Norse_Harold

leopard did not ask me to punish weirdJokes. I issued the infraction because I perceived a violation of the terms of use. Regardless of severity, I consider it a significant violation of the terms of use because it's a form of bullying. It was not a mistaken punishment. The infraction points will help to remind weirdJokes that he needs to avoid doing that sort of thing again, even as a forum private message. I don't think that leopard is a saint in terms of his conduct, as I've seen him insult people and lose his temper at times. Still, two wrongs don't make a right. I think that it would be good to gather the three of us for a discussion in order to find common ground, do arbitration, and do conflict resolution. I want to be friends with both leopard and weirdJokes. I want to get past this video clip. I want to discover that weirdJokes actually means no harm and is not acting in concert with Geriatrix. I want to reassure both of you that you are and can be friends, who follow the rules, and who treat each other with respect. The way to do that is to have a mediated real-time conversation. weirdJokes and leopard, when are you available to meet me on IRC, preferably around 17:00 UTC on a weekday?

Great, glad that our troubleshooting session helped narrow things down enough to identify this issue as the cause of the symptoms. For those watching at home, logs of the troubleshooting conversation on IRC are here and here. Before I buy new hardware I do some searching for discussion of how well it's supported by Linux. Fortunately, there are pretty thorough and updated lists of which wifi products are supported here.

I would like to help with this, but there isn't enough information here to know what the cause of the problem is. I would say that it's rare, but I can think of some possible causes. like wireless interference, router misconfiguration (for example use of port triggering instead of port forwarding or port mapping), use of a VPN protocol like wireguard that doesn't handle large packet sizes, malware protection that monitors and blocks network activity, etc. I can help you interactively via IRC. Otherwise, please post mainlog.html and userreport_hwdetect.txt from each computer. I would suggest that you try connecting both computers with ethernet cables and try connecting to someone else's hosted game, but the problem may not even be at the network at all. Maybe it's caused by competing or disrupting software on one of the computers. I also suggest testing other networked applications, specifically peer-to-peer UDP games like ioquake3.

This is why I have a rule in games that I host where "ghosting", meaning revealing important information as a spectator, is disallowed. It's rare to see spectators revealing information about what's happening in the game, and I think that most hosts disallow this implicitly. I sometimes see them punishing people who reveal information as spectators. Instead, spectators tend to speak in global chat for social reasons, or as an audience reacting to what has already happened in the game. I think that the vast majority of people know what kind of conduct is expected as a spectator.

This was confirmed by the moderation team to be the actual private message that Player of 0AD sent to leopard. Player of 0AD was issued infraction points on the forum for the abusive, harassing, and sexually oriented conduct. Please get along, people. Let this resolve this issue, and be friends or at least neutral, please.

If the error mentions, "Infinite loop initializing attributes detected" then it's probably the hero regicide+garrison bug. This post explains the workaround for it.

Two wrong don't make a right, people. If one person is acting up, it doesn't give you permission to also act up. Let's not be threatening to leave team games based on lies, spreading rumors about moderation based on lies, trying to get moderators canceled based on lies, using lots of duplicate accounts, calling people 1200 or other pejoratives, or for that matter calling a person a cheater when their mod isn't considered by moderators to be cheating, or using the word "pr*ck" many times without explaining what specifically we're concerned about. Please ensure that discussion here is on-topic and is logical discourse based on facts. leopard has expressed concern that he feels like there is a group of people harassing him and spreading lies about him, and gathering more people to do that. Whether this is true, or not, his natural response to that feeling is to fight back. He has a temper that causes him to lash out in defense. That doesn't mean he's provoking people or the cause of everything that Geriatrix has done. That's rewriting history to say that. So, all of you please have patience, see the human behind the words, never attribute to malice that which can otherwise be attributed to ignorance, and calmly state facts instead of just opinions and feelings.

There only way that there is no reason for a "moderator's attention" is when everyone involved is following the lobby terms of use. Since you seem to be friends with Geriatrix, would you please ask him privately to stop doing things that are against the lobby terms of use. Thanks.

There is advice about how to troubleshoot 0ad's sound and music output in the FAQ. Scroll down and read the answer to, "No sound, no audio, or 0 A.D. is the only app with sound".

Please keep posts here on-topic. If someone else did misconduct, please provide evidence in the correct forum topic.

Meanwhile Geriatrix has probably 40 pages of accusations in lobby and in-game chat, and counting. So yeah, we need four pages on addressing the claims of Geriatrix.

If other players did a "hostage situation" then that's not breakfastburrito_007 doing that. I am aware that there is a conflict about whether proGUI is considered cheating. What I have perceived has been political action around that issue, public logical argument attempting to convince others to support an opinion, and perhaps organizing of people to take action such as by establishing a voluntary rule on a per-hoster basis about use of performance-enhancing mods. That's different from a hostage situation based on lies. I don't know how you can say this. The lobby terms of use say that defamation is not allowed. Defamation is "false or unjustified injury of the good reputation of another, as by slander or libel". It involves telling a series of lies or spreading rumors. An example is when Geriatrix lied about why ValihrAnt wasn't playing 0ad as much in June. The lobby terms of use say that threatening is not allowed. A threat is "a declaration of an intention or determination to inflict punishment, injury, etc., in retaliation for, or conditionally upon, some action or course." An example is when Geriatrix threatened to leave a team game if leopard wasn't banned. He later threatened to leave a team game if breakfastburrito_007 wasn't banned. The lobby terms of use also say that pejorative terms are not allowed. A pejorative is "disparaging, derogatory, or belittling, such as bean counter for an accountant". Examples are when Geriatrix called op players 1200, meaning 1200 rated, in public lobby chat several times over the last year, and called leopard p*ssy. The word is censored by the forum, but it's visible if one reads mainlog.html directly. Sources of definitions: defamation, threat, pejorative. I want people to speak the timeless truth, regardless of current friendships or conflicts. I guess that because you didn't answer the question directly, and you didn't make a statement at the time that you started your break from 0ad, that you didn't stop playing 0ad because of breakfastburrito_007.

@AtrikGeriatix has made a claim that you stopped playing 0 A.D. because of breakfastburrito_007. I know it seems absurd, but can you comment on this, please?

Please stay positive, send evidence publicly or privately, and continue speaking the truth. If you give up then the lies win. If you keep pushing then maybe the lies don't win.

Here is an excerpt of relevant messages in public lobby chat around that time. This excerpt contains only the most important messages, specifically claims of lying or misconduct, claims of people leaving because of other people, claims that one person did what another person accuses him of doing, and counterarguments. breakfastburrito_007 sent me the mainlog.html file that contains the chat messages from the incident. Here are the relevant messages. (Connected to Potatoe's game) Geriatrix: /allies Ragnar isn't op DoctorOrgans (1933): /allies Nedris (1449) maybe feed me so i can get rams quick Geriatrix: ban the stupid lier breaking 0AD Geriatrix: free Atrik!!! Nedris (1449): /allies mh ok Pandravabal: where is atrik? Nedris (1449): /allies but not now otherwise i ll cripple myself Geriatrix: free Atrik DoctorOrgans (1933): /allies i will strike quick, kill cc, then get back Geriatrix: he left because of breakfastburrito_007 Geriatrix: ban breakfastburrito_007 or I leave. Geriatrix: 10 sec breakfastburrito_007: /observers i havent even said anything XD Then, according to the log, breakfastburrito_007 was banned by the host. Note that this chat log answers one question immediately: it wasn't breakfastburrito_007 who demanded that Geriatrix be banned, instead it was Geriatrix who demanded that breakfastburrito_007 be banned. Geriatrix's motive for demanding that breakfastburrito_007 be banned was probably because breakfastburrito_007 has spoken up on the forum about Geriatrix's rumor spreading, put truth to his lies about people, mentioned that a ban solved the problem with Shyft_Sierra's continual misconduct, etc. When Geriatrix demanded that the host ban breakfastburrito_007, and threatened to leave if the host didn't, it was like a hostage situation. He held the game hostage until his demand was met. I don't see any good reason for banning breakfastburrito_007, based on the logs. I think that Geriatrix just wanted to attack him in retaliation for standing up to his lies. Hosters, please don't give in to this. Here is what I do when I'm hosting a game and facing a similar situation. I'm speaking as a player, not as a moderator. I try to avoid removing a player who is being very disruptive. I issue warnings and try to get compliance. If the player does not comply then I issue a deferred punishment until after the game is completed. Then I attempt to continue the game. If the player blocks the game from continuing (pauses it or threatens to disconnect) then I request that the player comply or receive a greater punishment. If the player still blocks the game from continuing then I just re without the player and apply the deferred punishment immediately. Punishments usually start at a 1 week ban from my games. If, as a hoster, you decided to appease the hostage taker temporarily then I advise issuing him long-term punishment like a ban from your games unless the behavior stops. Check out the process that I followed for deciding rules for games that I host. All it takes is communicating rules, issuing warnings, and issuing escalating consequences if there isn't compliance with the rules, as well as documenting consequences issued and the times that they will expire. This has gotten results, and users who were formerly disruptive in my games have returned and gotten along for the most part.

Agreed. Please send screenshots and/or mainlog.html files (which contain in-game chat messages) either publicly or privately. Or, at least communicate specific date and time. That way other reports about the same incident can be correlated, and we don't double-count incidents. I did see the public lobby chat message between you and Geriatrix today where Geriatix at one point accused you of demanding that he be banned from the game, and you said it was the other way around, but I would like to see the in-game chat messages, or lack thereof, as well. I know what's most likely the truth, but I want to have facts documented instead of operating based on hearsay. That way it's more difficult for a person to squirm out of consequences for the conduct.

Thanks for posting the screenshot and answering questions and trying some troubleshooting steps on IRC today. My next idea involves changing the version of the nVidia proprietary drivers. This bug report mentions that egl-wayland provided by nVidia may be buggy (especially note bug 119), and when users change to an older or newer version of the nVidia proprietary driver suite then they fix similar issues. For more ideas, see the discussions in bug reports posted about Fedora's package of Wayland. Also, come back to IRC for followup troubleshooting advice.

In order to find the player base, you need to use the latest release version of the game, which is currently version alpha 26. If you're using Linux then it might be necessary to configure a PPA in order to obtain the latest version of 0ad. Otherwise, download and install the latest version for your OS here. Then, yes, login to the lobby in order to find other players.

I've quickly examined Libera.chat's policies and web-based interface. Their policies allow suspension of any member for any reason, which means that it's possible for a tyranny of the majority to occur. That's okay as long as the majority of the members have integrity to the goals and community of Libera.chat. If that changes at some point then we can always change our choice of IRC server. Libera.chat's web-based interface is good because it uses browser notifications. I would accept Libera.chat as our official IRC server, in addition to my other suggestions.

The web-based interface, Element, uses the browser's desktop notification system, so installing a Matrix client isn't necessary. Almost everyone I've invited to talk on Matrix has registered a new account for it. Only an email address is necessary to register a Matrix account, which is great considering that a lot of social media platforms are requiring mobile phone numbers. TLS encrypted real-time chat would certainly be an improvement from what we have currently. Ideally, we would control the data instead of allowing IRC server operators to potentially read our conversations. We will potentially be discussing personal information about users who are in protected categories and being harassed by other users, exposure and mitigation of high priority security flaws, investigation techniques related to network attacks and cheating, etc. Professionals establish defense-in-depth by using end-to-end encryption. They also implement information security policies regarding access to sensitive information. This way if there is a leak then it's easier to trace what the source of the leak was instead of having to consider the possibility of a compromised server or hijacked IRC op accounts.

IRC only supports end-to-end encryption if each person in the conversation supports it. This typically involves using an OTR or PGP plugin and verifying the fingerprint of each person. The average 0ad user who is only talking to a moderator on a temporary basis, for example in order to make a report of misconduct, will probably not be willing to install an IRC client and set all of that up and verify fingerprints in order to talk for an hour. In fact, they're almost always using a web-based interface to IRC. Matrix, on the other hand, supports end-to-end encryption immediately and with no hassles. just make an account, start a group chat with the moderators and you're on your way. IRC's notification system depends on how the web-based interface implements it. QuakeNet's web-based interface just has a relatively quiet beep sound when a user gets a mention or a private message. OFTC's web-based interface requires flash in order to get likely the same quiet beep sound. There's no desktop notification or loud sound, so it makes it difficult to get a new user's attention.

In my opinion, Discord and Matrix have bad interfaces for reading archived messages, because they require linearly scrolling perhaps thousands of pages in order to reach a certain time period, unless search is lucky enough to find it. On the other hand, Matrix group chats are good for efficient interviews about misconduct reporting or troubleshooting advice, because they have end-to-end encryption and good desktop notifications on message receipt. Any communication system that we choose needs to be moderated, which means that we need to have volunteers for moderating it. I don't like the idea of "volunteering" people to do things that we one isn't willing to do oneself. So, we should pay attention to what our moderators are willing to moderate. I am boycotting Discord for privacy reasons. I would be willing to moderate a Matrix presence for WFG if it's only used for real-time communications and messages are auto-deleted after, say, 24 hours. Perhaps Matrix messages could be archived permanently on a website similar to irclogs.wildfiregames.com. I think that the best course of action is both moving to a better IRC server and considering Matrix non-public group chats to be acceptable official WFG communication channels. This would accomplish the goals of security and privacy for all use cases. I think that what everybody should have learned from the Freenode fiasco is that the fundamental flaw was not the people running it, which can change unexpectedly, but the structure of the organization. Libera.chat (according to vv221) replicates the excessively centralized structure of Freenode. Yes, this is a concern. We could end up with the "September that never ended", having to answer the same questions on Matrix over and over. Also, some public Matrix rooms I'm in are being spammed on a regular basis. We don't see spam in our IRC channels.

Apparently Wayland isn't the default video output driver used by SDL2. It may be necessary to tell SDL to use Wayland instead of X11 with the following command on the Terminal. Or, it may be necessary to tell it to use X11 if you happen to have a version of SDL that defaults to using Wayland (version 2.0.22) and bugs in your graphics drivers, etc. cause issues with Wayland. SDL_VIDEODRIVER=wayland /path/to/0ad The post here has links with more information.

Spying and determining who is behind a smurf account is the only effective means of enforcing a ban, should it be necessary. He wasn't stopping his defamation, insults, arbitrary banning of users from his games, demands for other hosts to arbitrarily ban users from their games, etc., until he realized that he was close to being banned. Deescalation and reintegration would be great, I would like to see Geriatrix / Cedric_O do that. I think that the only reason he's been quiet is because he is this close to being banned for his behavior. The next move is not to ignore him and lose track of his suspected unauthorized duplicate accounts.

There is a rule against unauthorized duplicate accounts. It's difficult to enforce without "the village" helping moderators enforce it. Moderators tend to only enforce it when there is misconduct done by the user behind those accounts, as in this case. If someone attacked you on the street, then retreated and put on a disguise, you would be looking for the person behind the disguise too, wouldn't you? They're not banned yet. They're being monitored. Help us identify Geriatrix's next new names please. You want him to follow the rules, too, right? Please read this article. You can translate it with Google Translate by copy/pasting the URL into the source text entry box and clicking on the link that appears in the destination text box. The French phrase "mort aux cons" translates to "death to idiots". It originated in WWII and was associated with statements like there weren't enough bullets to kill all of the idiots. We don't allow players to use names associated with top leadership of National Socialism forces during WWII, and we don't allow them to use names associated with top leadership of Communist forces during WWII. There is historic documentation of genocide committed by both sides. Similarly, the lobby terms of use don't allow players to make statements that imply violence. I'm glad that you're speaking up MarcusAurelius. It's good to get communication flowing so that we can correct misunderstandings. The goal is not to escalate. The goal is to get a permanent correction of the misconduct. You can help with it. You can talk to your friend and ask him to comply with the rules.