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Roman counter to Selucid elite cavarly?


Casaul player
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There are no counters to Sele/Pers champion cavalry spears (but you having more champ spear cav then your opponent).

Even if you had spartiate or any champion infantry polearms. They have extra range (7m) so if your enemy fight with them in formation with some melee infantry, now the champs fight behind the infantry (who have 4m range), therefor your champ spears aren't counters. Tested it against borg in tg recently even him can't do anything.

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6 minutes ago, Casaul player said:

I feel like the Selucid elite cav is too op. I need massive advantage in numbers when I play against my friend. Consular cavarly dies quickly, legionaries hold the line for a while but in a straight battle I need massive number advantage with constant resupply in units.

historical is the counter :)

But also making sure that you dont let them mass Cataphracts

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19 minutes ago, Casaul player said:

I feel like the Selucid elite cav is too op

Yes, it is. But, has your friend tried Silver Shield Pikemen with Chariots yet? Pikes hold the line while Chariots destroy everything from afar.

Each civ has some OP units. Roman infantry is very OP when used effectively. Try using the Testudo formation (switch formation usage from "Walk/Patrol only" to "No override"). Testudo keeps all your infantry swordsmen in a very packed formation, slicing and dicing any nearby enemies in seconds.

Add some Centurions to the mix for extra DPS. Centurions can be upgraded from Elite swordsmen and spearmen, or trained at Forts once Marian Reforms are researched. 

Edited by Deicide4u
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I have to agree with sj113 here, it is a rather expensive steel-intensive unit if you take in all of the required upgrades into account. It has to give at least some benefits for it all to be even remotely worth the cost. Otherwise it will be the Seleucid Elephant Champion situation all over again, which seem to have been nerfed to oblivion, making them unsuitable for anything (in this state they can not be used neither to destroy buildings nor kill units). Just my two cents. :naughty:

Edited by TheChampChump321
Grammar
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23 hours ago, Atrik said:

There are no counters to Sele/Pers champion cavalry spears (but you having more champ spear cav then your opponent).

Even if you had spartiate or any champion infantry polearms. They have extra range (7m) so if your enemy fight with them in formation with some melee infantry, now the champs fight behind the infantry (who have 4m range), therefor your champ spears aren't counters. Tested it against borg in tg recently even him can't do anything.

The quetion was what's the counter to spear champ cav, not the counter to a mix of spear champ cav and inf ;-)

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18 minutes ago, Player of 0AD said:

The quetion was what's the counter to spear champ cav, not the counter to a mix of spear champ cav and inf ;-)

The consequences of increasing range from 4 to 7m for champ cav are multiples, one is that they do reduce heavily loses when engaging them in a frontline. That does explain why even if you make counter units, you won't necessarily benefit from their already mediocre counter dps. I felt like it was in important consideration when thinking about counters.

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No counter if you play romans , you should find another way than fight :banana:

Produce gladiator unit, the special unit roman in the secret building ARENA, they have a bonus against all champions :lmao:but you can only produce 20 by building. 

 

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This Selucid/Persian champion makes no sense. It costs 10 more metal, but it has 3 more range and additional resistances (Kush, Ptol, Macedon, Gauls, Han, Carthage).

And since we wanted to unbalance as much as possible, we also added the possibility of having a technology that increases health by 20% for these two civilizations. Their only drawback is their slightly reduced movement speed; I don't think it's enough to balance the unit with other equivalent units.

I also won't go into the topic of hero bonuses or population. The Selucids are OP, but the Persians are their OP big brothers in Cav. You can have 20 more guys in your economy to spam the best unit in the game, in addition to having better heroes and discount on stables building. If you play CAVs, the Persians are better; if you don't, Selucid CAVs.

So even if you manage to match your opponent's numbers, you'll be at a disadvantage because this poses a major balance issue. This is especially true for maximum population. I've said this before, but knights can overlap excessively and will concentrate their attack on a small number of units.

Edited by Dakara
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