Design: Civillization Name

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

My proposal is this:

To make it easier for modder and even for sequels to the official game to add civs of same culture, I think game should create new civ name format like in screenshot. I have done this for my mod and think it will help players as well as developers and modders keep things straight.

So, I have renamed the civs like below (bold is modded civs and possible future civs to show you how they would fit and keep things straight):

Carthaginians

Celts (Brythonic)

Celts (Gallic)

Celts (Galatian)

Chinese (Han)

Dacians

Egyptians (New Kingdom)

Egyptians (Ptolemaic)

Germans (Frankish)

Germans (Gothic)

Germans (Suebian)

Greeks (Athenian)

Greeks (Spartan)

Greeks (Theban)

Huns

Iberians

Iberians (Celt-Iberian)

Iberians (Lusitanian)

Indians (Guptan)

Indians (Mauryan)

Macedonians

Parthians

Persians (Achaemenid)

Persians (Sassanid)

Romans (Byzantine)

Romans (Imperial)

Romans (Republican)

Sarmatians

Scythians

Seleucids

Just an idea. I add it to my mod regardless. As famous forummer say: "Enjoy the choice!"

Edited March 16, 2015 by wowgetoffyourcellphone

[Lion.Kanzen]

May be give a class like the units in description or something , I like the idea.

Are some modder interesting in made a huge macro empire earth with 0AD engines capable to cover most of human history.

This can be use for parents civs like Seleucids and Pontus kingdom or Romans and Bizantines a faction evolves into other becomes by a revolt ( AOE 3 and Revolution system)

[Sighvatr]

I really don't like how distant the time periods are for the civilizations in 0 A.D. It doesn't make me feel any better to see the later periods of Rome mixed in with the earlier.

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

I really don't like how distant the time periods are for the civilizations in 0 A.D. It doesn't make me feel any better to see the later periods of Rome mixed in with the earlier.

Conceit of 0 A.D. is "time that never was." 0 A.D. supposed to span Antiquity. regardless, this post isn't about that, it about naming convention.

May be give a class like the units in description or something , I like the idea.

Are some modder interesting in made a huge macro empire earth with 0AD engines capable to cover most of human history.

This can be use for parents civs like Seleucids and Pontus kingdom or Romans and Bizantines a faction evolves into other becomes by a revolt ( AOE 3 and Revolution system)

I don't know about all that. I'm just talking about name of civs that is more descriptive and places them in list that makes their relationships more clear.

Edited March 16, 2015 by wowgetoffyourcellphone

[Zeta1127]

Other than preferring the use of the name Hellenes for the Greeks, I like where this is going.

[Lion.Kanzen]

Conceit of 0 A.D. is "time that never was." 0 A.D. supposed to span Antiquity. regardless, this post isn't about that, it about naming convention.

I don't know about all that. I'm just talking about name of civs that is more descriptive and places them in list that makes their relationships more clear.

some of my advanced plans for the game and the engine, may be the campaing, on of my

Ace card , but this need be more advanced developenmt (beta ? Second part ?) , but your idea can be one pillar of that.

[wraitii]

I'd do the opposite, like

Brythonic (Celts)

Gauls (Celts)

Ptolemaic (Egyptians)

Spartans (Greek)

Athenians (Greek)

In the end we could have a selection screen kind of like AoM.

[fcxSanya]

I'd do the opposite, like

Brythonic (Celts)

<...>

The original proposal has the advantage of grouping ethnic groups (Celts, Greeks) using alphabetical sorting, while with your approach they should be explicitly sorted (what requires some additional data, but provides more flexibility).

[wraitii]

This is not true if you specify it separately in the JSon, you can just sort by group name directly.

[fcxSanya]

This is not true if you specify it separately in the JSon, you can just sort by group name directly.

Are you talking about specifying the entire list in a single JSON array? In this case how we are going to handle mods which concurrently add separate civs?

Edit: or about specifiying the group name in each civ's JSON?

Edited March 16, 2015 by fcxSanya

[wraitii]

Second option.

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Of course I prefer something like AOM. That was very good.

But if stay with droplist it would be better I think to group them like how I propose.

wraitti: You saying then we could give a "culture" to the civs in the civ Jsons and then they could be group that way?

Edited March 17, 2015 by wowgetoffyourcellphone

[wraitii]

Wowgetoffyourcellphone: that's what I'm saying, yes. I definitely agree with you on the AoM-like screen, though it would be good to have all civs in one screen and no scrolling, so maybe have smaller shields. But that's implementation details.

[serveurix]

[...]

This screen is excellent. The possibility to have a faction randomly chosen in a set of selected factions is a must-have.

[s0600204]

Probably goes without saying, but the AOM-style civ-selection screen would need some thought put into it to permit the addition of further civs via mods. But like wraitii said, that's implementation. Remind me, was that a mockup, or something that was actually implemented by someone?

The civ *.json files already have a "culture" attribute. I don't think it's used at the moment. For the most part it's just the same as the civ code of the civ. I suppose it should become an array (because for example, as I understand it, ptols are both egyptian and successors)

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

Hmm, so with culture attribute I imagine some possibility.

Can List them in dropmenu by culture, like this:

Random All

Celts

Britons

Gauls

Egyptians

Ptolemies

Hellenes

Athenians

Macedonians

Spartans

Iberians

Iberians

Indians

Mauryans

Italians

Romans (Republicans)

Persians

Achaemenids

Punics

Carthaginians

Successors

Macedonians

Ptolemies

Seleucids

Can choose from the list. Now imagine player can also have choice to choose "Hellenes" and that random the civ for that player only Athenian, Macks, or Spartans. Choose "Successor" from list to random Macks, Ptolemies, or Seleucid. As you can see, like s0600204 say, culture can be array in json to allow civ to be place in more than one culture.

Later, with mod and sequels, more civs can be added in existing culure or more cultures added dynamic from json.

My super awesome amazing imagination list 10 yrs from now (llmao):

Africans

Garamantines

Kushites

Numidians

Ptolemies

Celts

Batavians

Britons

Galatians

Gauls

Chinese

Han

Daco-Thracians

Dacians

Thracians

Egyptians

Ptolemies

Germans

Batavians

Franks

Goths

Suebi

Teutones

Hellenes

Athenians

Macedonians

Spartans

Syracusans

Thebans

Iberians

Celt-Iberians

Iberians

Lusitanians

Indians

Indo-Greeks

Mauryans

Guptas

Italians

Etruscans

Romans (Imperials)

Romans (Republicans)

Samnites

Persians

Achaemenids

Palmyrans

Sassanids

Punics

Carthaginians

Steppes

Huns

Parthians

Sarmatians

Scythians

Successors

Epirotes

Greco-Bactrians

Macedonians

Pergamenes

Ptolemies

Pontians

Rhodians

Seleucids

Edited March 18, 2015 by wowgetoffyourcellphone

[fcxSanya]

Remind me, was that a mockup, or something that was actually implemented by someone?

I believe it's just a mockup (originally posted here).

[Lion.Kanzen]

@s0600204 can you work in this proposal?

[s0600204]

@s0600204 can you work in this proposal?

My apologies for the delay in responding - work has gotten busy recently. If there's enough interest, I could look into experimentally putting an AOM-style interface together. But it would have to wait until I have some spare time.

I believe it's just a mockup (originally posted here).

Ah, thank you.

[Lion.Kanzen]

that can be sounds interestign to me I love work with interfaces

[Wijitmaker]

Fun fact

10 years ago 0 A.D. originally had only these civs:

Celts

Hellenes

Iberians

Romans

Persians

Carthaginians

Two of the civs "branched" into sub-civs (celts - britons, gauls & hellens - sparta & athens). But, this was intended to happen during the game as a strategic choice - not something you decide and set in stone before the game even started.

The choice would have shown itself during one of the town/city upgrade phases, and would have affected the hero choices, special structures, and late game technologies.

I'm not saying the existing method is bad, just that I personally like the concept better (more strategy, easier to balance) than having dozens of civs that are slightly different from each other to choose from at the start. But... it is no longer my decision to make and hasn't been for years. I'm just throwing the idea back on the table

[s0600204]

The choice would have shown itself during one of the town/city upgrade phases, and would have affected the hero choices, special structures, and late game technologies.

In the Aristeia mod, the New Kingdom Egyptian civilisation currently presents the player with a choice when choosing the city-phase tech - to go with a Theban or a Ramesside city phase. Although not reflected fully in art yet, the two choices provide different heroes, champion units and selection of city-phase structures.

My point being, the idea is not entirely lost.

Edited March 27, 2015 by s0600204

[s0600204]

Work in progress:

If you'd like to try it then the following should work:

• (A18) https://github.com/s0600204/0ad-civselection-mod
• (SVN) https://github.com/s0600204/0ad-civselection-mod/tree/SVN (Note: untested)

Neither is compatible with han_china or millenniumad mods, due to relocated civ json files (aristeia works).

Lion: if you'd like to help, I could do with a couple of small icons, about 16x16px, as indicated by the (terribly drawn, sorry) arrows below.

• This is a button that opens the civ selection dialog for the given player
• These are buttons that select the group of civs under their respective headings

[niektb]

Very nice!

[Andrettin]

Fun fact

10 years ago 0 A.D. originally had only these civs:

Celts

Hellenes

Iberians

Romans

Persians

Carthaginians

Two of the civs "branched" into sub-civs (celts - britons, gauls & hellens - sparta & athens). But, this was intended to happen during the game as a strategic choice - not something you decide and set in stone before the game even started.

The choice would have shown itself during one of the town/city upgrade phases, and would have affected the hero choices, special structures, and late game technologies.

I'm not saying the existing method is bad, just that I personally like the concept better (more strategy, easier to balance) than having dozens of civs that are slightly different from each other to choose from at the start. But... it is no longer my decision to make and hasn't been for years. I'm just throwing the idea back on the table

I think that's a great idea. I did something similar for Wyrmsun, with Germanics -> Teutons (West Germanic)/Goths/Norse. I think it would work very well for the Celts and Greeks branching into their subfactions, and would be a more interesting mechanic than having many visually similar civilizations available to choose from.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Andrettin