Monetization

[itrelles]

I AM CRAZY

 BUT THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I GOT ANSWER, I WONT ASK NO MORE (=))

IF OUR BRAVE LEADER STOP LOVING HIS UNBORN SON, HOW CAN WE KEEP ON LOVING 0 AD?

HOW?! TELL ME!! I NEED ANSWERS!!!

I DONT KNOW WHAT 501 C 3 MEANS

HAT IS A SOMBRERO 
 

Spoiler

 

 

AND THIS IS EASY LASAGNA

Edited March 13, 2019 by elexis
Added spoiler

[WhiteTreePaladin]

Quote

Doing something again and again  is the deffinition of insanity. 

Only if it doesn't work... Otherwise we're all in serious trouble.

[itrelles]

1 million dl

1000 different players per month

0.001 retaining gamers %

u are all op failling on keeping players in 0 ad 

there is something that  isnt working

and then someone begging in lobby for donations... very rude

donations to improve the game, for us players to keep on comming

i love this game, but its feels like a boat, where us players are the sailors (1000) and then there are 30 captains that dont make decissions, so boat doesnt move and sailors leave

mucho cacique y poco indio in spanish, (too many chefs in the kitchen) only one chef is needed

we eat mayo here, no ketchup

Spoiler

 

 

Edited March 13, 2019 by elexis
Added spoiler

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, itrelles said:

i love this game, but its feels like a boat, where us players are the sailors (1000) and then there are 30 captains that dont make decissions, so boat doesnt move and sailors leave

From an outsiders PoV, that is a pretty accurate analogy. However, outsiders can't be sure about the decisions part. Who knows what sort of things are being discussed internally. The opposite is also possible. Where the analogy is infact true.

Edited March 13, 2019 by Guest

[Diatryma]

5 minutes ago, (-_-) said:

From an outsiders PoV, that is a pretty accurate analogy. However, outsiders can't be sure about the decisions part. Who knows what sort of things are being discussed internally.

imagine this matter from fans outside the forum, the official channels through social media do not share much news. is small the amount of information about the project, people who wonder if it is dead.

[elexis]

31 minutes ago, Diatryma said:

the official channels through social media do not share much news

Software development and artwork are rarely discussed on the internal staff forums. Wildfire Games software development social media feed is http://irclogs.wildfiregames.com/. Everytime a bug is reported on http://trac.wildfiregames.com/, everytime a patch is uploaded to Phabricator at http://code.wildfiregames.com/ or a comment posted in response, the irc bot posts a comment in the chat. So by following IRClogs, you will follow most of what developers did that day. Artists use the public forums.

31 minutes ago, Diatryma said:

people who wonder if it is dead. 

The project struggled with many obstructions and unsolveable conflicts, even since it's founding in 2001 if we can believe the records (failed total conversion mod). In 2009 it was made free source because of a serious lack of developers. So the problem is not new at all.

48 minutes ago, itrelles said:

i love this game, but its feels like a boat, where us players are the sailors (1000) and then there are 30 captains that dont make decissions, so boat doesnt move and sailors leave 

You're implying that donations equal content, but it's not as simple as that. First of all one needs donations, WFG received ("only") USD 2000 in surplus 2018. Secondly if one has funds, then one still needs to decide for which purpose they will be used, which is quite difficult (one person gets 28cent per hour, the other person only 8 cent per hour? or one person gets 25k for a new pathfinder and everyone else gets nothing at all?). The third problem is finding someone who can actually accomplish the decided purposes to Wildfire Games satisfaction (people who are capable of writing and integrating a new pathfinder are extremely rare, people who can write it in a bug-free, well planned way even more rare). There are a number of unutilized means in 501(c)(3) to address some of these problems creatively, hopefully in this decade. But even if the revenue is increased by a factor of 5, it would remain mayonnaise paygrade. 0 A.D. is a public good, written for public interest and unless we change that, it will inevitably depend on voluntarism.

[itrelles]

 

32 minutes ago, (-_-) said:

outsiders PoV

from and outsider point of view? lol ty 

27 minutes ago, Diatryma said:

outsiders can't be sure about the decisions part

im not sure, i told ... "its feels like" 

but me beeing a intelligent human being and doted w eyes that can read in lobby, forum, inside games,  whatsapp and facebook in 4 languages its feels to me that somehow some old players are talking about the good old days inside  0ad... new players asking for changes

1 hour ago, (-_-) said:

The opposite is also possible. Where the analogy is infact true.

i told that analogy cause is how the intendance in montevideo work,

u cant fire a public worker, 

50% of public workers dont really work,

and in every important office only 1 or 2 really making something

i dont know, i want 0 ad to grow much stronger, 

i even offer to finance wfg...

cause im a kind outsider, and i love raviolis 

 

 

 

[elexis]

11 minutes ago, itrelles said:

i even offer to finance wfg...

That proposal was lending, i.e. going into debt. You had proposed selling a singleplayer campaign to get return of investment, but that violates the idea of free software for the public benefit, even if one can find some legal way around it; on top of being likely to not gain sufficient payments. If on the other side one assumes that enough people would pay for a singleplayer campaign, then the same people could donate to that cause in advance instead of buying a license afterwards; and the result would be a free singleplayer campaign for everyone. The only difference to a for-profit model is that one can't make more money than covering the costs of creation.

[itrelles]

19 minutes ago, elexis said:

people who wonder if it is dead.

never dead, NEVER SURRENDER, just eternally posponed, cause there is too much talking

 

21 minutes ago, elexis said:

You're implying that donations equal content

i never impli and is difficult for me to express via this way,

donations are aleatory,  like moral of wfg workers

real salary its allways the same, same date all months,

i "impli" that when donations are high people are happy and amused w high moral and work faster happier and better

and when donations are low... no work done, or ok work, 

and when donations are negative? what will happen?

28 minutes ago, elexis said:

First of all one needs donations

i dont think so

 

29 minutes ago, elexis said:

then one still needs to decide for which purpose they will be used

very easy, make a 15 step campaign so op noobs learn how to pro play,

if op noobs or new players learn how to be good quicker they will stay, 

ive seen moderators crushing new player just for fun, and then calling them noob,,, lausy attitude, toxic players will put water inside the boat and slow down the whole project

1 learn how to op explore

2 learn how to op hunt

3 learn how to op farm

4 learn how to chop wood, 

5 learn how to rush

6 learn how to boat

etc etc etc etc etc

tips, maybe sexi valihrant voice talking, borg tips before starting a match could help 2

lot of tips, an image of a keyboard....... i have to learn by miself and watching all the tips

then learned some more w borg... u know, not everybody is here since 2001...

i just learned that u cant tilt by mistake,,,

40 minutes ago, elexis said:

one person gets 28cent per hour, the other person only 8 cent per hour

i dont understand how u pay cause im an outsider, 

 

42 minutes ago, elexis said:

or one person gets 25k for a new pathfinder and everyone else gets nothing at all?

i think this isnt the 0 AD way, TEAM PLAY 100%, but brains are importanter than artist. sry artist i love u all

 

43 minutes ago, elexis said:

The third problem is finding someone who can actually accomplish the decided purposes

money do that

 

44 minutes ago, elexis said:

Wildfire Games satisfaction

are wilfire satisfactions the same now that in 2001 or that in 2008?

define satisfaction? see your life work beeing loved by every possible person who loves rts? millions of 30ish rich north americans and europeans

45 minutes ago, elexis said:

people who are capable of writing and integrating a new pathfinder are extremely rare, people who can write it in a bug-free, well planned way even more rare

i know, i cant help in here. NEVER SURRENDER, u have already a big web of contributors and known people, u should start there

48 minutes ago, elexis said:

501(c)(3)

non hackerman language plz

 

48 minutes ago, elexis said:

hopefully in this decade

 

2 hours ago, (-_-) said:

Who knows what sort of things are being discussed internally

decade discussions are op for fillosofers

 

52 minutes ago, elexis said:

mayonnaise

i liek german humor

[itrelles]

5 minutes ago, elexis said:

That proposal was lending

the proposal was an alliance so u could finish the game, i give money so wfg workers could do a living and then we shared, if no money gets in well i guess it was a wrong investment to do,

but i would never ask for the money back, its like putting a torpedo to a bike so it can go faster and get to the finish line

u overstimate people, persons are very dumb, and this game sells nostalgia, and people loves nostalgia, it s avery strong sentimen, rts fans are almost all older peoples,

and this game has 1 000 000 millions dl...

never lending, thats bad people stuff

 

[itrelles]

the second proposal was to start over again and make a new payed game (500 AD) w the same people involved in this but all getting payed and w shared % benefits for all involved, 

all // to 0 ad

and the third one was something like wikipedia does once a year but w a campaign reward at the end, i keep on thinking o campaign cause when i first dl 0 ad and i saw it hasnt campaing it took me like 8 month to dl it again, and i dont know exxactly how or why i came back, but i did, i believe in 0 ad

i think im in love 

[elexis]

3 minutes ago, itrelles said:

i dont understand how u pay cause im an outsider, 

As mentioned, the financial data is public https://spi-inc.org/corporate/annual-reports/. Right now the donations are used to pay server costs, travel to software conventions and held in reserve otherwise. The point was that it would be hard to decide who deserved which fraction of the donations with the current means.

14 minutes ago, itrelles said:

donations are aleatory,  like moral of wfg workers 

Not if the money is not used for developer compensation. Also I would assume that the ones who are motivated by less than 1$ per hour are the exception.

15 minutes ago, itrelles said:

and when donations are negative? what will happen? 

Running costs to exist, about $100 per month for the servers. Luckily not a problem for now. I guess one can ask what happens if one divides by zero (and even find the result).

5 minutes ago, itrelles said:

define satisfaction?

 I meant software quality. We had two developers who succeeded to create a new pathfinder for 0 A.D., and two people who created new pathfinding code that was rejected.

12 minutes ago, itrelles said:

decade discussions are op for fillosofers

and for people who want to get to know the board, the pieces and create a strategy before rolling the dice.

14 minutes ago, itrelles said:

the proposal was an alliance so u could finish the game, i give money so wfg workers could do a living and then we shared, if no money gets in well i guess it was a wrong investment to do.

Well that sounds a lot better than debt. Still, the question is how return of investment should be possible without breaking the free software ethics.

24 minutes ago, itrelles said:

1 hour ago, elexis said:

501(c)(3)

non hackerman language plz

501(c)(3) is the non-profit status. Otherwise: "If you understood me, I might not have expressed myself inscrutable enough." (attributed to Alan Greenspan)

31 minutes ago, itrelles said:

1 hour ago, elexis said:

The third problem is finding someone who can actually accomplish the decided purposes

money do that

Doesn't. You can hire a random guy to create a pathfinder with 20k, but he will stop working on that once he runs out of paid time (and a pathfinder can take a year depending on the scope of changes), and then it's not clear whether it's of the quality necessary for Wildfire Games. If one has millions and billions to throw at it, money may solve that. But for $1 per hour there's not much that this money can provide beyond symbolic support and ravioli.

19 minutes ago, itrelles said:

payed game (500 AD)

That would be legal  if one creates a for-profit entity to handle that money instead of going through SPI, and if the interpretation of GPL would be stretched. The question is whether it would be right ethically to do that. 0 A.D. was started in 2001 as an Age of Kings mod, but they failed because it was closed source, so they created the entire game from scratch. It would betray our founding ideals to not make 500 A.D. free software. Still possible to do that, but for me, I'm here because this is free as in freedom and puts the user first, not the corporation.

35 minutes ago, itrelles said:

persons are very dumb

You are right about that, in the sense that one needs to minimize the threshold for the donor and maximize the incentive to donate. Many players don't even know that it's possible to donate. There's some potential to gain.

26 minutes ago, itrelles said:

wikipedia does once a year but w a campaign reward at the end

They have rewards? I don't know. Wildfire Games campaign in 2013 came with merchandise as a reward, it cost somewhere above $5k of $33k donations received. One could also do a merchandise shop under non-profit status I think. But the problem is that includes ordering, receiving, packaging and sending out all the physical items.

The reason that WFG had not run further funding campaigns (other than the PayPal Donate button on the website) is that we already had trouble finding someone to legitimately receive the funds from last campaign (it said donations for the pathfinder and for singleplayer campaigns, and the one developer who did create a new pathfinder didn't want the money). If one changes the formula, one can try again.

35 minutes ago, itrelles said:

i first dl 0 ad and i saw it hasnt campaing it took me like 8 month to dl it again

I downloaded 0 A.D. in 2014 for the first time and saw a big message that the game is totally unfinished and unplayable, then I uninstalled it immediately and regretted that lot after noticing a year later that it was very playable by then already.

[Gurken Khan]

27 minutes ago, elexis said:

One could also do a merchandise shop under non-profit status I think. But the problem is that includes ordering, receiving, packaging and sending out all the physical items. 

I believe there are a lot of companies who'd be happy to handle all that. A very brief search brought this up, for example:

Quote

We do the heavy lifting

No need to worry about payments, production, fulfillment or shipping. We've got that covered at no cost to you.

Merch might be worth looking into, I think there'd be people buying. And if there's a chance for some bucks without risk...

[itrelles]

19 minutes ago, elexis said:

As mentioned, the financial data is public https://spi-inc.org/corporate/annual-reports/. Right now the donations are used to pay server costs, travel to software conventions and held in reserve otherwise. The point was that it would be hard to decide who deserved which fraction of the donations with the current means.

if nobody gets money and all donations goes to server maintance or europe software reunions why should be difficult to fraction donation in a profitable magical future to each memeber iof the team if they dont really care about money? 

 

23 minutes ago, elexis said:

https://spi-inc.org/corporate/annual-reports/.

i saw a picture full of faties there, i assume they dont starve  lol

27 minutes ago, elexis said:

1 hour ago, itrelles said:

donations are aleatory,  like moral of wfg workers 

Not if the money is not used for developer compensation. Also I would assume that the ones who are motivated by less than 1$ per hour are the exception.

then i assume that u will feel the same if this game reach 100.000 different players per month

 

30 minutes ago, elexis said:

and even find the result

calculator says error, i guess its some mathematcal new number

 

31 minutes ago, elexis said:

I meant software quality

software wuality is ok, u want more cause u are all beatifull perfectionist,  but its nt time to be that, its time to get and retain gamers inside 0 ad

i think then u all here love to make games for life, and u should, never stop NEVER SURRENDER

u make people op happy even with lawsy pathfinding

36 minutes ago, elexis said:

and for people who want to get to know the board, the pieces and create a strategy before rolling the dice.

i think sometimes u just have to act, but u op iq math guys overthink a lot

38 minutes ago, elexis said:

Well that sounds a lot better than debt. Still, the question is how return of investment should be possible without breaking the free software ethics.

it is normal in southamerica for people to use and charge free linux software, even our president son made that w venezuela goverment,  u are not sellmans, u are all logic intelligent peoples, and world isnt logic at all, 

europe was never ethical, and new century and millenium will bring past back to present

 

42 minutes ago, elexis said:

"If you understood me, I might not have expressed myself inscrutable enough." (attributed to Alan Greenspan)

worst than¨ "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

 

44 minutes ago, elexis said:

Doesn't. You can hire a random guy to create a pathfinder with 20k, but he will stop working on that once he runs out of paid time (and a pathfinder can take a year depending on the scope of changes), and then it's not clear whether it's of the quality necessary for Wildfire Games. If one has millions and billions to throw at it, money may solve that. But for $1 per hour there's not much that this money can provide beyond symbolic support and ravioli.

yes it does,

why random?

what if paid could never run out

but again, u dont need that now, for me, maybe u need it cause u are all perfectionist

raviolis are supported by forks

48 minutes ago, elexis said:

That would be legal  if one creates a for-profit entity to handle that money instead of going through SPI, and if the interpretation of GPL would be stretched. The question is whether it would be right ethically to do that. 0 A.D. was started in 2001 as an Age of Kings mod, but they failed because it was closed source, so they created the entire game from scratch. It would betray our founding ideals to not make 500 A.D. free software. Still possible to do that, but for me, I'm here because this is free as in freedom and puts the user first, not the corporation.

not betraying, evolving, and u can make it free later, but to make more games more quick u need money, as in 0AD, without food wood, gold or stone u do nothing, all those commodities are traded w money now, 

u are here cause u are accepted here, and i think all people who wants to participate are accepted in here 2, not like in other jobs... but if for you freedm its beeing 12 hours in front a pc workinf for 1 dollar an hour,,, we thin very different, for me freedom its to do what i love and to eat raviolis, sometime sex is good to llololollolol

 

55 minutes ago, elexis said:

There's some potential to gain.

 i talked with one player some weeks ago and i told him that we should donate, after i got harrased on 0 ad to donate,  he was willing to donate 200 dollars, and hi lived in some bad sudaca country

 

57 minutes ago, elexis said:

They have rewards?

yes, the information they give to u, i use to have encarta 95, it was payed, now w wikipedia the somehow changed the sistem...

the reward is the knowllege, like the reward working on 0 ad for free, 

 

58 minutes ago, elexis said:

I downloaded 0 A.D. in 2014

i thought u where here from start =O

=O 

=O

=O

 

[itrelles]

25 minutes ago, Gurken Khan said:

Merch might be worth looking into

this is the only merchandising i thought it could be very profitable, vintage BOX, w mediterranean poster map showing diff civ locations etc, and op book w civ information and history,

like 20 years ago games where sold

[Gurken Khan]

7 minutes ago, itrelles said:

this is the only merchandising i thought it could be very profitable, vintage BOX, w mediterranean poster map showing diff civ locations etc, and op book w civ information and history,

Hm, yeah. I was thinking more of t-shirts and mugs n stuff.

Logos etc might be good, but depending on what the community comes up with, it could also be landscapes, classicist motives, medieval, ~fantasy, FOSS related, geek humor, pandering to bronies...

[Diatryma]

My point is that the Facebook page and other social networks and includes I think that the main page are always lacking in information comments can always read the same questions or there is always good feedback about the game is great that the cool juice that the game is the best and that I will not come to discuss, But if you always find the same questions, "When will you go out" "when to see the next monetization campaign". 

What elexis said and asked the question that one always finds in the forums of who is a private project that is open source that does not seek to earn money with this and obviously that are noble causes 

But once again what you see externally in the forums (because I know you have another forum inside where you are going to have a lot of things that must be very cloudy) never comes out of all that is discussed externally (forum) even though it is a small group of trees like the Lordgood has climbed on the Trac. They are never shared on the official website and this is a big waste.
 
 I know you don't have anyone specialized in this area. and I think you should have or expose that other needs, apart from art programming (and I'm not sure what other areas have, I think you have historians but not a department (some disorganization).

 The only thing that the public (your fans) know is that you have programming departments and that you have an art department, and what maybe you have music, so I myself am right now doing a good feedback on these comments, would be considered if you had a public relations department as "small" errors in a chain of communication that highlights how bad you are doing in this area, all this at least outside the forum. many times it is not transmitted completely to the outside, for example there is no development in terms of "what is being done in art". or what is needed as volunteers and what departments, have not asked if they need volunteers on social networks, it seems to me that it is not as if they do not need help more than in programming and art.
 because it seems to me that the documents you handle also need some kind of curator, or some expert to fix what it is without updating within the Wiki.

Now if we go to youtubers in the questions are always quite rare questions always the same thing, "when this project is going to come out", "the project is still alive", "already died" "what happened because you do not finance?" "why is it not in Steam?" "you do not get it in Epic games Stotre?".... etc... and so on," "If at some point you are going to charge for this" (many ignore this kind of projects or their nature) there are a lot of questions like that for all your social networks.

Also I thought I read that you have a topic of Q&A but I didn't give it much importance and I already forgot where it is. (another small flaw).

 

my point is from that perspective outside the forum, seeing your trac seems that users do not know how to report or what to do under certain common circumstances. or how to install a mod properly. many questions far away from the answers which have been here, I imagine that this happens quite a lot on your reddit.

 

[camel]

8 hours ago, Gurken Khan said:

Hm, yeah. I was thinking more of t-shirts and mugs n stuff.

Logos etc might be good, but depending on what the community comes up with, it could also be landscapes, classicist motives, medieval, ~fantasy, FOSS related, geek humor, pandering to bronies...

I would buy some 0AD t-shirtr or some stuff about it.  

 

2 hours ago, Diatryma said:

 The only thing that the public (your fans) know is that you have programming departments and that you have an art department, and what maybe you have music, so I myself am right now doing a good feedback on these comments, would be considered if you had a public relations department as "small" errors in a chain of communication that highlights how bad you are doing in this area, all this at least outside the forum.

Public relations department or some ppl who knows about merchandising will help a lot.

 

 

Also i told to elexis long time ago, normally in all games, or some money games , u dont see the connection and disconnection inside the lobby or menu, that indirectly encourages u to disconnect from the game.

 

 

 

 We eat mayo here, no ketchup. Peace

 

[Guest]

12 hours ago, elexis said:

In 2009 it was made free source because of a serious lack of developers. So the problem is not new at all. 

Doesn't make it any less of a problem. You would still need to do something about it. Things do not fix themselves. Therefore, a better question to ask is what is being done to fix it this time?

[Sundiata]

Honestly, a lot of you talk about 0AD like it's a commercial project (somebody had the nerve to suggest adds in the game and forum). Like we have anxious investors that need to be appeased by rushing development to release an unfinished bug-ridden game full of broken features and broken promises. A lot of us are here because we are tired and disillusioned by the dishonest and predatory money grab schemes the big developers are currently specializing in.    

Even high quality indie games can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars, and AAA can cost tens of millions, even more. And 0AD is routinely compared to the best!! RTS games are incredibly complex to make, especially if they're fully 3D, which is one of the reasons you don't see so many of them being made. With all the doubt and sometimes even negativity from a handful of "fans" these days, I have to ask, which recent Historical RTS are you all playing that's so much greater than 0AD that you're all "threatening" to jump ship? Empires Apart??? lol! 

0AD has never been greater! Or as popular... Just because there are snags in the development today (as there have always been, by the way), doesn't mean anything about the future of this gargantuan project. It's just part of the development cycle. There's always ups and downs. But I honestly don't get it. It's like you prefer fairytales, and sweet lullabies of all the things money will do for this game, forgetting how much money has been thrown at far lesser games...

The volunteering aspect of development is both it's greatest strength, as well as one of its weaknesses. Patience is a requirement. In everything. Money can't buy love. Money can't make a game like 0AD. Only the love, dedication, passion and tenacity of its developers can. So please stop antagonizing the developers and let them work! Give them words of encouragement, not these belligerent and uncalled for reproaches because things aren't going as fast as you'd like them to go. You are causing harm by seeding unnecessary doubt, and it's unpleasant for developers to keep hearing their unpaid work isn't good enough for you. If anything, see what you yourself can add to the development. Just throwing money at things is a lazy and unwholesome way of doing things.        

The one thing I do agree with is that some of the social media accounts, especially the facebook page, as well as the main 0AD website should be updated with regular screenshots, either of development or just fan made, and some small update lists of interesting commits, to show of the development of the game, because currently there are way too many 6+ year old promo shots floating around the net, and doubting Tom's who think the project is dead while so many people are actually working on it day and night. 

Isn't this something for you @asterix? Collecting all the pretty screenshot and other media produced and shared on the forums, and making a small selection of the best pieces, to post anywhere from 1-5 images per week on facebook, with a 1 liner (What is it? who made it? Can we expect to see it in vanilla or is it for a mod?). And then secondarily, look at the weekly commits and see if there's anything you think people might find interesting. Either a short list of the most interesting commits, or a small written piece (just a paragraph or so) of a more intricate commit, just once a week or so? It would do wonders to let people know how much is actually being done (outside of the pathfinder or AI department). 

[Servo]

Honestly I still have high hopes that 0ad will become my final dream game before I stop playing pc games. The only problem is that I’m too old to keep on waiting that I have to keep on finding games that suits my liking. 

I will never abandon this game even if I’m not playing it in the meantime while DoM suits my liking. It’s just like who likes what. Even if I play another game I still put 0ad on the discussion because I’m hopeful that someday sooner my interest on the game will be back. The same as RoN which I tried to comeback for MP games since I noticed that bugs and fixes are in place still and to my surprise whenever I logged on to steam my old buddies (two of them are retired workers already, 60-70 y/o) and those who left for so long were back or still in the game. 

If I’m only capable in the development I could have done it and do mod unfortunately my engineering background did not develop well to adapt to the new technology. Nevertheless I can only contribute monetarily and I promised before that I will contribute whenever a new alpha is released. Also I always support by advertising the game whenever I go or do. 

What im surprised with DoM is that there were only 2 developers and they created an awesome single player game. It’s not even polished but the improvements imo can easily be done. The modification seems to me like less complicated than 0ad despite so many features that needs more tweaking. Players were even clamoring for the devs not to introduce MP because it might mess up the game. The only problem which I haven’t asked is whether it can be DL and played without internet while 0ad has.

 

[Guest]

Well, seeing it as "only temporary" is much better than seeing it as "the project is doomed". (The latter was something a staff member said on multiple occasions after 23 was released, maybe he changed his mind now, don't know).

[itrelles]

i really think that 0 ad is a love project made with people who fell for rts as a teenager and could never scape the gaming world, like myself,

15 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

somebody had the nerve to suggest adds in the game and forum

shame!

28 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

dishonest and predatory money grab schemes the big developers

big developpers are dying, change is comming, new ones will emerge

29 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

And 0AD is routinely compared to the best!!

0 AD IS the best RTS 

it was made w love and patience, but how or why bad rts games are more known than 0 ad? why did i just met 0AD in 2017? why not before? how did i miss the game and couldnt reach it for years? i have dl hundred of rts in the last years and erased in seconds, not w 0AD

45 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

negativity from a handful of "fans" these days

not negativity, maybe u are feeling suceptible

 

48 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

Empires Apart???

not even trying that shift, 0AD for ever!!!!! 

49 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

0AD has never been greater

with greater power greater responsibilities

 

49 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

There's always ups and downs

is 0AD in a down moment? 

50 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

forgetting how much money has been thrown at far lesser games...

money is time, i get that money owner in northen emisphere are all bad persons, making war for fun

 

52 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

But I honestly don't get it. It's like you prefer fairytales, and sweet lullabies of all the things money will do for this game, forgetting how much money has been thrown at far lesser games...

money buys time, i get u have an other human job and in ur free time u work here, 0 AD doesnt get u food in the table or heat in winter, it get u a group of friends and people who like and think the same aka friends. question: are internet friends real friends?

 

54 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

The volunteering aspect of development is both it's greatest strength, as well as one of its weaknesses. Patience is a requirement. In everything. Money can't buy love. Money can't make a game like 0AD. Only the love, dedication, passion and tenacity of its developers can. So please stop antagonizing the developers and let them work! Give them words of encouragement, not these belligerent and uncalled for reproaches because things aren't going as fast as you'd like them to go. You are causing harm by seeding unnecessary doubt, and it's unpleasant for developers to keep hearing their unpaid work isn't good enough for you. If anything, see what you yourself can add to the development. Just throwing money at things is a lazy and unwholesome way of doing things.

the volunteer aspect of development is the greates strenght in 0AD, that way the team was fromed, i guess w the same hate to money and big companys world, a anarchist internet op group was formed, w same beliefs and same taste in rts

obsesives and perfectionist made 0AD, obsesives artist and programmers, no sellmans, 0AD need to reach more people in the internet, need and aggresive meme campaign, 0AD has no social listening in internet, u need to get better there!

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

and it's unpleasant for developers to keep hearing their unpaid work isn't good enough for you

ok sry, it is very good for me, sry for misstraslation, but 12 hours a day, to get 12 dollars its not a living, its almost modern digital slavery lololol

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

 If anything, see what you yourself can add to the development. Just throwing money at things is a lazy and unwholesome way of doing things.

ok, i think i can make a huge latin campaign to get more spanish players to 0AD
game is fine for me, it just need more players

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

So please stop antagonizing the developers and let them work! Give them words of encouragement

i allways give words of encouragement to everyone, in 0AD and in life NEVER SURREDNER!!!

just ask, ITRELLES 

im talking now w a gay merchandising friends who talks in the estadio centenario in front of 70 000 persons before every classic Peñarol vs Nacional in uruguay twice a year, he know how to reach people w internet and he know what people like to see

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

Tom's who think the project is dead while so many people are actually working on it day and night.

only he thinks project is dead, i know it has never been so much popular like now, but again, i think u need to do way more to reach more people, 

just in brasil there are like 2 millions rts fans, that keep on playing AOE2 in old and bad pcs..,

nostalgia again is a strong feeling

i want to help if u let me, i want to learn, teach us master!!! enlight us!!

 

[Sundiata]

41 minutes ago, itrelles said:

big developpers are dying, change is comming, new ones will emerge

Change is indeed coming, and 0AD is ideally positioned to take full advantage of this, as it's the best free to play, open source, cross platform RTS project out there. But indeed, people need to know about it to be able to contribute to it.

 

41 minutes ago, itrelles said:

ok, i think i can make a huge latin campaign to get more spanish players to 0AD

That would be really valuable, for example...

 

41 minutes ago, itrelles said:

not negativity, maybe u are feeling suceptible

No, I'm just cringing at all the misplaced criticisms directed at people that have been moving mountains... Some of them are like real life superheroes! 

 

41 minutes ago, itrelles said:

is 0AD in a down moment? 

It's impossible to not to come to that conclusion if these latest discussions are all you read. Luckily, it's just a skewed narrative... I don't understand why some insist on pushing it. If someone doesn't like the way 0AD has evolved over the years and wants to go back to playing alpha 16 or whatever because the good old laggy days of missing features was so great, then why not just go back and play those alphas. The only real thing I can deduce from all these discussions is that you're upset that things aren't going fast enough. Which is immature in my opinion. You can't force development by "whining" about things that can't be fixed right now and "pressuring" people who are already overworked, and need help, not more criticism. These discussions aren't constructive at the moment, unless you yourself can do something about it. I don't think you're inspiring positive change or progress like this. 

I'd say it's even getting toxic. I know we all have different dispositions, and different tastes in humor. I know you don't mean any harm. But other people can draw the wrong conclusions, even get offended and loose heart if they think a lot of people feel like that about the game. Which isn't true of course. The game is growing in popularity and 9 out of 10 comments are super positive. People generally love the game! But negative comments always weigh heavier, even if they weren't "intended" to be negative. 

Edited March 14, 2019 by Sundiata

[itrelles]

14 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

and 0AD is ideally positioned to take full advantage of this, as it's the best free to play, open source, cross platform RTS project out there

i know, thats why my interest and offers

but i think u all should spend 100% brain time in holding back players 

maybe give some good players coaching habilities inside noobs game,

people love to teach, good ones will do it on they own,

a ninth god player, that can host partys for new ones , and place like shadowed buildings to show in wich order noobs have to build

teach them before playing for first time how to use keyboard, give them zillin written tips when game is charging

make zillion million videos on mini tactics, macro and micro, defence attack, most games last 20 minutes but only one battle is really decesive battle,

and 100% of youtube are minimum 40 minutes long, its like watching 2 2 and a 1/2 dworf on a row, nobody WILL DO THAT

even if u spend hours and hours making nice youtube videos like the ant from valihr

 

32 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

That would be really valuable

if im allowed

34 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

moving mountains... Some of them are like real life superheroes! 

first super hero in history was el Zorro , he was going to make california independent, not even turning it back to mexico

 

 

super heroes are propaganda, u should make that w all the people that made 0AD possible, after 17 years, el sueño libertario.

u shoud start there, make our 0 AD heroes gods

and start aggresive meme campaign all tougheter same day and same hour, 

I WANT YOU TO PLAY 0AD!!

alexander the great pointing at you, boudica, hannibal... etc... all 0 historical figures

0AD needs propaganda, caption and retaining the players, and then it will be free, and maybe u can make more eras like empire earth xDxDxDxDxDxD NEVER SURRENDER!!!!

42 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

It's impossible to not to come to that conclusion if these latest discussions are all you read

i never forum in my life, in my first one here i posted some pictures and offended some vegan i assume cause 2 of them where deleted, and yesterday i saw monetization and i enter

and now im making catarsis and throwing all my XP ins this one and half year playing, the game is done for me, but it just need more players!

im pragmatic

53 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

The only real thing I can deduce from all these discussions is that you're upset that things aren't going fast enough.

nop, i dont care that, game is fine i like it this way, it just need more players, more tournaments, a league 2 vs 2 teams 3 vs 3 teams , 4 v 4 events more love to people and not to code or arts

more music plz 2

55 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

Which is immature in my opinion

arent we all gamers inmature? 

56 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

You can't force development by "whining" about things that can't be fixed right now and "pressuring" people who are already overworked, and need help, not more criticism

im not forcing or whinning i think, not my intention, i dont want changes again, i want more people and more love, i understand that people work a lot and need help so thats why my offers, 

 

58 minutes ago, Sundiata said:

I don't think you're inspiring positive change or progress like this.

i inspire people for life, all time, im optimistic and realistic, never down, never pony! never head down

i inspired the never surrender movement inside 0ad, to get rid of leavers, i hate leavers i really hate them, all my life,worthless

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

I'd say it's even getting toxic

i will fight it!!

 

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

and different tastes in humor

humor has no barriers, like mayonesa

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

I know you don't mean any harm

maybe i did , sometime a little bit of chaoes to get things on the move xDXDXDXD

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

The game is growing in popularity and 9 out of 10 comments are super positive.

yeah!!!! they come they see they play they like and they leave, fight the leave part! 110% brain

put whisky to the engine or kerosene xD

1 hour ago, Sundiata said:

But negative comments always weigh heavier

not really for me,  if u dont like or believe in 0AD u arent really in rst P