Dizaka
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Posts posted by Dizaka
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@badosu come back
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Can't look at specific stats individually. Have to look at the big picture.
You can win games with high k/d ratio while extremely low economic stats (e.g., Carth Merc).
You can win games with extremely low k/d but really high economic stats (e.g., Mauryas/Persians who can outpop other civs by a lot).
You can win games with extremely low k/d and extremely low economic stats (e.g., tying up the best player on other team).
You can win a 1v1 with low k/d but capturing a lot of buildings (e.g., outmaneuvering the other player).
There is no way to interpret the stats just a good way to measure average progress. There also should be an "idle unit time" stat that takes into account units garrisoned inside structures (except for mercs - that should be a seperate stat).
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6 minutes ago, chrstgtr said:
I think this makes them OP. Spear cav behave pretty similarly to how they used to when they were OP in a21 and a22.
I would rather do just anti-cav multiplier and an attack rate boost, which will make them slightly better against inf/women, if performance vs inf is a concern (which I don't entirely believe)
Those are also good alternative ways to boost them I agree. It really depends on the numbers based on the path taken. Whichever way it goes, though, spear cav need to be able to counter skrim cav, skirmishers (maybe sword units) and be countered by spear infantry. In p2 they should counter sword cav by a lot.
The reason why I am suggesting armor is so that they can last longer in rushes near CCs. Currently, they are weak around a CC but their dmg is fine IMO.
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7 minutes ago, chrstgtr said:
I like this. It can address my concerns above, but probably doesn't solve the problem of fixing spear cav vs. jav cav in p1.
I genuinely think they need to be boosted 3 ways:
- Anti-cav
- Armor
- Dmg
Anti-cav can be a p1 boost. Armor could be a p1 boost that makes them still viable vs skrimishers and lowest the magnitude of the anti-cav boost. The dmg boost could be through an upgrade.
I think with jav cav/skrim is that they have ranged. With the armor/anti-cav boosts I think it addresses both. (Note: Spear cav are weak vs regular skrimishers. see HERE)
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Hack dmg for spearcav would be nice as it'd make them more effective on dmg vs buildings, non-organic units, and organic units. It would be a nice boost.
I honestly believe they need more armor too.
However, any boost to spear cav makes Rome/Mace overpowering in the first 5 minutes of gametime. With the right RNG spawn I can have 20-23 spear cav by minute 5. This wipes any carthagian player out of the game. This also is enough to cause serious damage to at least 2 players in the first 10 minutes of gametime. This is substantial but not as capable as merc sword cav in p2 - which have the potential to know out 3 players and possibly a 4th by minute 10.
Suggestion: Instead of buffing spearcav directly do a p1 stables upgrade for Mace/Rome with other civs getting a p2 upgrade if they have spear cav.
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1 hour ago, nwtour said:
@Dizaka
The easiest way to fix the source code is when a developer runs a diff of two files on his computer. And the user runs the patch utility on his computer
Here is the patch that fixes your problem from Mozilla:
https://hg.mozilla.org/integration/autoland/raw-rev/2418633d529cChange to directory libraries/source/spidermonkey/mozjs-78.6.0/
Save the file there by the linkAnd run the command:
patch -p0 < FILENAMEIf it does not display any errors, then the files have been successfully updated and the game will begin to build.
So patch file cannot find files when ran. Using 2nd method (see below).
45 minutes ago, nwtour said:@Dizaka
Or another variant
Got to https://phabricator.services.mozilla.com/D119080#change-hoVh7lmqfh4R
and just download new version of mozjs-78.6.0/python/mozbuild/mozbuild/util.py
Tried this. I get stuck on resuming the game to build. Not sure on the commands. I think this might be, currently, above my linux understanding or abilities to resume the build with the patched file (util.py). I'll try tomorrow from the beginning and try figuring out why the build doesn't resume and/or if I need to issue some kind of commands to resume the build. Lost on that part. TY and appreciate the help.
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@nwtour TY for help. Just to double check I understand syntax correctly:
Run ./update-workspaces.sh -j3
For util.py create backup util.py.org afterwards
Modify util.py by:
Add:
+ +try: + from collections.abc import Sequence +except ImportError: + from collections import Sequence + +Then replace "class String.ListAdaptor(collections.Sequence):" with:
+ class StringListAdaptor(Sequence):The following:
- @@ -22,6 +22,13 @@
- @@ -782,7 +789,7 @@
Are just line locations? So do nothing with the above.
Ok, so I do the above but I'm lost on the next steps :(. When I redo ./update-workspaces.sh command the data gets overwritten. (Yea, this is probably a total newb move/error and sorry about this.)
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Traceback (most recent call last): File "/home/akazid/Downloads/0ad-0.0.26-rP26108-alpha/libraries/source/spidermonkey/mozjs-78.6.0/build-debug/../js/src/../../configure.py", line 25, in <module> from mozbuild.configure import ( File "/home/akazid/Downloads/0ad-0.0.26-rP26108-alpha/libraries/source/spidermonkey/mozjs-78.6.0/python/mozbuild/mozbuild/configure/__init__.py", line 33, in <module> from mozbuild.util import ( File "/home/akazid/Downloads/0ad-0.0.26-rP26108-alpha/libraries/source/spidermonkey/mozjs-78.6.0/python/mozbuild/mozbuild/util.py", line 760, in <module> class HierarchicalStringList(object): File "/home/akazid/Downloads/0ad-0.0.26-rP26108-alpha/libraries/source/spidermonkey/mozjs-78.6.0/python/mozbuild/mozbuild/util.py", line 785, in HierarchicalStringList class StringListAdaptor(collections.Sequence): AttributeError: module 'collections' has no attribute 'Sequence' ERROR: SpiderMonkey build failed
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Linux newb ...
Used the build instructions and got the following error:
AttributeError: module 'collections' has no attribute 'Sequence'
ERROR: SpiderMonkey build failed
Upon further search it seems Python 3.10 creates a conflict when installed (using Arch ... Can't uninstall 3.10 as it has dependencies ...). Please note that 2.7 is installed.
Is there a way to mask 3.10 or create some kind of compile environment? Just need a keyword/pointer in right direction if anyone has one.
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I think ground attack would fix archers in such a way that they may not even need a dmg boost ...
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I really like all of the ideas. Here's my response/suggestions/thoughts.
52 minutes ago, borg- said:A few small changes can make all the difference.
Britons must be a civilization of rush/harassment/expansion.I really like this. More P1-P2 strong civs (currently, only Carthage is there with Mercs, IMO). Making the game less of a race until p3 and upgrades and pushing it more towards for promoting raids and rushes.
52 minutes ago, borg- said:- Can build fortresses on neutral territory and have root territory;
-This allows you to build small "military base" (barrack, stable, tower), and control points around the map.
Same as above, really like this. Could also maybe permit for P2 fortress for a forward stronghold in pushing towards neighbors, but IDK.
52 minutes ago, borg- said:- Javelin infantry moves faster and gains more loot when killing enemy units;
-This makes hitting and running much more interesting for Britons.
So unlike Gauls, Britons have P1 slingers and not skrimishers - so it lacks synergy. What I've noticed, a lot of times, is that when certain units become overpowering is due to synergy. For example, Roman Sword cav + 2 heroes to pair up with. Gaul spear cav and hero. Iberian discount on skrimishers and hero who discounts champions. I like the idea but maybe more directed at slingers? Not sure.
52 minutes ago, borg- said:- Siege ram available in p2. Your health reduced to balance;
- Excellent for harass enemies in p2, although p3 gets weaker cuz less health.
I don't know if rams should have less health for Britons. They already have only 1 siege weapon in p3. I think this could be more of a debonus for Macedonians (who could make up for it with siege hero).
52 minutes ago, borg- said:- Druids must have a significant buff aura to soldiers. although it must cost more resources than other healers. Temple and druids available in p1.
+1, same as above. Like it.
@LetswaveaBook see below updated for me
On 20/12/2021 at 1:15 PM, LetswaveaBook said:Iberian champion cavalry (LetswaveaBook, Breakfastburrito007, Chrstgtr, Philip the Swaggerless, Weirdjokes, Dizika)
Iberian skrim cavalry (
Dizika)Iberian skrim cavalry w/ Hero Discounts (Dizika)
Gallic (Gaul) cavalry champions (Dizika)
Things that are considered to weak
Spear Cavalry in general (LetswaveaBook,Breakfastburrito007, Chrstgtr, Philip the Swaggerless, Weirdjokes, Yekatherina, Dizika)Bolt shooters(Dizika, borg-)
Rams (Dizika)
Fanatics(Chrstgtr, Philip the Swaggerless, Weirdjokes, Dizika)
All speed/eco only heroes(Chrstgtr, Dizika)
Sparta no-bonus hero (Dizika)
Things that need to be reconsidered in general:cost of priests (Dizika, borg-) (Note: Change should consider corral garrison update)
Introduce an attack group/ground option(Breakfastburrito007, Chrstgtr, Dizika)
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Mercs:
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Sword Cav (Carth):
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Issue is too much dmg and armor too early. I think they are correct with regards to cost which really shouldn't be a problem. I'd propose either decreasing innate dmg and adding upgraded dmg inside the embassies that can be researched for 200-300 metal.
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I would leave armor as is .
- As it stands, Carthage is only civ that is effective in rushing/killing in P1/P2 and it is partly because of the armor. Other melee cav are pointless to rush with b/c they don't have good armor.
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I would leave armor as is .
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Look @wowgetoffyourcellphone Carth in Delenda Est to get ideas. I like the implementation and it feels more "complete" and developed.
- However, I'd prefer Mercs being built from embassies not stables.
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Issue is too much dmg and armor too early. I think they are correct with regards to cost which really shouldn't be a problem. I'd propose either decreasing innate dmg and adding upgraded dmg inside the embassies that can be researched for 200-300 metal.
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Spear Cav (Sele/Ptolemy/Carth):
- Totally useless and underpowered units.
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Macedonian Skrim Cav
- Powerful if used right. Require application of constant pressure on enemy player to be effective and lots of micro (more than Sword Cav, have to be more frontal assault than sword cav running about in every part of map). Not used by many players. IDK if OP or not but I'd leave them as be.
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Other Mercs:
- Seem fine. Though I think mercs should be more of a P1 unit (infantry) and stronger mercs (cav) in P2. At P1 they seriously impact the start economy and if someone isn't p2 they can really screw themselves over without a market.
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In general, I think R3 citizen soldier units should have a bonus vs mercs (e.g., a "fealty bonus" or through a "fealty upgrade" available in p3). It would look like:
- R3 - Max bonus vs Mercs
- R2 - Reduced / Minimal bonus vs Mercs
- R1 - No bonus vs Mercs.
Champions:
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Skrim Cav (Iberian)
- They are strong. Partly because of Iberian bonus for skirmishers (cheaper champ units + CS units) that also get amplified with hero (moar cost bonus!). Iberian innate civ bonus + hero bonus allow for quick booming into Champion Skrim Cav. Walls help with booming/going defensive until p3.
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Sword Cav (Roman)
- Overpowering, especially with the hero that increases cav dmg and decreases infantry dmg. Great synergy. I think sword champ cav should be balanced seperately vs spear cav. Additionally, if that hero dies then you have +20% dmg hero. Both heroes are on horses ... great synergy here.
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Spear Cav (Gauls)
- Overpowering, especially with +20% hero that increases dmg and +10% civ bonus for calvary. Great synergy. I think there should be a mobility vs damage formula because Champ Cav from other civs is not as deadly or used as effectively.
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Spear Cav (Non-Gauls)
- Rarely seen enough to be considered overpowering.
Siege:
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Catapults:
- Useless unit. Weak because they lack something. (HINT: S P L A S H).
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Bolts:
- Useless unit. Don't see them being made at all in games.
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Rams:
- Still can't wrap my head over why you can block these with infantry (e.g., pike) but the catapult will not attack humans. Also, won't attack farms (huh?). Best thing to kill after a CC are all the farms surrounding the CC to handicap player eco. My preference over Rams are elephants, always.
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Siege Towers:
- Not used by many but also effective in the right circumstances. I'd say the unit is fine but it'd be nice if it was used more ... to attack walls/buildings ... siege sort of means against fortifications not units ...
Citizen Soldiers (CS):
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Spear Cav.
- In general, these units are used but are by far some of the weaker units when compared to their counterparts like Skrim Cav and Sword Cav.
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Sword Cav
- I think they are fine. Noone is complaining about OP gaul cav or OP maury cav.
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Archers.
- Need some kind of boost. Not a big boost but a boost nonetheless.
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Skrimishers
- Need to be toned down a little.
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Pikemen
- Either every civ has these units or somehow the armor on these units gets toned down.
Misc:
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Priests
- Nobody uses them. Currently, gameplay requires a lot of food. 250 food is expensive.
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Unit is OP (healing is OP) but has same problem Champions had in a23 (in a23 lack of metal, here lack of food b/c everything uses food)
- Probably going to see this change (possibly a lot) with animals being garrisoned in corrals.
Civs:
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Athens
- No synergy at all. Only saving grace for this civ is formation hero who adds +3 armor to each defense type.
- Should be revamped to make champion infantry from Barracks. Special building that produces champions currently should either produce heroes or be limited to 1-2, maybe 4, and produce champions at a faster speed and only produce champions once a tech is researched.
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Romans
- Encampment should produce ranged siege. Encampment should have siege upgrades. Remove the Arsenal from Rome.
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Macedonians:
- P2 Arsenal that counts towards P3. Arsenal in P2 can do upgrades and build siege towers. Delete the champion sword or make them mercs.
- This civ used to have the strongest melee units IG (stronger than Sparta champions). Give this civ the bonus vs Athens/Sparta back and the debonus vs Romans back ...
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Britons:
- Weak. IDK how to fix them.
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Mauryas
- Elephant champion is useless. Make him heal elephant units faster and add a dmg aura for all archer units and elephant units while debuffing all cav units for the Maury player?
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Ptolemies
- LEAVE THIS CIV AS IS PLZ.
- This civ is getting neutered where dmg/bonus heroes are going to be mediocre like Kush heroes but the civ doesn't have something cool like pyramids. It's fine having 1 good "push" civ.
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Sparta
- Have a useless champion (like Mauryas)
- Skiritai are fine. Actually, they are sparta's only strategy/uniqueness.
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Sword Cav (Carth):
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15 hours ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:
I know that there is another thread for balancing the cavalry units. But I would prefer giving some extra armor to spearcav rather than buffing their damage or multiplier. I wouldn't want to see spearcav being overly good at one thing and then being worse than swordcav for every other use case (if we gave 3x counter). At the same time I would not want to see spearcav become the functional equivalent of swordcav (if we gave them more dps). I think if spearcav are given more armor then they would last longer in battles against general infantry and swordcav would be the better unit for quickly eliminating enemies thanks to higher dps. This would keep/add some distinction for the two units while also giving them wide ranges of usefulness.
I think spearcav need more armor in general to be viable for rushing near/around a CC. Currently, rushing with spearcav is hard as (1) a skrimisher is reasonably strong vs spear cav, (2) a spearman is strong vs spearcav (gotta engage to deal dmg, unlike skrim cav), and (3) a CC deals dmg vs spear cav. Can't really rush with spear cav.
For skrim cav you have at least spearmen that are somewhat useless (gotta chase so can be kited) and they outdamage skrimishers (so can engage them). Spearcav is the "other cav unit that maybe you wanna use."
On 28/12/2021 at 6:54 AM, Player of 0AD said:priests
???
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Add spearmen to Dakara's list.
Also, can use formations to block ram movement using stand ground + line. Works with troops that might have issues dealing damage like skrimishers/pikemen.
Another option is surrounding with pikemen + stand ground. Will block ram. Can wait unit Sword/ram/ele/women arrive to finish off.
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1 hour ago, Yekaterina said:
I will explain in a later edition (from 1400 to 1600) some times when these rules can be broken. Your merc rush is certainly one of the special strategies that requires you to break these rules.
And any 75 wood house civ for booming really fast.
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On 13/12/2021 at 6:28 PM, Yekaterina said:
4. BATCH TRAINING. This is the single thing that separated cosmic noobs from a more experienced player. Always train units in batches instead of one by one queued up after one other. Hold down shift and click on a unit in the CC to train in a batch. Hover your cursor on a unit and scroll the mouse wheel to change default batch size. My habit is to set default batch size to 1, then hold down shift and repeatedly click on the unit to append as many units into the same batch as I can afford.
OMG. I'm cosmic :(.
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10 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:
Question for discussion:
Why should the "Balance Team" have any say in what features get added to the game? Isn't it their duty to balance the features the team decide to add?
That's not to say Balance team members can't participate in gameplay feature discussions. But those are two different roles. You can't come into a gameplay feature discussion and then derail it with constant balance concerns. You have to go into a feature discussion with a mind toward expanding the game's features in good faith.
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Again, Features and Balance are linked in the end, but they are 2 different things. You add the former, then try to do the latter. If it can't be balanced, then the feature can be removed, but you can't know a feature's balance until it's tried.
I'll add it further. Why should balance team have any say in what features get removed from the gameplay? IMO, it shouldn't.
Balancing should be about finding the underdog civs and finding ways to improve them while finding the overpowering civs and either bringing all others to their level or bringing everyone a notch down using stats not features (e.g., not removing Mauryas worker elephant but adding cards to some civs). For example, slingers vs bows vs skrimishers and bringing everything in line with regards to usefulness. Another example is champions. Additionally, Mercs and usefulness of heroes.
Balance should encompass:
- Unit balancing (timings, stats)
- Structure balancing (timings, stats)
- Upgrades (timings, time cost)
- Hero bonus stats
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What structures build what units (within reason)
- E.g., Delenda Est is completely different in how Carthage works with Mercs but also similar. It's weirdly cool and more developed IMO. (note: to me this is both a balance and feature change).
- Civ bonuses and stats (as long as within spirit of civ)
Balance should provide suggestions/ideas for (things that won't necessarily get added, but could be nice):
- Ideas on new units.
- Ideas on how a civs can work differently (e.g., Ptol/Scythians/Han)
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2 hours ago, Player of 0AD said:
I'd say he is useful for raiding - Maurys have no other cav hero. But of course his boni are far too weak, even though it's funny to build temples which cost only 75 stone and are build as fast as a field.
Maybe but not really. He's useful for raiding if he's the last hero available. But generally, the best time to build him is immediately once hitting p3 to get them cheap temples and upgrades, especially if allies can hold borders. If you can get priests you can be pretty unstoppable in a25 only b/c a lot of people don't use priests and they are powerful - but really expensive.
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On 20/12/2021 at 4:09 PM, Yekaterina said:
Clown: Chandragupta, Ashoka, Pericles...
Ashoka is useful for quick and discounted temple building and temple upgrades. But you gotta sacrifice him immediately after getting your upgrades cause he's not useful for anything else.
That's why you get the priest afterwards. To atone for your sins (and more cheap upgrades when garrisoning).
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8 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:
What if, randomly, everyone gets the same hero? Or only heroes of the same class.
That means certain civs aren't played at all.
What if regicide meant kill the "king" and you would spawn with a "king" of a certain class. In late-game you could still build heroes.
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7 minutes ago, Player of 0AD said:
There is an option that allows garrisoning the heroes.
Yekaterina, maybe you should wonder if your habit to train only women at the start is always the best approach. Some early soldiers can make a difference in the hero fights.Can't garrison all heroes. The elephant can only be garrisoned in an elephant stable ;P. Option makes that hero player SOL, lol.
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21 minutes ago, nani said:
Regicide is unpredictable and that is fun.
I once had my CC taken down by an elephant Hero (Hannibal ?) at the start of the game that made me lose in just 2 min, was that unfair? yes, but would that have happened if it was perfectly balanced? probably never and that is was makes the mode the current regicide worth to try and play it.Regicide nomad w/ team communication is so important. You can knock out good players by ganking and win early if other team doesn't communicate. If both teams communicate its a whole messy game that's just juicy.
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4 hours ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:
I remember playing ptols in a23 and thinking that we need to make the civs each be as distinct as ptol was from other civs. Instead the opposite happened and ptol was made more the same as the others.
If people want 1v1's for "who is better" than they should be playing the same civs in 1v1. It's the only way for a "balanced" 1v1. The issue then is that there are 13 civs and ppl complain about "oh, I don't play them."
People should understand the uniqueness of the civs more rather than trashing their advantages.
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2 hours ago, chrstgtr said:
It did. And placing a bunch of foundations doesn’t really work the way people says it did—if you had too many then you couldn’t build other houses. More to the point, you had to balance the number of workers building which was different from everything else.
if it was still deemed to be a problem then there should be a way to limit the number of unbuilt foundations which would surely solve these concerns.
It required 4 of first six trained women to build. It was a very real cost.
I also think it required 3 groups of 2 women building houses nonstop. That's 6 units dedicated to just buildings houses from 3/4 min to 10 or so making then vulnerable to lone cav rushing. Therefore, a lot of times ptol could be slowed down by just scouting and hitting house builders.
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Authentic healing icons reskin.
in Game Development & Technical Discussion
Posted · Edited by Dizaka
So it's not even Trademark law at issue but something completely different that I didn't know even existed, lol. Fun read.