===[TASK]=== Splitting Maps to only showcase the "best"

[elexis]

The XML / JSON file contains keywords, such as "naval" or "new", and the gamesetup(.js) filters depending on that.

[Nescio]

Thanks, I found it: gui/gamesetup/gamesetup.js lines 170 to 208. Wouldn't it be better to automatically generate map filters, though, so that if a mod adds a keyword X to a map, there will be a corresponding filter, without having to edit the js file? That would also allow the “default” filter to only include maps actively labelled as such, instead of just excluding naval, demo, and hidden maps.

[elexis]

Then the label and description would have to be removed:

Quote

        "id": "trigger",

        "tooltip": translateWithContext("map filter", "Maps that come with scripted events and potentially spawn enemy units."),

Who will know what a trigger map is otherwise? (I guess "Scripted" might fit better as well)

When removing the mapfilter definition, one will only be able to do direct relation, but that should actually be fine with checkboxes.

One could also make a JSON file per filter, so that modders can add them without overwriting a file.

(The danger of allowing too much tag freedom is to gain too many tags (like one per map in the worst case). Another danger is using to weakly defined / fuzzy tags, for example "Default" still doesn't tell us anything that is covered.)

(Another feature that people wanted was to tag maps themselves and thus pick a random of these maps when chosing the "random" item. But that sounds like it would be different from the keyword filter and not unifiable.)

So I guess any of the possible downsides already exists, except for the missing descriptions, with the alternative of defining the filters in one JSON file each.

[Nescio]

15 minutes ago, elexis said:

One could also make a JSON file per filter, so that modders can add them without overwriting a file.

That's an interesting idea; however, if one adds a new map, it won't show up in any filter, unless one edits a filter.json file to include that map?

[elexis]

3 minutes ago, Nescio said:

if one adds a new map, it won't show up in any filter

Checkboxes: Ticking no checkboxes means all maps are matched.

Dropdown: Current "Default" filter returns maps with arbitrary keywords excluding three specific keywords

4 minutes ago, Nescio said:

unless one edits a filter.json file to include that map

adds a new myfilter.json file that defines the label, description and filtered keywords  of the mapfilter.

Everything remains the same way it is to the user. As you saw in gamesetup.js, maps only refer to keywords, and filters only relate to keywords. So filters and maps are unaware of each other, an interface basically.

With checkboxes a new filter would be like this:

filters/naval.json

Quote

 

{

   "name": "Naval",

   "Description": "Build a navy to reach the enemies lands.",

   "Filter": "naval-hidden" (matchclasses syntax)

}

 

Player-defined mapfilters are also imagineable, but that should preferably not change the map files, but instead filter depending on a player-defined maplist stored in the user config system.

(The ini files aren't so well suited for structured data, perhaps it could become a new config/mapfilters.json file for player-defined mapfilters.

   (Also we need a new config/user/ directory to support configs per user.))

 

[Nescio]

38 minutes ago, elexis said:

Checkboxes: Ticking no checkboxes means all maps are matched.

Shouldn't it be the other way around, i.e. if nothing is selected, nothing shows up?

38 minutes ago, elexis said:

Player-defined mapfilters are also imagineable, but that should preferably not change the map files, but instead filter depending on a player-defined maplist stored in the user config system.

That would be great to have!

[Stan`]

1 hour ago, Nescio said:

Shouldn't it be the other way around, i.e. if nothing is selected, nothing shows up?

Well they are filters so that would be counter intuitive. Plus if a new player comes to the game and sees 0 maps that's not gonna do it

[Nescio]

33 minutes ago, stanislas69 said:

Well they are filters so that would be counter intuitive. Plus if a new player comes to the game and sees 0 maps that's not gonna do it

Yes, they're filters, but does e.g. the Naval filter mean “include all Naval maps” or “exclude all non-Naval maps”? If the former, then ticking both Naval and Trigger will show up all naval and all scripted maps; if the latter, then only those maps will show up that are simultaneously naval and scripted (currently 0). Besides, what would be the result of selecting the All maps filter?

[elexis]

One can push few logic to the keywords, for example requiring that every map has either a land tag or a naval tag, but not both. Then having one checkbox per keyword would behave in an expected way and would allow expressing many cases.

But it still wouldn't allow selecting all land maps excluding trigger maps.

Sounds like a GUI for And/Or/Not would be needed (or just XOR ). trac and thunderbird have that too for example.

Or one filter for keywords that must exist and one filter for keywords that may not exist.

Or one three-way checkboxes / dropdown per keyword found.

(Or just keeping the current mapfilters specifying a logic, but moving them to individual JSON files)

[Nescio]

On 4/10/2019 at 11:15 AM, Sundiata said:

PS: take care of what maps are at the top of the lists, because of the alphabetical order. How many more times do I need to watch a youtube vid of a newbie playing Acropolis bay??? The first map people play should be one of the best looking ones (first impressions matter!). Perhaps with the new cliffs Acropolis bay could be really improved, but I'm honestly even bored of the name... After so many years, let another map take the top position please. 

Making random maps the default is my preferred solution: https://code.wildfiregames.com/D2926

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

1 hour ago, Nescio said:

Making random maps the default is my preferred solution: https://code.wildfiregames.com/D2926

As random maps aren't nearly as good looking as skirmish maps, I don't hardly think that is a solution for @Sundiata's issue.

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

On 4/10/2019 at 8:27 AM, elexis said:

I always proponed to rename "Default" to "Land maps", that's what it's actually filtering for IIRC.

Please this. Easy change.

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

On 4/10/2019 at 1:00 PM, Gurken Khan said:

My default setting is 'medium'. I don't think it's ideal that the same settings don't lead to the same kind of 'playability'; if I want to play a randomly picked map, I shouldn't have to adjust the settings for a specific map beforehand, since I don't know that this specific map is coming up...

 

Indeed. I think both 'mountainous' and 'watery' maps should bump up to the next size up (behind the scenes). This would help to balance out buildable land area among the maps. 

[nifa]

as already said, i think "default" should be "land maps" and maybe "default" or "premium" could be a selection of ca. 10-15 best maps?

more important "random" should be something like "randomly generated". Also wouldn't it be nice to have "random selection" on top of the lists to start on a random already existing one? for when you're too lazy to chose a map for a fast game

when i started playing i was confused weather random meant randomly selected or randomly generated

Also, is it possible to add the biome as a filter?

Edited January 6, 2021 by nifa

[Stan`]

29 minutes ago, nifa said:

 

Also, is it possible to add the biome as a filter?

Will be in the next alpha for compatible maps

30 minutes ago, nifa said:

when i started playing i was confused weather random meant randomly selected or randomly generated

There will be a random button for maps. Actuall random should be "procedural"

32 minutes ago, nifa said:

as already said, i think "default" should be "land maps" and maybe "default" or "premium" could be a selection of ca. 10-15 best maps?

Map overhaul is for A25

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

14 hours ago, Stan` said:

Map overhaul is for A25

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

Maybe for some of the less workable maps, they could still be accessible in the game by choosing the map 'Megarandom,' which has some of the wackiest possible options in it.

[Stan`]

I was thinking of making them accessible in @coworotel
s mod instead ?