Permanent creation of units

[seregadushka]

 

54 minutes ago, Atrik said:

Fun fact.

People that refuse to the use current auto-queue, play SP, 

Atrik , 

Colleague, I've got you figured out. They probably play on PS. The main thing for them is the presence of a soft sofa. 

We  have an armor-piercing "Fun fact." which is impossible to argue with -- PETRA has an "Auto-Queue", we don't.

But the developers suggest that we feel dumber than this bot every day. 

They will offer to reconsider their views, buy a new mouse, and still start enjoying this hamster clicker 0 A.D.

A very important argument is "we can do better, but we have already done worse. We must show respect for our old decisions (mistakes). We cannot admit that for 22 years we have been tormenting people with unnecessary movements that serve the main process of the game." 

I wonder how many people have dropped 0 A.D.?, because it seems silly to them to make the same clicks by the hundreds. While your troops are being destroyed on the battlefield, we are maintaining the barracks. 

"We can do better. But you have to change your attitude towards your inner negativity. Because there are games where it's even worse." -- Strange methods of persuasion. It's a strange excuse not to change anything, like 22 years ago. In such a position, no one will sweat from work. 

The developers probably find it pleasant to click on each building in turn. And after 1 minute, repeat in a circle.

But it's not developers who live in the world, but ordinary normal people. With a different worldview. To some, it will seem the height of idiocy. Especially in a battle with a robot that laughs and chokes on its transistors, watching our thousands of clicks. When he has only 1 click, at the beginning of the exponent.

For Petra, we're real dumb hamsters. The same bot sees the code 0 A.D. He sees this one parameter LockQueue =1, which must be enabled, and will save himself the agony. But these leather bags are not familiar with binary calculus. How are they going to beat me ??? 

---------------

Atrik , I wrote to you in ModernGUI . 0 A.D. -- a well-known program that likes to shove its data across all disks. I have it on disk D. Can you give me the exact path where to copy yours? ModernGUI ?

[guerringuerrin]

1 hour ago, Atrik said:

Fun fact.

Ford Model T was the most successful car in automotive history, and to date, is still iconic. It had primitive suspensions and back then we had cobblestone road.

We should therefore get back to that. I'm sure this is a totally valid reasoning.

I think car analogies don’t work very well for discussing RTS design. But even if we were to accept it as a valid comparison rather than a false analogy, I’ll explain why I still think it doesn’t hold:

The Model T today is mostly a collector’s item and is no longer part of the modern car's market.

By contrast, StarCraft: Brood War still has active professional tournaments, specially in South Korea. And the same unit-training mechanics are still present in modern competitive RTS titles like StarCraft II and the Age of Empires series, which continue to run esports tournaments with significant prize pools.

So this isn’t just a case of defending an obsolete design. These mechanics are still part of the competitive RTS ecosystem today.

However, I’m still not entirely sure what we are actually discussing here: whether the goal is simply to add an option so that the vanilla auto-queue pauses until enough resources are available, or whether the intention is to introduce a highly automated system like the smart training from the ModernGUI mod.

In that system, production not only resumes automatically when resources become available, but the game also determines the batch sizes based on the available resources and distributes the training across all eligible buildings through the training panel provided by the mod.

Because those are two very different things.

[AlexHerbert]

On 14/3/2026 at 5:30 PM, seregadushka said:

I think stopping the birth of new units due to lack of resources is a big mistake by the developers. 

According to this strategy, the game turns into a punishment. 

I have to constantly check the condition of the barracks.

The unit production queue should be restored automatically when resources become available.

My mouse will break before I enjoy the game.

This is incorrect. This can be considered a bug. 

 

Bro, I understand that new players who don't know how to play want some help with auto-training, I personally used it at the very beginning.
However if you are an experienced player it feels lazy and can fall asleep. If players want the game to play by itself, it’s also possible to just watch replays, spec games or put AIs to fight each other and enjoy the show.  

 

Edited 1 hour ago by AlexHerbert

[guerringuerrin]

2 minutes ago, seregadushka said:

I wonder how many people have dropped 0 A.D.?, because it seems silly to them to make the same clicks by the hundreds. While your troops are being destroyed on the battlefield, we are maintaining the barracks. 

Perhaps you should ask yourself why thousands of people are still playing Age of Empires II or StarCraft II in the international competitive scene and haven’t left despite having to make thousands of clicks.

Anyway, I see you’re a clever guy who came here to explain to all of us how stupid we are, appealing to analogies and “smart” comments, while you can’t even beat Petra Bot, which must be one of the dumbest RTS AIs out there. 

[seregadushka]

5 minutes ago, guerringuerrin said:

However, I’m still not entirely sure what we are actually discussing here: whether the goal is simply to add an option so that the vanilla auto-queue pauses until enough resources are available, or whether the intention is to introduce a highly automated system like the smart training from the ModernGUI mod.

In that system, production not only resumes automatically when resources become available, but the game also determines the batch sizes based on the available resources and distributes the training across all eligible buildings through the training panel provided by the mod.

No need to invent anything ! No distribution between buildings. I've already heard this argument. Don't invent a problem where it doesn't exist.  There is nothing complicated. The main queue allocator is a timer in the computer. Of the 2 buildings, there is always one that was vacated 1 millisecond earlier. This is enough to understand who is going to give the new resource to.

If you come up with a new algorithm, it will take another couple of thousand players. If they go to compare other games, "What about others with Auto-Queue? " they may not come back. 

Barracks: I can put swordsmen in one room and horses in the other to quickly collect resources. There is 1 km between the barracks. I don't need a new algorithm to decide for me which barracks to raise whom. 

Elementary timer allocation.

My request to the developers is :

var btnAQ = getGUIObjectByName("autoQueueButton");
btnAQ.onPress = () => {
    g_AutoQueue = !g_AutoQueue;
    this.caption = g_AutoQueue ? "AQ: ON" : "AQ: OFF";
    this.sprite = g_AutoQueue ? "ModernButtonActive" : "OldDustyButton";
};

It's all.

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

8 minutes ago, guerringuerrin said:

By contrast, StarCraft: Brood War still has active professional tournaments, specially in South Korea. And the same unit-training mechanics are still present in modern competitive RTS titles like StarCraft II and the Age of Empires series, which continue to run esports tournaments with significant prize pools.

So this isn’t just a case of defending an obsolete design. These mechanics are still part of the competitive RTS ecosystem today.

Indeed we consistently see that "old" games which feature skill expression become e-sports because you can get infinitely better at the game without being perfect. The satisfaction with learning and improving and outplaying are also what makes games fun aside from just being competitive. Many modern games try to remove these "difficult" mechanics and the result is boring gameplay where the only distinguishing factors are simply choosing the stronger option whether thats a gun in a fps game or a civilization in an rts game.

That is why aoe2 performs better than aoe3 aoe4 and AoM retold. 

Games 20 years ago were designed to be fun in order to succeed in sales. Now they are designed to have a marketing induced mass appeal for a short time, and sell skins in-game. For this its important that a player can feel like they are "good" at the game within a week or so of buying it (skill-based matchmaking also contributes to this). So removing any sort of mechanic with skill expression boosts sales.

It seems like some people just want a modern slop game that they can play while yawning and watching movies on other monitors.

[seregadushka]

26 minutes ago, AlexHerbert said:

 

Bro, I understand that new players who don't know how to play want some help with auto-training, I personally used it at the very beginning.
But if you are an experienced player it feels lazy. If players want the game to play by itself, it’s also possible to just watch replays, spec games or put AIs to fight each other and enjoy the show.  

 

Bro, it looks like you decided to give a lecture at a nursing home. You've got the wrong address. Come back again.

[Deicide4u]

7 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

seems like some people just want a modern slop game that they can play while yawning and watching movies on other monitors.

You can already do that, just put Petra on Sandbox mode and build your nice sand castles until you get bored. 

[seregadushka]

1 hour ago, guerringuerrin said:

Perhaps you should ask yourself why thousands of people are still playing Age of Empires II or StarCraft II in the international competitive scene and haven’t left despite having to make thousands of clicks.

Anyway, I see you’re a clever guy who came here to explain to all of us how stupid we are, appealing to analogies and “smart” comments, while you can’t even beat Petra Bot, which must be one of the dumbest RTS AIs out there. 

Look at the browser's address bar and read the name of the forum. What is StarCraft, what is AOE? 

In the text, I see a full recognition of my arguments for the auto-queue in 0 A.D. because you don't have any others.

For competent argumentation, like yours, not on the topic of the forum, the letters FIFA or Miner are also suitable. 

You weren't standing behind me, and you don't know what level of Petra I have set. 

You seem to be getting into the terms too.  Based on the level of your comments, I'll also assume that you studied 0 A.D. from the pictures.

Edited 1 hour ago by seregadushka

[AlexHerbert]

10 minutes ago, seregadushka said:

Bro, it looks like you decided to give a lecture at a nursing home. You've got the wrong address. Come back again.

Uh I see, wrong building then. I was looking for the RTS strategy department.

[seregadushka]

10 minutes ago, Deicide4u said:

You can already do that, just put Petra on Sandbox mode and build your nice sand castles until you get bored. 

It's interesting that you know of the two of us, where is a 0AD Sandbox, but I don't  

[guerringuerrin]

8 minutes ago, seregadushka said:

Look at the browser's address bar and read the name of the forum. What is StarCraft, what is AOE? 

In the text, I see a full recognition of my arguments for the game 0 A.D. because you don't have any others.

For competent argumentation, like yours, not on the topic of the forum, the letters FIFA or Miner are also suitable. 

You are right. Comparing mechanics from other RTS games to discuss a mechanic in an RTS game makes absolutely no sense… 

[AlexHerbert]

24 minutes ago, seregadushka said:

It's interesting that you know of the two of us, where is a 0AD Sandbox, but I don't  

 

[Atrik]

 

1 hour ago, guerringuerrin said:

I think car analogies don’t work very well for discussing RTS design. But even if we were to accept it as a valid comparison rather than a false analogy, I’ll explain why I still think it doesn’t hold:

Analogies are often stupid and always have limits. The point here was that you can always go a century back, and find things that were great back then for the time. Doesn't justify freezing things as they were.

 

1 hour ago, guerringuerrin said:

the intention is to introduce a highly automated system like the smart training from the ModernGUI mod.

In that system, production not only resumes automatically when resources become available, but the game also determines the batch sizes based on the available resources and distributes the training across all eligible buildings through the training panel provided by the mod.

"highly automated" seems poor choice of words of having additional possibilities to actually control the production. Else it's the same idea. In fact if you remove the UI, you can perfectly make the same code work, example.

 

1 hour ago, seregadushka said:

Atrik , I wrote to you in ModernGUI . 0 A.D. -- a well-known program that likes to shove its data across all disks. I have it on disk D. Can you give me the exact path where to copy yours? ModernGUI ?

Are you seregas? I don't know the  answer to 

Quote

how to install the mod if the game is not on the C:/ ?

Maybe someone on windows can help you better. Probably still:

C:\Users\JohnDoe\Documents\My Games\0ad\
 

[guerringuerrin]

32 minutes ago, Atrik said:

"highly automated" seems poor choice of words of having additional possibilities to actually control the production. Else it's the same idea. In fact if you remove the UI, you can perfectly make the same code work, example.

I see what you mean, but I find calling it “having additional possibilities to actually control the production” is an euphemism.
ModernGUI actually does more than just provide control. You can set the percentage of each unit type, and as long as you have resources and houses, it automatically queues units, calculating in milliseconds how many each building can train and executing all orders, freeing the player to focus on other tasks.

Of course, you’ll still need to check the barracks occasionally and make other decisions, but IMHO “highly automated” fits this behavior well.

I don’t want to turn this thread into another ModernGUI discussion, but I felt it’s important not to misrepresent its functionality in the context of this debate.

Edited 1 hour ago by guerringuerrin

[Seleucids]

11 minutes ago, guerringuerrin said:

don’t want to turn this thread into another ModernGUI discussion, but I felt it’s important not to misrepresent its functionality in the context of this debate.

This is not the first time I see you say this and this won't be the last time some random thread gets turned into a ProGUi controversy debate lol

[guerringuerrin]

1 minute ago, Seleucids said:

This is not the first time I see you say this and this won't be the last time some random thread gets turned into a ProGUi controversy debate lol

If you follow the thread, you know that’s not the point in question. But if someone says that’s not what ModernGUI does, of course I’ll discuss it.

[Atrik]

29 minutes ago, guerringuerrin said:

ModernGUI actually does more than just provide control. You can set the percentage of each unit type, and as long as you have resources and houses, it automatically queues units, calculating in milliseconds how many each building can train and executing all orders, freeing the player to focus on other tasks.

Of course, you’ll still need to check the barracks occasionally and make other decisions, but IMHO “highly automated” fits this behavior well.

(Relative to normal auto-queue) You have perks that increase control over your production, at the cost of having more buttons. You also don't have the problem of potentially having it stop for arbitrary reasons. When that happen with vanilla autoqueue you need to restart production with 3 keystroke, and you still don't need switch camera like it is so often pretended to be the case. So it's like ~3 APM saved, say 10 APM to be large, and not accounting that you should actually subtract that you need to manage the trainer panel. There are tones of other things in the mod that improve QOL, the trainer is a big one for sure, but no, It's not going to have the impact on the game people try to make others believe it does.