Carthaginians- Alpha 7?

[feneur]

Why is this video blocked in Germany? I saw nothing offensive or anything that might be illegal.

Artist: John Williams

Ode to Zeus from Canto Olympico

[SMST]

The GEMA (which is an institution who represents artists and benefits from licences of artistic work, see here) blocked several YouTube videos for German users because they could not come to an agreement with the YouTube operators about cophyright issues.

Edited August 7, 2011 by SMST

[plumo]

@Pureon

I really love the docks of Carthage . 2 minor comments: The 'inside' of the port looks a bit empty - I mean: there is no pier inside connecting the different quays.

What would be amazing is the ability to construct a mighty catapult on the roof. This is not fiction! : the romans actually built a huge ballista on top to shell the city in the third punic war ( when Carthage actually fell), I guess in 146 BC. or around.

[FlorianJW]

This is also going on my nerves, because I'm from Germany too, but there's a little workaround with proxy-servers, therefore you've received a private message, SMST

If there are other people from Germany or China or whereever the Internet is censored, just send me a message

edit: Thanks for the link, Pureon, these videos of the reconstructions are great on that channel, and the port really looks like the one who someone here in the forums has already mapped.

Just give them a link: http://1.hidemyass.com/ip-4/encoded/Oi8vd3d3LnlvdXR1YmUuY29tL3dhdGNoP3Y9cTd6U0hrc0dhV0U%3D&f=norefer

I cannot imagine, that this is in any way illegal, so…

Use this anyway, it works pretty good: http://hidemyass.com/

[Almin]

Just give them a link: http://1.hidemyass.com/ip-4/encoded/Oi8vd3d3LnlvdXR1YmUuY29tL3dhdGNoP3Y9cTd6U0hrc0dhV0U%3D&f=norefer

I cannot imagine, that this is in any way illegal, so…

Use this anyway, it works pretty good: http://hidemyass.com/

Well that is exactly the same link, that I was sending in the private message

Edited August 13, 2011 by Almin

[Pureon]

@Pureon

I really love the docks of Carthage . 2 minor comments: The 'inside' of the port looks a bit empty - I mean: there is no pier inside connecting the different quays.

Once the Carthaginian navy is finished I might look at adding some eyecandy inside the super dock. I agree it doesn't look great when you can see all the way through.

[Alpha of the Eagles]

On a side note, in regards of an earlier post by Mythos, I wanted to just share a thought on how to differentiate mercenaries from normal units, how about:

1. They cost only gold (relatively cheap recruitment, but gold heavy)

2. You pay upkeep (per "x" game cycle, somewhere around 5 minute cycles (perhaps determined from the point of origin))

3. If they attain experience (which they should since mercenaries were often professional soldiers), the upkeep should increase.

Upkeep could be really low, but in numbers it would discourage the player from throwing them in the fray, and to rather use Libyans as meatshields (since they were expendable). Again, this is just an idea of how to make their gameplay a bit different (depending on a steady gold income from trade and raids in addition to mining) since too often in strategy games, factions are different only in a few unique unit, spells and description. Oh, and I remember, gold isn't a resource, but could use metal in stead or something (you should really add gold ).

[feneur]

On a side note, in regards of an earlier post by Mythos, I wanted to just share a thought on how to differentiate mercenaries from normal units, how about:

1. They cost only gold (relatively cheap recruitment, but gold heavy)

2. You pay upkeep (per "x" game cycle, somewhere around 5 minute cycles (perhaps determined from the point of origin))

3. If they attain experience (which they should since mercenaries were often professional soldiers), the upkeep should increase.

Upkeep could be really low, but in numbers it would discourage the player from throwing them in the fray, and to rather use Libyans as meatshields (since they were expendable). Again, this is just an idea of how to make their gameplay a bit different (depending on a steady gold income from trade and raids in addition to mining) since too often in strategy games, factions are different only in a few unique unit, spells and description. Oh, and I remember, gold isn't a resource, but could use metal in stead or something (you should really add gold ).

Metal is our "gold" =) We could of course add another resource, but that would just complicate things without giving any real benefits imho. (On that topic I think it's much more logical to have metal as a resource and "include gold" than not to have metal and rely on gold to be the "metaphorical metal" But that's just my opinion )

[Mythos_Ruler]

[kephra]

Moin,

One idea is to give Carthage a special build ("Embassy"?) where they are trained.

I've updated my trunk recently and *w00t* for the Embassies !

I like those mercenaries who do not cost food but metal. But I would prefer if they come in advanced level only, so they are better than fresh own troops, but not as good as own elite troops.

ciao,Kephra

[Mythos_Ruler]

Moin,

I've updated my trunk recently and *w00t* for the Embassies !

I like those mercenaries who do not cost food but metal. But I would prefer if they come in advanced level only, so they are better than fresh own troops, but not as good as own elite troops.

ciao,Kephra

This is possible, and something I've thought about for the Romans too. Anyway, glad you like the embassies!

[Pedro Falcão]

I liked the the embassies, but the civic centre is far the most awesome-looking building of the carthaginians. Also the map is very nice, except for the fact that there aren't any cliffs as alternative to walls! had to build about 4 fortresses and some walls to stop the constant attacks from all sides while i gathered a massive army to crush bot's town...

[Pureon]

@Pureon

I really love the docks of Carthage . 2 minor comments: The 'inside' of the port looks a bit empty - I mean: there is no pier inside connecting the different quays.

Going back to this, we'll probably add a floor to the inside of the inner superdock, similar to what I'm now doing to the outer sections:

It's still work in progress at this point, so expect ship hulls and more detail when completed

[Pedro Falcão]

Will we have a "Punic Wars" Campaign for the Romans, leading to the siege and destruction of Carthage? I'd really love to see maps featuring the city, just like what had been done in Warcraft 3 (at Dalaran and at Capital City). I'm already anxious to build such a map...

[JuliusColtranePille]

Going back to this, we'll probably add a floor to the inside of the inner superdock, similar to what I'm now doing to the outer sections:

It's still work in progress at this point, so expect ship hulls and more detail when completed

is this the special building of carthage?! the "super"dock?

looks awesome... totally bombastic

[Pureon]

is this the special building of carthage?! the "super"dock?

looks awesome... totally bombastic

It'll be released with Alpha 8 as the outer ring of the inner 'superdock' we released with Alpha 7.

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

What is the purpose of the 'superdock' other than for the training of economic ships? Is it better for commercial enterprises?

[JuliusColtranePille]

What is the purpose of the 'superdock' other than for the training of economic ships? Is it better for commercial enterprises?

you can evoke ancient climate change. a fearsome carthaginian strategy.

but yeah,

would be interesting to know.

[Mythos_Ruler]

What is the purpose of the 'superdock' other than for the training of economic ships? Is it better for commercial enterprises?

The round "super dock" (what we call the "Naval Shipyard") constructs warships. The benefit is that it's super strong and will possibly have multiple other features in the future.

[Pedro Falcão]

What about building various ships at the same time? I imagined if each deck of the dock could build one ship at the same time, even if with decreased speed of building.

[Mythos_Ruler]

What about building various ships at the same time? I imagined if each deck of the dock could build one ship at the same time, even if with decreased speed of building.

That was one of the ideas floating around. Multiple "assembly lines." Also perhaps you could garrison X number of ships inside to auto-heal them.

[plumo]

IMHO the carthaginian super dock should have multiple options to reflect the player's playing style.

For example: 3 options after constructing (every upgrade blocks the other 2 upgrades, costs resources)

- Aggressive: More than 1 ship can be built at the same time ( 2 ?)

- Defensive : Ballista on top of the super dock protects your harbour.

- Economic : Generates gold slowly.

( This idea has been used as well in command & conquer generals for the USA faction if someone remembers)

Edited September 21, 2011 by plumo

[Pedro Falcão]

IMHO the carthaginian super dock should have multiple options to reflect the player's playing style.

For example: 3 options after constructing (every upgrade blocks the other 2 upgrades, costs resources)

- Aggressive: More than 1 ship can be built at the same time ( 2 ?)

- Defensive : Ballista on top of the super dock protects your harbour.

- Economic : Generates gold slowly.

( This idea has been used as well in command & conquer generals for the USA faction if someone remembers)

But the 'superdock' will be a special building not able to be built in free-mode games, will it? So there is no point in limiting the object. Maybe in the campaign, they figure out something to balance things.

Besides all this, i'd just like to nota that the Carthaginians had not only triremes and similars, but they had the next generation of war ships: Galleys. In one of the punic wars (i can't remember wich one), the romans stole some galleys and reverse-engineered them to use them against Carthage. I never forgot this since i did a school work about punic wars 4 years ago!

[Mythos_Ruler]

"Special Buildings" will always be available to those factions. Super Dock and Embassies for Carthage, Gymnasion and Prytaneion for the Greeks, etc.

[kephra]

Moin,

I've play tested Carthago a bit more - and I even if I really like them, I fear they are overpowered currently.

1 The civ center combination of Spear Infantry, Bow Infantry and Javelin Cavalry is super strong. Carthago was not known for good own troops, but known to prefer mercenaries.

Solution: Make them weaker than other civ center troops

2 The sacred band is a very strong block troop

Solution: Make them more expensive

3 Elephants are super strong, as they can both function to stop troops and to crush buildings

Solution: Make them population 3 or even 4

4 Mercenaries can be used as workers and increase rank by experience

Solution: Mercenaries should only come in 'A'dvanced rank only, and should not accept work task

5 They have the best fleet

Thats ok ;-)

I know balance playtesting might not yet on topic, as other important civilisations are missing,

so, just my $0.02,

Kephr

PS: thanks to bruno for applying my small patch http://trac.wildfire....com/ticket/981 after irc cha

PPS: applying all ideas might make Carthargo to weak. So I suggest 3 and 4 and playtesting again.

Edited September 29, 2011 by kephra