Unit And Building Names

[Mythos_Ruler]

Hi Atenmeses52. We definitely need words for:

Civic Center (or town center, or maybe palace if need be)

House (or home)

Market (or marketplace)

Dock (or harbor)

Barracks

Stone Wall (or City Wall)

Stone Tower (or City Tower or Turret)

City Gate(s)

Defense Tower (or "outpost")

Outpost or Watchtower (for the outpost building)

Fortress

Corral (or barn or animal pen)

Farmstead (or granary)

Storehouse

[Atenmeses52]

Here they are:

City Center: pr-'a (pronounced per- a- a)

House: pr (pron. per) OR ḥwt (pronounced kh (or german/scottish ch) oot

Market: (can't get an exact translation: this means house of things of demand)ḥwt-n-ḫt.w-wḫa.w (pron. khoot en khetoo wekhaaoo)

Dock: ḥwt-n-dpt.w (pron. khoot en depetoo)

Barracks: ḥwt-n-mš' (pron. khoot en mesha)

Stone wall: h-n-njwt (pron. heh-en-niwt)

Stone tower: mktr (pron. mekter-- actually the etymological origin of the word "migdol" in Hebrew)

City gate: sba-n-njwt (pron. sebba en niwt)

Defense Tower: mktr-n-ḏw (pron. mekter en djoo)

Outpost or Watchtower: mktr-n-ḫt (pron. mekter en khet)

Fortress: mktr-'a (pron. mekter-a-a)

Corral: h-n-ssmt.w (pron. heh-en-sesmetoo)

Farmstead: pr-n-t (pron. per-en-et)

Storehouse: h-n-ḫt.w (pron. heh-en-khetoo)

If anyone else has a decent English-Egyptian dictionary, you might want to check these--I can't find some words that have direct translations so I had to circumlocute...

Also-- a note on Demotic: after further digging, it seems to me that Demotic is not very different from it's linguistic predecessors (most of the vocabulary from Old Egyptian remains intact throughout the various evolutionary steps of the language's development) all that appears to be different for Demotic is the script (which can get really confusing) and the fact that it simplifies some of the more complicated Middle and Late Egyptian grammatical concepts that go hand-in-hand with the hieroglyphic writing system... it would be super cool though if we could use hieroglyphs as the ingame text... I have mentioned this before, but I know of an open source program that allows users to type in Unicode hieroglyphs... here's the link:

http://jsesh.qenherkhopeshef.org/

For now, I think it would be easier to do all of the building/unit names in transliteration, but I think we should, at some point, have them all in the local scripts (the hardest of these, I think, would be cuneiform for Persian... I'm not exactly sure how that would work)

Edited December 17, 2013 by Atenmeses52

[sanderd17]

it would be super cool though if we could use hieroglyphs as the ingame text... I have mentioned this before, but I know of an open source program that allows users to type in Unicode hieroglyphs... here's the link:

If the hieroglyphs are present in Unicode, we'd only need a compatible font that renders it, and build the hieroglyphs for that font. We should be able to render unicode signs.

[Atenmeses52]

The other (feasible) option, of course, would be to just write out the Demotic/Egyptian words for everything in the Coptic alphabet... that might be an easier alternative if the hieroglyphs don't work out...

Either way, we should focus on getting accurate transliterations for everything--if you are planning on including the Seleucids in the future, might you need Aramaic/Syriac translations/transliterations (if so, I can do these too!)

[Mythos_Ruler]

Thanks for the translations. Maybe "wooden tower" for the outpost.

For the Seleucids, I think we'll just go with Koine Greek, as that was the official language of the Empire and the language of the standing army.

[Lion.Kanzen]

We need, name of Nabatean unit, maybe Atemneses52 knows how we can called in a native name.

[Atenmeses52]

@Mythos:

I updated it to say "wooden tower"

@Lion:

What is the generic name?

[Lion.Kanzen]

@Mythos:

I updated it to say "wooden tower"

@Lion:

What is the generic name?

Yes, for the Nabstean Camel Archer, for Ptolemaic Faction. Edited December 17, 2013 by Lion.Kanzen

[Atenmeses52]

That should be mutsābiq gamal nabatu

Edited December 17, 2013 by Atenmeses52

[Mythos_Ruler]

Forgot a few things:

• Farm Field (or just field or just farm)
• Temple
• Blacksmith
• Nubian Archer

[Zeta1127]

The best translation for the so-called Theban Flamethrower I can come up with is Pyropallō, since we wanted to use pyro, with pallō being one of the Ancient Greek root words that catapult and its Latin root word catapulta were ultimately derived from.

[Prodigal Son]

Pyrovolos would be the right one, meaning fire striker/launcher/thrower. "Pallo" means swing, "Vallo" means launch/fire/strike/throw and they are verbs so "Pyropallo" (I doubt this word even exists/makes any sense at all) or "Pyrovallo" would be the verb forms of it.

Edited January 2, 2014 by Prodigal Son

[Romulus]

Castra

Singular Castrum

Roman word for buildings that military. This where the English word castle comes from.

[Zeta1127]

I actually realized after I posted it, that the unit is actually called a Fire Raiser not a Flamethrower.

[Argantonius]

Hello back. I found this that you might want to check, an Etymological Dictionary of Basque in English. This one is especially great because it says when a word is lent from Spanish or other language.

http://web.archive.org/web/20110607202936/http://www.sussex.ac.uk/linguistics/documents/lxwp23-08_edb.pdf

I noticed that the new blacksmith building doesn't have a name. According to this document it could be [h]arotz ("smith"). An alternative ol[h]a is identified as "forge, foundry" but then says that it can mean just "place".

Other changes:

Cantabrian Cavalry / "Caballero Cantabro" - > Kantabriako Zaldun (interestingly the document notes the similarity between Basque zaldi, horse, and thieldo, a "Hispanic" word for horse recorded by Pliny.

This one identifies baratze not as "orchard" but as "garden" instead. Several other words are given for "field" including okuntza, berro/berho and ganbo/kanbo (from Latin Campus) for "sown field"; sor[h]o for "field, meadow, estate, farm"; and galsoro for "wheat field".

Azoka apparently comes from Arabic Suq so it's barely better than Merkatu. Other words for "Market" cited are zeia and arruga.

[Lion.Kanzen]

i Agree with this one

In the later Roman Empire the classical Latin word for horse, equus, was replaced in common parlance by vulgar Latin caballus, sometimes thought to derive from Gaulish caballos.[10] From caballus arose terms in the various Romance languages cognate to the (French-derived) English cavalier: Old Italian cavaliere, Italian cavallo, Spanish caballero[\b], French chevalier, Portuguese cavaleiro, Romanian cavaler.[11] The Germanic languages feature terms cognate to the English rider: German Ritter, and Dutch and Scandinavian ridder. These words are cognates derived from Germanic rīdan "to ride", derived from the Proto-Indo-European root reidh-.[12]

Naming caballero is like you named Cavalryman for a Spanish speaker. Caballo and Caballero are more Gallic than Iberian.

[tema]

the /Fishing Boat/ in https://www.transifex.com/projects/p/0ad/translate/#it/public/c/16927413

for brit_ship_fishing; celt_ship_fishing; gaul_ship_fishing

could someone show to me the ship model? if it's a small, few people ship, it can be the proto-celtic "koruko" (/kəˈɾˠax/)

source https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Index:Proto-Celtic/k

as sander17 said, the "Curach" is used for the merchant ship. Curach/curagh/coracle were leather boats, from the proto-celtic koruko, usually a small fishing boat with a wooden frame, over which animal skins.

Curachs were in the main used for fishing, and for the ferrying of goods and the transport of animals, including sheep and cattle between the Islands.

History divulges the voyage of st. Brendan (the patron saint of sailors) who was born c. 484 in the south west of Ireland. This account tells the tale of an ocean going boat, with a thin sided and wooden ribbed vessel: as was the custom then, and covered it with hides which had been cured with oak bark. Tar was used to seal the places where the skins joined to avoid leakage. A mast was situated in the middle of the vessel.

so i think the gaul/celt/brit fishing boats can be merged in the old koruko.

Edited March 16, 2014 by tema

[kanetaka]

Dear members. I am a member of the Japanese translation team. I need some help for translating faction-specific names.

I think that "specific name"s on the design document(http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Design_Document) should not be translated, because they seem to be used with the generic names that have same meanings. Although I don't want to translate them, I still want to know the pronunciation of them. Because in Japanese orthography, foreign words should be copied by the pronunciations and then be written by our non-alphabet characters. I started to put "Specific" tags on such strings for anyone who can help me.

How do I pronunce words of various languages? I guess Latin style for western civs and Greek style for eastern, but is that all?

[sanderd17]

The Celts (Gauls and Britons) talked something that mostly resembles the current Gaelic (though most written resources are Latin). Persians talked Farsi, Indians talked ancient variants of that region (Magadhi Prakrit, Sanskrit, ...). Egyptian names are in some Egyptian language for which there are few written resources, let alone we know how it's pronounced.

Maybe we should try to get the specific names to use the local script (so Greek letters for Greek cultures, instead of using the Latin alphabet). But our font system currently only supports unicode characters from the first unicode plane. While most historical scrips are in other planes (like Egyptian hieroglyphs). This still wouldn't be possible for the Celts (as they didn't have their own script). But it would work for most other civilisations I think.

For now, I advise you to not translate it (unless the specific name is English, i.e. not specific enough).

[tema]

Maybe i misunderstood, need you to listen that word in the original language?

example:http://translate.google.com/#es/ja/iberos

if you click on the left speaker icon you can hear the spanish word, on the right the jap

Dear members. I am a member of the Japanese translation team. I need some help for translating faction-specific names.

I think that "specific name"s on the design document(http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Design_Document) should not be translated, because they seem to be used with the generic names that have same meanings. Although I don't want to translate them, I still want to know the pronunciation of them. Because in Japanese orthography, foreign words should be copied by the pronunciations and then be written by our non-alphabet characters. I started to put "Specific" tags on such strings for anyone who can help me.

How do I pronunce words of various languages? I guess Latin style for western civs and Greek style for eastern, but is that all?

[kanetaka]

I use it sometimes, but the site is designed for modern languages.

Maybe i misunderstood, need you to listen that word in the original language?

example:http://translate.google.com/#es/ja/iberos

if you click on the left speaker icon you can hear the spanish word, on the right the jap

[GunChleoc]

Try checking the names in Wikipedia, sometimes they are given in IPA there.

For Britons, we will need to go with Latin Script I guess, unless they used some Ogham like the Irish did.

For the Gauls, either Latin or Greek would work.

[kanetaka]

Try checking the names in Wikipedia, sometimes they are given in IPA there.

For Britons, we will need to go with Latin Script I guess, unless they used some Ogham like the Irish did.

For the Gauls, either Latin or Greek would work.

Yes, I use Wikipedia and it is useful if the word is found in it. And thank you for your advices for the Britons and the Gauls, I'll try them. Then I have got my problems clearer:

1. In which language is this word written?

2. Is this word transliterated or latinized or hellenized?

3. Are there any phonetic guide for the appropriate language?

Q1 and Q2 are not so difficult generally, but Q3 gives me the headache in case of minor ancient languages, those except Latin, Greek and Sanskrit.

[GunChleoc]

Yes, Q3 is a tough one, becausse we obviously don't have any sound recordings of the time.

[Flavius Aetius]

Can the OP consolidate this into a master list so everyone knows what has already been posted? That would be helpful.