LetswaveaBook Posted June 9, 2021 Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 On this forum I see frequently people mentioning metal shortages in 4v4s and negative game effects. I don´t understand why people call it a problem, since I see it as a choice. People decide to play a map&game mode which is short of metal. There is no difficulty in creating a mod that adds an extra metal mine near the starting position of your CC. For me it seems that the people who play these4v4 settings, chose the map to be such that there is a metal shortage. So I wonder, if everyone dislikes those metal shortages, why did nobody made a mainland map where there are 2 starting metal mines? Why do people consider metal shortages as a balance issue instead of a map issue? These are the things I don´t understand about 4v4 players. I also added a mod that adds an extra starting metal mine near the CC on mainland. Honestly that is a mod that everyone could construct and I don´t know why I even post it. MoreMetalMainland.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreakfastBurrito_007 Posted June 9, 2021 Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) It is indeed a map issue, however I think it would be nice if forts and towers costed a bit more stone. In a23 stone ran out a bit before metal because of the amount of slingers everyone was making, usually this would happen around minute 30 rather than 20, in most games people never saw stone completely run out, unless you were unlucky enough to only get one 5000 stone source. In a24 about half the time players can expect to have only 1 metal mine. 26 minutes ago, LetswaveaBook said: For me it seems that the people who play these4v4 settings, chose the map to be such that there is a metal shortage. Right now choosing map to increase metal means choosing a larger map, many players don't like this due to sometimes increased lag and some players just don't like walking so far. I usually like playing on bigger maps for 4v4s. I would like it if there was a size between medium and large, or better yet, a slider between minimum map size and maximum, with a percentage listed for consistency. Beyond metal supply issues, there is also the problem of having a maximum rate of 24 people on metal for one mine. Probably this is also solved by your mod. It remains to be seen how bad the metal problem is in a25. Edited June 9, 2021 by BreakfastBurrito_007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetswaveaBook Posted June 9, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 8 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said: It remains to be seen how bad the metal problem is in a25. It would not be the metal problem of a25. It is in my view the metal problem of the map. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValihrAnt Posted June 9, 2021 Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 There already is the balanced maps mod which does this and more. Was very used in a23 but didn't really take off for this release. Probably comes down to it not being on the ingame mod downloader and a few specific people not being bothered to push for it to be more widely used as their map gen rng is through the roof. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alre Posted June 9, 2021 Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 balanced map mod should really be in the game. I am not a fan of enforced symmetry, but that kind of balancing just makes the game smoother. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValihrAnt Posted June 9, 2021 Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 It only forces same amount of starting metal and stone every game, food is random each time but the total amount for each player remains equal. Being able to have equal food per team and not just player would be a cool addition too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrstgtr Posted June 10, 2021 Report Share Posted June 10, 2021 5 hours ago, ValihrAnt said: Being able to have equal food per team and not just player would be a cool addition too. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wraitii Posted June 10, 2021 Report Share Posted June 10, 2021 I think 2 metal mines at the start is a rather boring solution. I've made a diff fore more/better mine layout, please test on Mainland: D4148 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maroder Posted June 10, 2021 Report Share Posted June 10, 2021 I like the idea. Long term we need to see if the mining rates then need to be adjusted, when you have no longer a problem to find resources. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wraitii Posted June 11, 2021 Report Share Posted June 11, 2021 I've updated my diff https://code.wildfiregames.com/D4148, it makes essentially 2 changes to the Best for MP maps: On 1v1 small, same amount of metal but slightly more mines on the map to avoid situations where you have _nothing_. On 4v4 medium, expected metal goes from 90K or so to 140K. That's still less per player than you'd get in a 1v1, but it's a _lot_ more. I expect this will make 4v4 more playable overall. Planning to merge soon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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