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fatherbushido

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Posts posted by fatherbushido

  5. Balance Mod to test changes.

    in Game Modification

    Posted · Edited by fatherbushido

    58 minutes ago, Nescio said:

    Basically damage to an unit is 1 - (d/r)^2, with d the distance to the splash centre and r the splash radius?

    Exactly that.

    58 minutes ago, Nescio said:

    How does that work out for the total damage over the entire splash area?

    I am not sure how we have to interpret it in the game context. Units and structures are rectangle and apart units in formation, they don't overlap. So you will have only a finite numbers of damages in that area in the game context. Out of the game we want the (continuous) sum over the whole disk, but really I think it's not relevant.

    EDIT: writing that, I edited one post above.

    58 minutes ago, Nescio said:

    Also, only the unit centre matters, the footprint radius doesn't, right?

    Yes, for the splash part.

    In fact it's even worse than you can expect. But not enough place in that margin.

  6. Balance Mod to test changes.

    in Game Modification

    Posted · Edited by fatherbushido
    (I need english lessons)

    In theory:

    The damage is multipilied by

    1-(5/10)**2 when the radius is 10

    1-(5/7)**2 when the radius is 7

    In every case:

    damage is full at origin

    damage is multiplied by 3/4 when at the half radius

    damage is 0 at full range

     

  7. Balance Mod to test changes.

    in Game Modification

    Posted · Edited by fatherbushido
    typos, always typos + edit

    5 hours ago, Nescio said:

    If I recall correctly (@fatherbushido?), splash damage is spread out over the splash area, so a lower radius means the same total amount of damage is concentrated in a smaller area. From 10 to 7 means that the area is half as large, so units inside take double the damage (π*10^2 / π*7^2 = 2.04).

    I don't know what's the current state of the svn, so I will refer to the 0AD a23b state.

    It's always pleasing to see people who don't do random things!

    Indeed it would be more realistic to distribute the effect. What the code do is slightly different.

    EDIT: I didn't see it like that, but that's the same I guess.

    There is a multiplier of the damage with a quadratic falloff in the distance from the impact.

    Looking from above, the damage multiplier reduction looks like that:

    image.png.49f35ce84bed3eebfc69ed12776b099b.png

     

    Again, those numbers are mainly for emergent behavior, not for direct gameplay control.

    For example:

    Damage multiplier in function of the distance between the impact and the target (in blue for radius=10, in red for radius=7). I plotted the left side because it's nicer:

    image.png.1659561b3e846481dfed334432decf9f.png

     

    It's also surprising to see attempts of fine tuning such a number whereas there are many broken things in the splash feature code. @ValihrAnt is doing nice though (and he makes awesome videos)!

     

    • Like 2
    • Thanks 1

  8. Portait icon for all heros

    in Art Development

    Posted

    I looked for an icon for Ptolemy IV and Ptolemy I and I didn't find any.

    for example in 0AD alpha 23 beta, here is the placeholder:
      

    units/ptol_hero_ptolemy_IV.xml:11:    <Icon>units/mace_hero_philip.png</Icon

units/ptol_hero_ptolemy_I.xml:11:    <Icon>units/hele_hero_alexander.png</Icon>

    For Ptolemy I, it's especially annoying because Alexander has a really singular portrait icon.

  9. Armour computations

    in Game Modification

    Posted

    About tooltips, there were discussions long time ago with mainly two schools (and people switching from one to the other):

    - emergent behavior with a lot of stats (damage types, spread, ...) in the templates.

    - gameplay orientated templates (hard counters, classes).

    The idea with the first thing is that you don't have to learn how to play while in the second you just learn the basic rules of the game.

    A simple example is with the spread:

    - a stat which vaguely do something we could call "physical". Firing in a zone with some kind of spatial distribution then checking if there is something at that place...

    - a stat with just the probably to hit. Then if you have decide to hit, it hits.

    Showing the first thing in the tooltip appears completely useless.

    Showing the second thing in the tooltip appears completely useful.

    At some point, there was some kind of hybrid design with diverging intents. I really think that in such kind of game, you should not display all those stats in the tooltips and keeping them in some kind of encyclopedia, structure tree, hardcore extra tooltips panel or whatever.

    50 minutes ago, Boudica said:

    I honestly think there isn't more than like 5 players who know what the numbers really mean.

    ;-)

    And that's a really interesting comment because you will find more than 5k players complaining about that stat!

    • Like 1

  10. Armour computations

    in Game Modification

    Posted · Edited by fatherbushido

    19 minutes ago, Nescio said:

    Because armour is a power law

    Just because you said it 3 times and you like precise things, I think it's more common to say an exponential law here to not have confusion with power law like production time in function of batch size for example.

    Well that's my last useless comment of the day!

  11. current team bonuses

    in Gameplay Discussion

    Posted

    3 hours ago, Genava55 said:

    It is simply the healers that are useless currently in the game.

    It's an excellent start for discussion which will lead to the point of view we consider (random list: [single player, multiplayer, lobby multiplayer, history, realism, code]).

    For example it was suggested that gauls and/or brits could use druid for attacking.

    - history?

    - gameplay?

    - balance?

    - realism?

    - code?

    I think you forum people have the answers!

    (I also think that at this point what started 20 years ago could only survive with mods. Multiplayer lobby player should have their mod, something handled by a lobby admin with a message inviting to use it. I don't know if they do that, but that would be good for us.)

    • Like 2

  12. Armour computations

    in Game Modification

    Posted

    Quote

    why did I wrote the thing above?

    Ah yes I recall. I wanted to make it clear something about the meaning of health - that was the whole purpose of our discussion - but I was a bit sick that week so I explained myself badly :confused:.

    We work in an isolated context where there is attack of a given value, armour/armor of a given level and health of a given value.

    I incurred an attack of value A. What is the benefit on my health H of having  +1 armor? My current hp is multiplied by (H-0.9A) / (H-A) (if A<H).

    Is that true? Perhaps. Is that relevant? I don't think so.

    What is the benefit on the total amount of attack I can handle of having  +1 armor? The total amount of attack I can handle is multiplied by 1/0.9.

    The total health is the total amount of attack I can handle when I have 0 armor. So adding one more level is the same as keeping that level and multiplying the total health by 1/0.9.

    That's what Nescio wrote above and which is relevant for us.

    Tell me if there are flaws somewhere.

    (Now that I write it I recall to have tried to convince someone in the lobby during an hour about that and failing at it - end of my life.)

    PS: @Nescio while you are here, have you a nice way to write ("1/0.9." where "." has different meanings)?

  14. current team bonuses

    in Gameplay Discussion

    Posted

    8 hours ago, Thorfinn the Shallow Minded said:

    The flaw with the Briton team bonus lies in the healer.  Healers alone are simply purposeless unless there is a secondary purpose provided.  I personally wouldn't be against the idea of them converting units, but I'm sure that alternate options; priests served many roles that could be represented such as a simple aura that improves attack or improves gathering speed.  The list goes on.

    The team bonus described in the design doc is:
     

    Quote

     

    Name: Druides

    History: The Druids of the Celts maintained an organized religion that advanced the technology of their people even during wartime.

    Effect: Bonus to tech speed.

     

    Also gaul and brit were the same civ before.

    A good source is:

    https://github.com/JustusAvramenko/delenda_est/blob/master/simulation/data/auras/teambonuses/gaul_player_team_bonus.json

    https://github.com/JustusAvramenko/delenda_est/blob/master/simulation/data/auras/teambonuses/brit_player_team_bonus.json

    (It seems the author of that mod have spent quite a few time in that game universe).

    ;-)

  16. Armour computations

    in Game Modification

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Nescio said:

    An unit with 50 health and 0 armour would take 52 damage, i.e. -2 health left, thus killed in one hit.

    An unit with 50 health and 1 armour would take 0.9×50=46.8 damage, i.e. 3.2 health left, thus surviving the first hit.

    An unit with 50/0.9=55.555 health and 0 armour would take 52 damage, i.e. 3.555 health left, same result as above.

    Sure, excuse me, why did I wrote the thing above?

     

  22. Armour computations

    in Game Modification

    Posted · Edited by fatherbushido
    dashing false things

    On 1/10/2020 at 10:31 PM, Nescio said:

    +1 level is equivalent to 0.9^-1 = +11.1% health

    On 1/11/2020 at 1:05 PM, Nescio said:

    Now health is fundamentally the amount of damage that can be taken. Therefore reducing the damage taken by a factor z is equivalent to increasing the health by a factor 1/z = z^-1. (If every hit inflicts only half the damage, then it'll take twice as long to kill the unit; if the damage per hit remains unchanged but the unit's health is doubled, then it'll also take twice as long to kill the unit.)

    On 1/11/2020 at 1:37 PM, Nescio said:

    Would it make it easier if we'd say that health and armour together result in “survivability”? Or phrase it as time = health / damage?

    On 1/11/2020 at 1:41 PM, fatherbushido said:

    Yes that's it.

    Just to precise, when I say "that's it", I mean that you got my wonder. But I am still not convinced.

    As a simple situation, let's take Health 50, Attack 52 and an Armour passing from 0 to 1. How can we give a sense to "+11.1% health"?

    In fact, the explanation in parentheses has some flaws.

  23. Forum "reactions"

    in Help & Feedback

    Posted

    Hi!

    In the past, there was only one kind of reaction on the forum, perhaps was it Like. It could be confusing to give a like when something sad happens, so I guess it was thought that giving some nuances was better.

    Now we have 5 choices

    Thanks Thanks

    Like Like

    Haha Haha

    Sad Sad

    Confused Confused

    I often see people receiving the last one, without any comments. I guess that if someone is confused, he could just ask clarifications. Last time I received it, I was really disturbed.

    I really think that we could only give positive reactions. If something is not of our taste, one can just skip it or discuss about it.

    Any opinion?

    • Like 3
    • Confused 6

  25. Fork AD

    in Introductions & Off-Topic Discussion

    Posted · Edited by fatherbushido
    EDIT: we choosed the hard way!

    9 minutes ago, Nescio said:

    what's published.

    Not everything related to Zero AD / Wildfire Games is public.

    Some Fork AD things are already public. For example, the screenshots are true screenshots :-)

    With the first release, the code will be released!

    I guessed you wasn't sarcastic with your comment else you would have invited me to read L'Arlésienne.

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