ranged infantry move speed

[Lion.Kanzen]

51 minutes ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

The biggest issue with archers is they rarely actually employ their range, because they are defaulted to shooting the closest unit (this also results in a lot of overkill because a single unit is likely to be the closest for a large percent of a group of archers).

looks like a design error.

This should be changed.

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

29 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

looks like a design error.

This should be changed.

It is currently possible to overcome the ranged units' preference for close targets, but it requires concentration, fast clicks, and good micro. This was the main reason behind the attempts in the past months to make an attack-ground or area-attack mechanic for ranged units (or maybe just archers if it seems right to do so balance wise).

[Yekaterina]

1 hour ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

pike+ archers

Pikeman are incredibly OP at absorbing damage... this is why Ptolemies are OP but Athenians are not. So I think the pikeman did play a significant role in this, especially with the correct composition and the enmy not using pikeman. To snipe units effectively, do experiments in Atlas Editor to see exactly how man arrows you need to kill 1 ranged unit, then divide archers into groups of this size and set them on separate control groups to use as snipers. 

Furthermore, SaidRdz is a very good player so I would expect him to roll with anything. 

Personally I use archers to snipe any enemy unit which deviated from their main ranks, for example if they are trying to dance or if their army was distracted by my dancers. 

 

[Yekaterina]

39 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

rarely actually employ their range,

I have been archer harassed in some 1v1s by Mauryans. Even though I was Ptolemies, there is no way of leaving a skirmish without taking hits because the archers always outrange you and can chase you safely when you want to retreat. 

I also use archers to hit enemy units hiding behind many structures or pathfinding difficulties. I find archers very useful, although I wouldn't spam them as my staple ranged output. 

 

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

10 minutes ago, Sevda said:

To snipe units effectively, do experiments in Atlas Editor to see exactly how man arrows you need to kill 1 ranged unit, then divide archers into groups of this size and set them on separate control groups to use as snipers. 

 

BTW there is another way that I like to use with units that have higher dps like champion archers, crossbowmen, or slingers. Alt (option) allows one target for each unit in your selection. For example, if your enemy lacks final pierce upgrade and you have mace champion hero, or if you have will to fight and champion hero, then you can kill ranged units in one hit with one crossbow, Alt(option) click the enemy units and they will go down as fast as you can click (if you have around 15 crossbows).

I am not sure which method is best but I suspect that there are times to use shift queues or Alt(option) queues.

Edited June 7, 2022 by BreakfastBurrito_007

[real_tabasco_sauce]

1 hour ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

looks like a design error.

This should be changed.

maybe not design error: it makes sense that ranged units firing "at will" would shoot the closest unit (most threatening), but there should other ways to control ranged units, like attack ground, so that the player has another option.

[Lion.Kanzen]

10 minutes ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:

maybe not design error: it makes sense that ranged units firing "at will" would shoot the closest unit (most threatening), but there should other ways to control ranged units, like attack ground, so that the player has another option.

I was thinking concentrated fire and scattered fire.

And also incendiary arrows, less damage, but more fire minimum effect.Similar to total war this last.

[LetswaveaBook]

1 hour ago, Sevda said:

I find archers very useful, although I wouldn't spam them as my staple ranged output. 

I agree with this. They are useful, but not ideal for being the main force of ranged output. The main issue is that 3 out of 4 archer factions don't get a CS slinger or skirmisher and thus are nearly forced to use archers as the main force of ranged output..

 

[faction02]

53 minutes ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

It is currently possible to overcome the ranged units' preference for close targets, but it requires concentration, fast clicks, and good micro. 

or simply a good amount of lag or a pause, then it only requieres a bad internet connection, someone else dropping or a bad excuse. That's where the design flaw is.

[BreakfastBurrito_007]

7 hours ago, LetswaveaBook said:

I agree with this. They are useful, but not ideal for being the main force of ranged output. The main issue is that 3 out of 4 archer factions don't get a CS slinger or skirmisher and thus are nearly forced to use archers as the main force of ranged output.

I wonder if it is ok to add slinger in p2 or javelin in p2 for some of those civs that suffer most from this. If merc cav are eventually nerfed appropriately, this might save some of those civs from being bad.

[Yekaterina]

8 hours ago, BreakfastBurrito_007 said:

I wonder if it is ok to add slinger in p2 or javelin in p2 for some of those civs that suffer most from this. If merc cav are eventually nerfed appropriately, this might save some of those civs from being bad.

Agreed. Carthage already has javelin cavalry and Iberian infantry mercenaries. The troubled ones are Mauryas and Han: they have no mercenary units and no infantry javlins. So I suggest give Mauryas a mercenary skirmisher unit or a citizen one, then let Han have either a mercenary skirmisher or Babarian Javlin Auxiliary. 

[Yekaterina]

Don't touch archers for now, play A26 for a few months then give your opinions. 

@Sevda stop dancing

[Lion.Kanzen]

25 minutes ago, Yekaterina said:

Don't touch archers for now, play A26 for a few months then give your opinions. 

@Sevda stop dancing

you came back That is good.

[Yekaterina]

10 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

you came back That is good.

I didn't go into the lobby or check the forum for 3 months, then today I misclicked on a browser link and came onto the forum

I wonder what people's reaction will be when I return... if anyone still remembers who I am....

[Lion.Kanzen]

2 minutes ago, Yekaterina said:

I didn't go into the lobby or check the forum for 3 months, then today I misclicked on a browser link and came onto the forum

I wonder what people's reaction will be when I return... if anyone still remembers who I am....

Of course we remember you.