ==Freemium==

[Stan`]

Well he probably didn't know how hoplites properly held their equipment. ;P

Might want to drop a link to 0 A.D @sphyrth. ^^

[Lion.Kanzen]

Just now, sphyrth said:

When honest reviews come up, I can't help but compare how 0 A.D. tries to handle the issues. I mean it's basically saying "Empires Apart is a bad AoE clone because it's far too close." While in here, "0 A.D. is a bad AoE clone because it's going too far astray... to the point of you don't know how it should be played."

And in about 1 minute into the video, he criticizes the counter system, while we're debating whether it should be put back or not. But to be fair, he said simple counter system. I mean, I haven't really played Empires Apart but is the counter system really so simple that it deserves criticism?

 

The game is very limited, so you can bored easily. only have few features like Blizzards game, but at this point, is almost dead.

No LAN

No scenario Editor

0 modding

No campaign

Ai worst than our sandbox Ai.

http://steamcharts.com/app/530630

https://steamcommunity.com/app/530630/reviews/?browsefilter=mostrecent&snr=1_5_reviews_&p=1

They even make to have some more multiplayer.

 

https://steamcommunity.com/app/530630/discussions/0/2828702372997344082/

[sphyrth]

lol @stanislas69. My avatar just got burnt because of your comment.

Anyway @Lion.Kanzen I found this screenshot from that latter link. Is this really from THE resonance22? If it is, then their publicity is backfiring.

 

[Lion.Kanzen]

When I  was a beta tester that thing was an pre-alpha, so the game still in alpha or beta. but the publisher buy some publicity from youtubers.

The only guy admitted they make a video because somebody send a code as gift. Mayorcete test many games but I'm sure when he is not totally enjoy something.

They try to make a tournament in a Italian castle.(video by Zeroempires)

I forgot this.

https://steamcommunity.com/games/530630/announcements/detail/3338732583910258854

Quote

First off, as part of our War Room event[slitherine.com] we will be running a live Empires Apart tournament between some of the best known RTS players in the world. There are some big names there: TaToh, Zero Empires, TheViper, and many more!

We are truly honoured to have such guests playing Empires Apart, and it will be a blast to see them battle each other live. You can watch them too: the tournament is going to start at 1.30 pm CEST on our Twitch channel[www.twitch.tv] and we will be streaming for more than 4 hours!

The tournament will consist of 3 full 1 vs 1 rounds, and then a final to decide the champion of the castle.

Why champion of the castle? Well, since Empires Apart is a game about the medieval era, where else could we host the tournament if not in a real medieval castle?



We will be staying with our guests at a beautiful castle in northern Italy, Castello di Pavone, dating back to the IX century, built long ago by king Arduin. We are looking forward to see who will be remembered as champion of the Rumble in the Castle.

We hope to see many of you on our Twitch channel[www.twitch.tv] at 1.30 PM on April 19th, and we will surely post plenty of pictures and footage on our social media channels. We will be live all afternoon.

Which brings us to our second big piece of news of the day...



Resonance22 published a new awesome faction video for Empires Apart, highlighting the best tactics to play as the Chinese as well as explaining the mechanics behind their unique gameplay.

If you would like to tryly get a grasp of what the Chinese faction can achieve in Empires Apart, then look no further and watch the video!
 

TheViper wins.

https://www.facebook.com/empiresapart/

But in the comments the people ask to fix bugs.

And Mayorcete makes a raffle of 10 free codes to changes in steam.

Edited May 15, 2018 by Lion.Kanzen

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

8 hours ago, sphyrth said:

I mean it's basically saying "Empires Apart is a bad AoE clone because it's far too close." While in here, "0 A.D. is a bad AoE clone because it's going too far astray... to the point of you don't know how it should be played."

Hmm, the difference being that Empires Apart is claimed by their developer to be a completed game. WFG does not claim 0 A.D. to be a completed game.   I wouldn't buy 0 A.D. in its current state, but like I said, WFG doesn't pretend they have a complete game on their hands, while the Empires Apart devs do. lol

Edited May 15, 2018 by wowgetoffyourcellphone

[Lion.Kanzen]

39 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Hmm, the difference being that Empires Apart is claimed by their developer to be a completed game. WFG does not claim 0 A.D. to be a completed game.   I wouldn't buy 0 A.D. in its current state, but like I said, WFG doesn't pretend they have a complete game on their hands, while the Empires Apart devs do. lol

They even haven't  scenario editor or LAN. and no campaign. and a DLC with OST.

Edited May 15, 2018 by Lion.Kanzen

[Sundiata]

I kind of feel bad for these guys... I wanted to like it. I don't really understand what happened. It was a nice project with lots of potential but they shot themselves in the foot by releasing it so early... Looks like they could have really used another year of development... Maybe the budget ran out, and they just "needed" to start making sales?

Spoiler

The most thorough/honest reviews and comments trash this game so hard... Why did they do that to themselves??? Surely the developers would have "noticed" these fatal flaws??? The worst thing is that people who have bought this game are facing so many random crashes that they go for a refund within an hour... When people spend money they expect at least a nominally playable game, not even mentioning the total lack of campaign, crappy AI, dead MP-base, no LAN... I thought the purpose of the low polly stuff and super-simplistic textures was to improve performance and focus on gameplay. Performance and gameplay seem to lack entirely, and now one of the most defining visual features of the game just makes it look cheap. Those weird semi-denialistic comments by the devs make it more awkward. Simple patches aren't going to save this game (any time soon).

 

Edited May 15, 2018 by Sundiata

[Stan`]

Now you have a good example of why going to platforms like steam too early might be fatal.

[sphyrth]

^ - True dat. Now I'm tempted to suggest that an answer to the FAQ "Why not 0 A.D. on Steam?" is "Empires Apart. Nuff said."

Though it's not really "early" by their standards. I remember that they actually delayed the release for about half a year.

I'm actually surprised by the review's criticism:
- Bad pathfinding
- Missing animations
- No Campaign
- Horrible AI

These problems are also present in 0 A.D. but is in a much much better form... in Open Source Alpha. Not to mention you guys are in a better situation feature-wise as well.

I hope that Slitherine won't make excuses for supporting Empires Apart. Staying quiet, moving on to other projects, and forget it ever happened is the best they can do.

[Stan`]

No moving to 0ad is the best they can do

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

They should have made this a mobile game, IMHO. 

[Sundiata]

12 minutes ago, stanislas69 said:

No moving to 0ad is the best they can do

Send them a mail:

"So, we noticed Empires Apart falling apart. A real pity, but not to worry. Just come on over to wildfiregames and apply your skills to 0AD instead. Help give birth to the real dream-RTS that Empires Apart wanted to be. Also, forget about money. Or fame. Or crappy textures."  

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

2 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

Send them a mail:

"So, we noticed Empires Apart falling apart. A real pity, but not to worry. Just come on over to wildfiregames and apply your skills to 0AD instead. Help give birth to the real dream-RTS that Empires Apart wanted to be. Also, forget about money. Or fame. Or crappy textures."  

I'm not a programmer myself, but it's possible the extent of their skills remains in tooling around in Unity or Unreal or whatever off-the-shelf engine they used.

[Imarok]

27 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

Send them a mail:

"So, we noticed Empires Apart falling apart. A real pity, but not to worry. Just come on over to wildfiregames and apply your skills to 0AD instead. Help give birth to the real dream-RTS that Empires Apart wanted to be. Also, forget about money. Or fame. Or crappy textures."  

Just do so  (But I would leave out the part with fame, as that is maybe not totally true)

[Sundiata]

Just now, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

I'm not a programmer myself, but it's possible the extent of their skills remains in tooling around in Unity or Unreal or whatever off-the-shelf engine they used.

Hmmm... I wouldn't know... Surely, they must have some skills we could cannibalize, no? We could definitely learn something from their publicity... They made it look like the next best thing in classic RTS, even though its not even 1/10th of 0AD... 

How does Empires Apart actually compare to AoE definitive edition? Curious about AoE IV, when is it coming out and what could we expect from it?

I think once campaigns start being implemented, 0AD is going to be the undeniable king of the historical RTS games... (I already think it is, but some people are all about the campaigns)

I think Wildfiregames is one of the most interesting development environments out there (not that I know so much about it), and the nature of this community comes with its own challenges, but it also seems to be the most potent! It's really fascinating to see so many volunteers working together, essentially on whatever suits them. This "who the shoe fit, let them wear it" approach has really brought so many wonderfully interesting levels of detail to the game. There is just so much here... The dynamic and constantly growing community also adds a lot. Its not a static team with dogmatic views, but is constantly adapting to new people, skills and resources. New possibilities are constantly being explored, tested and adapted... It's lovely to imagine who might come up with what next  

In a random response to the critiques of 0AD. It is indeed not a finished game, and this is not a secret. But to be fair, most issues like lag on large maps/high pop and pathfinding issues affect every other similar RTS, and 0AD has progressed enormously over the years. It's almost as if 15 years of development is finally bearing fruit  , the sweetest fruits in the genre  I can only dream of what Beta will be like, let alone a mythical official release of the finished game... I don't mind the perpetual development though. Its one of the biggest plus points of 0AD. It constantly gets updated (I hope forever), so none of us really know what the future may hold. If we look at the trajectory, its going to be the most AWESOME RTS ever! 

 

3 minutes ago, Imarok said:

Just do so  (But I would leave out the part with fame, as that is maybe not totally true)

Yeah, and we'd probably have to delete this entire thread as well because, you know... Although I'm sure some of them would have already read it  

Dillema's... 

[Nescio]

8 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

Hmmm... I wouldn't know... Surely, they must have some skills we could cannibalize, no? We could definitely learn something from their publicity... They made it look like the next best thing in classic RTS, even though its not even 1/10th of 0AD...

Their publicity might actually have been their undoing. They grapped attention, raised hopes, and published promising teasers, therefore people had high expectations and they were unable to live up to them. Selling an unfinished game might be a disappointment to many, but if they had postponed their release they would probably have lost most of their potential customers too.

Contrast this with 0 A.D. Wildfire Games does not promise anything, clearly indicates the game is in development, and does not sell it is a product. It's a long-term project and I hope it'll never be finished: the honest permanent alpha stage is possibly its greatest strength.

So what can we learn from them? Nothing we already know: publicity is nice, but focus on developing and improving the game; do not release or endorse an unfinished product. Let players do the publicity instead of the team. Basically business as usual.

[Sundiata]

46 minutes ago, Nescio said:

if they had postponed their release they would probably have lost most of their potential customers too.

I disagree completely with that. Why wouldn't you buy it after an extra year of development. At least the people following them would see they're serious about the game... Releasing early feels like a failed cash-grab/desperation. 

I agree with all the rest though  

They've basically made themselves to be the No Man's Sky of RTS...

 

[Nescio]

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

I disagree completely with that. Why wouldn't you buy it after an extra year of development. At least the people following them would see they're serious about the game... Releasing early feels like a failed cash-grab/desperation.

They put themselves in a position they had to release it. Last year they declared the game would be released in 2017; on February 15 they announced the release would be at March 29. Once you've declared a fixed date you can't simply say `sorry, we're not quite ready yet, please wait another year or two`.

And yes, they were probably desperate for money as well, personnel has to be paid etc.; hopefully for them they make break-even.

Edited May 15, 2018 by Nescio
ce

[Sundiata]

2 hours ago, Nescio said:

They put themselves in a position they had to release it. Last year they declared the game would be released in 2017; on February 15 they announced the release would be at March 29. Once you've declared a fixed date you can't simply say `sorry, we're not quite ready yet, please wait another year or two`.

Basically, `sorry, we're not quite ready yet, please wait another year or two`. is exactly what they should have said. It causes frustration among some, but even more anticipation among others. Eitherway, force releasing an unfinished game is really not an acceptable option, and waiting to release it for bug-fixing and polishing would have gained the respect of many..

 

3 hours ago, Nescio said:

And yes, they were probably desperate for money as well, personnel has to be paid etc.; hopefully for them they make break-even.

Yeah, they did obviously put a tremendous amount of work and love into it, and definitely deserve due credit... That's why I think it's such a pity that they released so early, because the current state of the game reflects badly on them, and they were pretty close (sort of) to making something really nice.... This will be lost on most people now, because all they see is an unfinished game. If they ran out of funds, that would be a really sad reason for this. I wish them success on their future projects, but I hope they learnt a lot from this situation. 

[Nescio]

2 hours ago, Sundiata said:

Basically, `sorry, we're not quite ready yet, please wait another year or two`. is exactly what they should have said. It causes frustration among some, but even more anticipation among others. Eitherway, force releasing an unfinished game is really not an acceptable option, and waiting to release it for bug-fixing and polishing would have gained the respect of many..

To clarify, I'm not saying I agree with them, but I can understand why they did what they did. Releasing the game at the promised date was perhaps the only promise they could and did keep. Personally I think they should not have announced any release before their product was finished and they had done a decent amount of playtesting, but they made a different decision, and I'm sure they've had good reasons.

[Lion.Kanzen]

Lol.

I don't expected this. happens   9 hours ago.

https://steamcommunity.com/app/530630/discussions/0/2828702373011294089/.

 

Edited May 15, 2018 by Lion.Kanzen

[Lion.Kanzen]

With scenario editor.

Spoiler

Quote

Hello Fenomeno,
I'm writing this reply as the last thing I do for the night, before getting a couple of hours of sleep and getting ready for some morning meetings. I spent the weekend working on improving the AI and hopefully the changes will reach you in a patch possibly today or tomorrow at the latest. You bring some interesting comments. On one end you say that you liked some things about the game but you disliked others, namely the lack of Map Editor (which was never advertised) and the lack of a Good AI. I do take issue on the balance side of things. In 8 hours, with a limited multiplayer experience, it's gonna be hard for you to fully understand the balance of the game. You brought up French Crossbowmen which are actually really good, and French Infantry which is actually very bad by design (but did you check the passive and the combo with the Paladin?). But these are just two aspects of what is currently considered one of the strongest civs in the game. I can't do much about you not winning online other than suggesting you hop on our Discord server and find people to practice with. We have folks from any levels that are eager to play and discuss strategies.

A Map Editor is currently not planned but we do plan to release modding tools as soon as we can, and those will allow people to create new maps, civilizations, game modes and more. Everything in the game was made with modders in mind, we hope they'll like the tools.

Like I said, AI improvements are on their way and we want to keep working on the AI more and more. We also added a Cheating AI, if you want a higher challenge. Most RTSs already cheat at higher difficulties, because it's very hard for an AI to keep up with a decent player without cheating. We tried to be honest, for better or for worse, but we're introducing the option, from the next patch, to have an AI that cheats (extra resources).

Now, onto the subject of the refund. You say the game costs too much and you think it's stupid to pay that amount, but you did. You played a fair amount - actually about the lenght of a single player campaign in many AAA games so I do not think a refund is warranted. But here's the deal. There's a lot of stuff coming out in the next few weeks. Patches, improvements, new content, which you're gonna get for free. Sometimes you buy something and you're not satisfied. Since release, we've been working night and day to improve the game and make sure as many people as possible are satisfied with their purchase. I'll make you this deal, Fenomeno. If in a month's time, you're still not satisfied with your purchase, you're free to hit me up via DM and I'll personally arrange something. This is for you and you alone (aka I won't be doing this with anybody else), and probably tomorrow somebody is gonna yell at me. But I'm confident that in a month or less, you'll be having fun online or against the AI.

Cheers,
Gian Paolo

 

 

 

[Lion.Kanzen]

Spoiler

Quote

The developers completely ignored the importance of single player aspects in RTS games and now they complain that people are giving their game negative reviews due to the absence of a campaign even though they clearly stated that the game has a strong focus on multiplayer.

First of all, the lack of a campaign is not the sole reason why people are giving the game negative reviews, its the fact that the game is an early access title which took a lazy shot at replicating AoE and its success. The game has atrocious pathfinding, a lackluster of an AI, does not allow buildings rotation, does not have game speed options, is extremely poorly optimized, features a low polygon graphic style which requires even less effort than designing 2D sprites for something like AoE RoR. The explanation that is being given by the developers is that they were focusing on a multiplayer experience, well guess what. StarCraft 2, which has an immense focus on multiplayer and E-Sports has three ♥♥♥♥ing huge campaigns. It features loads of single player content and does not negate its playerbase to play the way they want to, all that while providing an impeccable multiplayer experience.

But you will say, well its Blizzard, they can afford to do that. What about Cossacks 3 and Northguard? Both of which feature numerous campaign while offering an oustanding multiplayer experience? Not even mentioning about the fact that those games are filled with features that Empires Apart doesnt have, and all that while looking and running better as well as costing less.

Don't get me wrong, the developers definitely worked hard on this project but that doesnt justify what they have released and in what kind of state. The entire project looks like an attempt at a quick money grab basing on hype and AoE similarities

 

This mus be a lesson  for us. we are working in the SP but we can split them from 1.0 version.

 

Early they promise a campaign.

http://onlysp.com/empire-earth-age-empires-inspired-empires-apart-will-single-player-campaign/

Quote

DESTINYbit recently acquired a publisher for Empires Apart, Slitherine, whose responsible for publishing quite a few RTS games. With a publisher now on board, the development team at DESTINYbit will now be shipping the game with a full single player campaign, however, they aren’t quite ready to talk about it just yet. Since the game was originally intended as a multiplayer only title, development of the single player campaign in Empires Apart will begin at a later date.

If you’re interested in the game and want to know more about it and how it’s modernizing the classic-RTS formula, my interview with DESTINYbit will be published on Multiplayer Focus soon.

Creative Director on the project, Gian Paolo Vernocchi, told me “the campaign in Empires Apart has a meta-map kinda like Total War but with a very boardgame-y feel to it.” Unfortunately, that’s all I could get out of him at the moment regarding the campaign. Vernocchi did provide me with a few more details regarding extra single player content in Empires Apart, however.

“There are plenty of single player modes planned”, said Vernocchi in our interview. “Skirmish mode is obviously gonna be there as well as a Survival Mode where you pick a civilization and try to survive waves of increasingly strong opponents. We’re going to have a Challenge mode that will have the dual function of teaching you how to handle particular situations in the game as well as teaching you some advanced mechanics of some of the Civilizations. And lastly we’re gonna have a very unique Single Player campaign which is gonna be a procedural and repeatable experience that takes hints from board games to create something really unique and never seen before.”

We’re certainly going to follow-up with DESTINYbit when they’re ready to talk about the single player campaign in Empires Apart so be sure to stay tuned to OnlySP on Facebook and Twitter for future updates regarding the game.

Empires Apart is currently scheduled for a Q4 2017 release on the PC with a potential Early Access launch in early 2017.

Quote

The reply.

"That was 2 years ago, over 1 year ago we announced we would have focused on multiplayer for the release.

A campaing may come in the future, but if singleplayer is your only aim, you shouldn't buy it for the moment :)"

https://steamcommunity.com/app/530630/discussions/0/1697169163404501985/

 

[Lion.Kanzen]

Quote

The kind folks at Slitherine/Matrix, the publisher of Empires Apart, have provided Wayward Strategist with a couple of codes for the game. If you’ve been interested in playing, but unwilling or unable to pay the cost of entry, I might be able to help. I have 2 keys for Empires Apart, and I’m offering them to you, my readers

https://waywardstrategist.com/2018/04/09/empires-apart-giveaway/

Another "influencer" I prefer call these guys under marketing terminology: opinion leadership.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_leadership

Quote

found opinion leaders to have more influence on people's opinions, actions, and behaviors than the media. Opinion leaders are seen to have more influence than the media for a number of reasons. Opinion leaders are seen as trustworthy and non-purposive. People do not feel they are being tricked into thinking a certain way about something if they get information from someone they know. However, the media can be seen as forcing a concept on the public and therefore will be less influential. While the media can act as a reinforcing agent, opinion leaders have a more changing or determining role in an individual's opinion or action.

 

 

[Lion.Kanzen]

18 hours ago, sphyrth said:

^ - True dat. Now I'm tempted to suggest that an answer to the FAQ "Why not 0 A.D. on Steam?" is "Empires Apart. Nuff said."

Though it's not really "early" by their standards. I remember that they actually delayed the release for about half a year.

I'm actually surprised by the review's criticism:
- Bad pathfinding
- Missing animations
- No Campaign
- Horrible AI

These problems are also present in 0 A.D. but is in a much much better form... in Open Source Alpha. Not to mention you guys are in a better situation feature-wise as well.

I hope that Slitherine won't make excuses for supporting Empires Apart. Staying quiet, moving on to other projects, and forget it ever happened is the best they can do.

They used a finished engine, 0 A.D not. Unreal vs Pyrogenesis.

Others uses excuses like, "but there are indie with 3 guys" 0 A.D isn't full time project.