Genava55

In my opinion there is no trouble to distinguish between Insular Celts (Britons) and Continental/Mainland Celts (Gauls) while keeping them in the same group/faction. It is true that Celtic culture doesn't mean La Tène culture, but Celtic cultures are very diversified on a large timescale. The peoples from the Atlantic Bronze Age and from the Urnfield culture are actually proposed as the first Celts to explain the differences between the Iron Age Celts (There is a book about this: "Celtic from the West"). Then all the following cultures (Castro, Hallstatt, Golasecca, La Tène etc.) are Celtic from this point of view. The actual purpose of the game is to represent the Celts known by the classical texts. Since the Celtiberians are among the Iberian faction and the less-known cultures (Castro, Golasecca, Liguro-Venetic, Przeworsk etc.) are not considerate as potential factions, there are only remaining the La Tène culture and the Britonnic iron age culture. The Britonnic iron age started around 700-600 BC, and before this period the Atlantic Bronze Age was still the main culture in Britain. And there is a lot of connections between the Insular Celts and the Continental Celts. Since the fifth century, according to Barry Cunliffe: There is Early La Tène items in Wales too: The origin of the war chariots is speculated from the La Tène influence by Barry Cunliffe: About the artistic influence: Aside the first contact in Early La Tène, there is very Late La Tène connection in south-eastern Britain. There is evolution in the coinage and in the pottery. There is indication of a military tense situation: About the sword here is the view of Barry Cunliffe:

It is better to argue here I think. Is it ok for you? @Sundiata Before to start, you need to understand that my position is very difficult to defend. For a very old reason. It is difficult to prove that something didn't exist. An old scientifical, philosphical and legal challenge. Moreover in archaelogical and historical context where there is a lot of room for various interpretations. Firstly, as I said the Bormio's stele is from the Golasecca culture. Not the La Tène culture that is the common iron age culture for the Celts known by classical texts. To understand the difference, we can look at the timeline of the Golasecca culture. It starts around 900BC, in the North of Italy and is contemporaneous of the Hallstatt culture. The Golasecca is considerate as very close to the Hallstatt culture but with important differences: there is cremation burials and they have cultural connection with the Etruscans (they even used their alphabet). Thus, the Golasecca is what we call a "first iron age celtic culture", in the same manner is the Hallstatt culture. But around 600-500BC the Hallstatt culture vanishes, the political structure seems to change completely and there is a lot of artistic innovation. The La Tène culture emerges from the Hallstatt culture and is even spread far beyond the ancient boundaries of the former culture. It is what we call a "second iron age celtic culture", the moment where the Celts are in their maximal expansion. And if you remember the history of the Celts from the Romans, it is around 400BC that the Gauls come in Italy. Archeologically, the Golasecca disappears between 450-400BC and is replaced by the La Tène culture. Notably, by the Insubres, a celtic tribe which have established Mediolanum. It is why referring to this stele is the same level of mistake than referring to the Hallstatt culture for characterizing the Gauls known by the classical texts. They are distinct cultures. There is a hypothese that the Ligures in Italy were close to the Golasecca culture (but probably different too), as a first iron age culture. Moreover, the Bormio's stele poses a second problem. Is it a standard-bearer and a corn-blower? Because we know that the peoples in these roles wore different uniforms and weapons than the usual warrior. It wouldn't be very smart to generalize from them. Secondly, the Castro culture has the same problem than the Golasecca. Even worse because the region never known the La Tène culture and because the Castro culture is even different from the Hallstatt culture. The Castro culture emerges from the Atlantic bronze age and has a lot of similarities with the Britannic iron age. Even for Celtiberians, the association with La Tène culture is difficult and evidence only start late (around 200BC). Why it is so difficult? Because being "celt" is not a ethnicity, it is only cultural. It seems normal in the records that a celtic culture was replaced by another one (no violence needed for this). Thirdly, for the Wandsworth shield, I explicitly said that the insular Celts could have potentially used round shields. Saying that the Celts of Thames's region comes from the mainland is very difficult to prove, the evidences are always late (between 150-50 BC). There is a speculation that the Belgians invaded this region but it seems it was during the time of Diviciacos, king of the Suessiones around 100BC. Furthermore, the Wandsworth shield is known to have been applied on a wooden backing. We have absolutely no idea of the shape of this wooden backing, since it was fixated with rivets. Don't forget that the Witham shield have bronze parts applied on a oval wooden shield. Don't forget the Battersea shield is made of different pieces, all fixated with rivets... Finally, if the round shields were regularly used by the mainland Celts (the Gauls), why there is no depiction of round shields on the Orange's arc? Or on any Roman relief? We can't speculate only because there was round shield during the bronze age in Europe, it is anachronistic.

There is some experimental work in re-enactment about the fabric motifs and techniques. Here some examples: https://mickytissages.wordpress.com/tutoriels/tutoriel-tissage-tablettes/ https://www.archeologies.net/recherches/le-tissage-aux-tablettes-tablet-weaving.html http://www.arkeofabrik.com/2014/05/tissages.html https://mickytissages.wordpress.com/tissages-realisations/realisations-tissage-2010/ It is based on an archeological proposal by Hubert Masurel: https://www.persee.fr/doc/pica_0752-5656_1983_num_1_1_3009 There is also:

Thanks a lot and sorry for the mess.

Well, I don't know where to start. But firstly I noticed you are using osprey illustrations and random archeological finds taken on different websites. The problem with osprey illustrations is that they are often very old and based on very insufficient sources. For exemple, there is often anachronistic choice in Angus McBride's illustrations, mixing items from the early LaTène and the Late LaTène periods. There is even an illustration of a helvetian warrior from him where he used Hallstatt and Bronze Age material to describe a scene occurring in 100BC: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/73/11/4d/73114d9147321363aaab4cbe6884c5c1.jpg Another example, one previously posted: You can see a strange shield used by standard-bearer. It is actually based on a stele from Bormio made by peoples of the Golasecca culture around 500BC. The scene is depicting the Hannibal's army crossing the alps in 218BC and the reaction of a Gallic tribe (the Allobroges or the Taurini probably). Not very accurate. The other thing is that Osprey illustrations often depicts round shields on Gallic warriors. But there is absolutely no evidence of round shields in La Tène culture. Maybe it has existed among the insulars celts (Britain and Ireland) but not in the continent.

Hi, I see you struggle to get accessible documents about La Tène culture. I propose to help you a bit. If you want an accessible material, there is page from someone working for museums and historians to make re-enactment items: https://www.facebook.com/franck.archeoart/photos Don't forget there is an evolution of the armament, even in a barbarian culture: https://i.pinimg.com/564x/73/ba/69/73ba696b81a206fa9b985bd012602891.jpg https://swordmaster.org/uploads/2016/cassaselvatica/la-tene-a1.jpg (La Tène A - 500 - 400 BC) https://swordmaster.org/uploads/2016/cassaselvatica/la-tene-a2.jpg (La Tène A - 500 - 400 BC) https://swordmaster.org/uploads/2016/cassaselvatica/la-tene-b.jpg (La Tène B - 400 - 300 BC) https://swordmaster.org/uploads/2016/cassaselvatica/la-tene-c.jpg (La Tène C - 300 - 150 BC) https://swordmaster.org/uploads/2016/cassaselvatica/la-tene-d.jpg (La Tène D - 150 - 30 BC) Your welcome.

Eluveitie did a lot of songs in ancient Gaulish. I think you can just re-use their lyrics, maybe just asking to Chrigel (singer and writer of the band). Example:

The general form of a gallic sanctuary is a delimited area with one or several huts/cabines to keep the votive gifts (weapons, jewels, woodden statue etc.). In addition, it can has some sacrificial monument (holes in the ground for the food, and animals or even condemned persons; scaffolds for the heroic dead warriors and their weapons like at Gournay-sur-aronde) and some places for banquets like at Corent. http://www.gournaysuraronde.com/images/sanctuaire/maquette.jpg http://www.gournaysuraronde.com/images/sanctuaire/reconstitution-sanctuaire.jpg Two animation videos: http://www.court-jus.com/film.php?id=28&type=15 http://www.court-jus.com/film.php?id=29&type=15 Illustrations in a paper(journal) about Corent, the oppidum and the sanctuary, near of Gergovia: http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4983/sanctuaryofcorent.jpg http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/916/luernfest.jpg Woodden statue, found near the lake of geneva: http://notrehistoire.ch.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/2010/08/de0334d0108f4481_jpg_200x200_upscale_q85.jpg http://notrehistoire.ch.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/2010/08/c494b1286c9505da_jpg_200x200_upscale_q85.jpg Thus if you need to keep one of these models, I think the second building is better for a sanctuary, it misses simply an enclosure and some religious amenagements. The house is a bit too huge but it isn't really bad.

No... Gallia was more deforested than the France today. The Druids weren't hippies naturalists, there was some sanctuaries during the Celtic LaTene. A model made by Ealabor for a m&b mod, based on the Sanctuary of Corent: http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j158/ealabor/corent1.jpg http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j158/ealabor/corent2.jpg

Just to help the historians about the Celts/Germans, there are some previews really detailled here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=337587 http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=347334 http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=351425 http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=352002 http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=413770 http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?do=discuss&group=&discussionid=1367 And for Carthage: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=401193 Good day and good luck.

The Gaulish martial vocabulary (source: Gaulish Dictionnary) - Atectos (peasant) - Acuadreti (fast skirmisher, with light javelin which can reach 80 meters) - Batoros (striker) - Gaisatos (javelinman) - Talmori (slinger) - Saitoros (bowman) - Anandogna (foreigner) - Andogna (native) - Bagauda (peasant-warrior) - Iouincos (young warrior) - Excingos (attacker, litt."out of the troop") - Bariouic (angry warrior) - Ambactos ("servants" => guard) - Cingetos (warrior) - Uercingetos (super-warrior) - Solduros (elite guard) - Argos (hero, champion) - Comargos (fighting comrade) - Arios (prince, noble) - Cauaros (giant, hero) - Corionos (war chief) - Corios (army) - Brennos (général) - Gaisaredos (mounted javelinman, on a horse) - Essedon (chariot) - Eporedia (cavalry) - Eporedos (cavalryman) - Rigeporedia (royal cavalry) - Nauson (ship)

Okay, I know for the too smalls details. For the types of warriors, I can say that the Gallic used at least three types of javelins. A short javelin with a great blade, used by the heavy infantry to pierce the shields. A middle javelin, which can be used as spear, used by the light infantry. And a light javelin thrown by a thin strap of leather, used by the skirmisher and which can reach 80 meters. The elite warrior used a large shield, a spear and a sword. He carried a helmet and either a leather armor or a chain mail. He is generally in first line and he is followed by warriors less equipped (no armor and no helmet) but with a longer lance. The stripped/naked troops are generally troops of fast attacks, they use javelins and spear (and sometimes sword). Their shields are lighter. For the cavalry, in Gaul, they have no round shield. The cavalry of the Gallic War was entirely made of aristocrats. If you want see the equipment: www.archeoart.org Some examples of shield: http://www.archeoart.org/bou-v4.html# A example of leather armor: http://www.archeoart.org/cuirv2.html# A great blade of spear: http://www.archeoart.org/ah-v6.html# A normal blade of spear: http://www.archeoart.org/ah-v1.html# A sword and scabbard (all the Gallic swords have iron scabbard): http://www.archeoart.org/ef-v10.html# http://www.archeoart.org/ef-v9.html# I am content that you like that. If you want translate the French, you can use: http://www.systranet.fr

Hello, Thanks guys To feneur, I posted the pictures of the salt mine and others production centers to give an example of the means which the Celts used to work. And if the Celtic walls are rights, the Gallic houses are wrongs. In Gaul the houses are not "round". I know, in Britannia many houses were rounds but the Gaul is really different. You can see those pictures: http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/7138/qu...sanaldebibr.jpg http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/1791/ferm...ifiedepaule.jpg And for the armament, in French we have a specialist (André Rapin) and he made a great job on the Celtic continental weapons but to the Britannic Celts, I don't know any specialist. Barry Cunliff has made a poor work on the weapons. You can read the first link of my previous post, it's a summary of a work of André Rapin. Just a question, your Celts are of which period? The Gallic Wars? The pictures of the French comic book show a battle between Senones and Bellovaci in 230BC. And now, I make a word of thanks to all those people who work on this game. You make a GREAT job, good luck guys!

Do you like my post? I want just help.

Hello, I posted several month ago. I speak French and I'm member of the francophone community of Total War. www.universtotalwar.fr Sorry for my bad english. I'm passionate by the history and in particular the Gallic civilization. I noticed many faults mainly on the equipment, and and I will offer a series of documents and of images to you.. The PDF-Documents are in French, I hope that one of you is French-speaking because they are of excellent qualities. Sorry for the too many pictures, there aren't "spoiler" ? An excellent English link on the armament: http://www.gallicobelgae.org/la_tene_chronology.htm The habitat at the time of LaTène: The artisanal district of Bibracte The fortified farm of Paule: The tools: Activities of the Celtic society: Metallurgy and art: The warriors and the war: http://www.lecasquedagris.com/ http://mambba.blogspot.com/2008/08/le-casq...-des-snons.html For the French-speaking: The Celtic Armament by André Rapin The war and the weapons of the first century BC A specialist of the re-enactment A group of Re-enactment of the third century BC: http://pagesperso-orange.fr/leuki/asso.html http://pagesperso-orange.fr/leuki/panoplie.html# A group of Re-enactment of the first century BC: http://www.les-ambiani.com

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oppidum_of_Manching I think it's good pictures of a oppidum. I hope that all picture will be useful. PS: the Brittons used cuirasses of leather and woad for bodypainting (several blue only) but they used less chain mail than Gallic warriors. However they used chariots and bodypainting unlike Gallic warriors.

Britton Gallic Celts with a Macedonian Officer. http://www.lecasquedagris.com/bd-agris-tom...anches-couleurs http://www.lecasquedagris.com/bd-agris-tom...elques-planches

Hello, i'm French and I wanted to give you three pictures: This comic was created by several historians. I hope this will be useful because in 0AD Celts are stereotyped. Celts used cuirasses of hardened leather and spear along three meters.