===[TASK]=== Crowd Sourced - Illyrians (Faction)

[av93]

Wikipedia talks also about archers

[Lion.Kanzen]

1 minute ago, wackyserious said:

illyrian-portraits.zip 293.56 kB · 0 downloads

Here is the zip file containing the .png for each portrait, could you help me with them? Thanks!

 

Ok later in six hour , time for sleep.

Just now, av93 said:

Wikipedia talks also about archers

But, any visual reference yet...

[wackyserious]

If you could find and work on a potential logo too for later. Thanks and good night!

[Lion.Kanzen]

1 minute ago, wackyserious said:

If you could find and work on a potential logo too for later. Thanks and good night!

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The latter became as important as Illyria as a source of auxiliary recruits, especially cavalry and archers.

Talking about Romans auxiliars...

[Lion.Kanzen]

Uses greek continental style.

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Cynane was half-sister to Alexander the Great, and daughter of Philip II by Audata, an Illyrian princess.

Audata trained her daughter in riding, hunting, and fighting in the Illyrian tradition. Her father gave her in marriage to her cousin Amyntas, by whom she had a daughter and by whose death she was left a widow in 336 BC. In the following year Alexander promised her hand, as a reward for his services, to Langarus, king of the Agrianians, but the intended bridegroom became ill and died.

Cynane continued unmarried, and employed herself in the education of her daughter, Adea or Eurydice, whom she is said to have trained, after the manner of her own education, in martial exercises. When her half-brother Philip Arrhidaeus was chosen king in 323 BC, Cynane determined to marry Eurydice to him, and crossed over to Asia accordingly.

Her influence was probably great, and her project alarmed Perdiccas and Antipater, the former of whom sent his brother Alcetas to meet her on her way and put her to death. Alcetas did so in defiance of the feelings of his troops, and Cynane met her doom with an undaunted spirit. Eurydice's wedding took place, but both daughter and son-in-law were eventually killed by Olympias. In 317 BC, Cassander, after defeating Olympias, buried Cynane with Eurydice and Arrhidaeus at Aegae, the royal burying-place.[1]

Polyaenus writes, "Cynane, the daughter of Philip was famous for her military knowledge: she conducted armies, and in the field charged at the head of them. In an engagement with the Illyrians, she with her own hand slew Caeria their queen; and with great slaughter defeated the Illyrian army."

Not only was she Alexander's sister but commanded a third of his army and fought to defend his kingdom.[2]

 

 

[wackyserious]

I am adding archers at the moment.

[Genava55]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albanian_sworn_virgins

 

[Lion.Kanzen]

7 hours ago, wackyserious said:

I am adding archers at the moment.

The archers have regular bow, don't have "Scythian bow"

[Lion.Kanzen]

first the typical total war info about this.

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While Illyria was known for its light infantry, archery was never a point of pride for the tribes inhabiting the Adriatic coast. Despite the relative dearth of quality timber, Illyrians were adept in the use of the short bow, compensating for poor range and accuracy with increased ammunition for long raids. Better-supplied men were sometimes provided a small shield to protect them from opposing missile fire when they needed to close the distance with superior ranged troops.

https://www.honga.net/totalwar/rome2/unit.php?l=en&v=radious&f=rom_delmatae&u=Gre_Ill_Archers

 

 

Military wiki confirm about this.

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Illyrian archers were used to harass and break up enemy formations, so that other warriors could then get in amongst their enemies. The members of the warband are lightly armed and equipped, relying more on speed as a protection from foes. Any archers caught in the open by cavalry would be in trouble unless they could withdraw to more favorable ground or behind a shield wall of allied warriors. Their simple bows had a short range and were ineffective against even leather armor at a range of 50 to 100 meters. These archers are at their best in wooded country, where their superior stealth skills learned on the hunt can be put to use.

But were kind of trash unit, spameahle and easily to kill.

https://military.wikia.org/wiki/Illyrian_warfare

The short bow, simple bow. But average archery.

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Most Illyrians would have had a couple of javelins, perhaps with a stabbing spear of some sort, though these would probably have been short, with broad heavy heads. Swords were often carried; the curved type similar to the Kopis was popular, as were the long straight slashing blades adopted under Gallic influence. Singlehanded battle axes were very popular and would no doubt be the common side-arm, especially amongst the rank and file. The bow was used to a certain extent but Illyrian archers would only appear in Illyrian armies; if you wanted archers, you hired Cretans.

[...]

Illyrian forces would be mainly composed of unarmoured warriors, equipped with helmet, sword and/or battleaxe, a couple of javelins, and with perhaps a spear. Amongst the graves of the Picenes have come all-iron javelins and spear heads which can only have come from spears of some length, but whether these were in use amongst the Illyrians is unknown. These warriors seem to have had more in common with Celts than Thracians, as they were always getting themselves into trouble by heading at the nearest enemy at full speed, and Philopoemen seems to have spent most of his major battles rescuing Illyrian mercenaries. With regard to formation 1 think you are justified to call them LMi, but MI is a definite possibility, as the Macedonians and Acheans often used them to guard the flanks of a Phalanx, the Peltasts with their inherent desire to skirmish would not really be suitable. An Illyrian army would also field a few poorer "citizens- armed with bow, sling or assorted agricultural implements. It is doubtful it cavalry was used at all. Several ancient authors comment on the Illyrians' expecting their slaves to fight alongside them. This probably means the warriors of subject tribes rather than true slaves, so a considerable number of 'D' class LMI/MI warriors could also be used.

Basically their low levies were slingers and archers.

 

http://home.exetel.com.au/thrace/illyria.htm

 

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The Delmatae were nomadic pastoralist, dressed in a mix of thacian and celtic styles, with fur caps. The Liburnians were Venetic peoples, and equipped like ancient italic warriors, Lapyges and italic eastern coast independant illlyrians were equipped as Italics.

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by Lion.Kanzen

[wackyserious]

I have placed the archer as an auxiliary troop at the barracks, while the skirmisher and spearman are still the default units in the civ file.

[Lion.Kanzen]

1 minute ago, wackyserious said:

I have placed the archer as an auxiliary troop at the barracks, while the skirmisher and spearman are still the default units in the civ file.

I see it more as a basic unit for raiding and protection in case of crisis.

The tier would be skirmisher > slingers > archers.

And supposedly these last ones go Psiloi style.

[wackyserious]

So, Teuta or Cynane? We currently have Agron which is the Husband of Teuta.

[Lion.Kanzen]

30 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

So, Teuta or Cynane? We currently have Agron which is the Husband of Teuta.

Teuta... Is more warlike.

[Lion.Kanzen]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bardylis

This is one most warlike of them. Invaded Macedonians.

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During his reign, Bardylis was able to make the Dardanians one of the most powerful Illyrian states of that time. Under his leadership the Dardanians defeated the Macedonians and Molossians several times and his state reigned over Upper Macedonia and Lynkestis. He also led raids against Epirus but his troops were quickly expelled from that region.

Edited August 1, 2019 by Lion.Kanzen

[wackyserious]

What about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scerdilaidas

He was the commander of the Army both during the reign of Agron and Teuta, and was the most widely involved during the war.

Were the Dardanians celticized? I would want to add Bardylis.

[Lion.Kanzen]

3 hours ago, wackyserious said:

What about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scerdilaidas

He was the commander of the Army both during the reign of Agron and Teuta, and was the most widely involved during the war.

Were the Dardanians celticized? I would want to add Bardylis.

@Genava55

[Genava55]

5 hours ago, wackyserious said:

What about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scerdilaidas

He was the commander of the Army both during the reign of Agron and Teuta, and was the most widely involved during the war.

Were the Dardanians celticized? I would want to add Bardylis.

Bardylis is not celtic. The Celtic influence in the Balkan was mostly on the east with the kingdom of Tylis and the Triballi and on the north with the Scordisci. The Dardanians were beaten but not that much Celticized, most of the Celticized Illyrians and Thracians joined the Scordisci and the Triballi. But it is true that it changed the warfare in the area for a long time, as seen by the Celtic - like weapons used by the Getae and Dacians. 

[Lion.Kanzen]

3 minutes ago, Genava55 said:

Bardylis is not celtic. The Celtic influence in the Balkan was mostly on the east with the kingdom of Tylis and the Triballi and on the north with the Scordisci. The Dardanians were beaten but not that much Celticized, most of the Celticized Illyrians and Thracians joined the Scordisci and the Triballi. But it is true that it changed the warfare in the area for a long time, as seen by the Celtic - like weapons used by the Getae and Dacians. 

Many Getae served under some of these kingdoms in Balkans right?

[wackyserious]

13 minutes ago, Genava55 said:

Bardylis is not celtic. The Celtic influence in the Balkan was mostly on the east with the kingdom of Tylis and the Triballi and on the north with the Scordisci. The Dardanians were beaten but not that much Celticized, most of the Celticized Illyrians and Thracians joined the Scordisci and the Triballi. But it is true that it changed the warfare in the area for a long time, as seen by the Celtic - like weapons used by the Getae and Dacians. 

Could you check the design document at the first post, are we on the right track?

[Genava55]

Example of influence of the Celtic mercenaries in the Illyrian art, right in Gostilj (Srebrenica):

43 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said:

Many Getae served under some of these kingdoms in Balkans right?

The Getae were a threat before the Gallic invasion, as seen by the Getic wars with Lysimachus. After that, it seems to me they were mainly busy in the Northern coast of the Black Sea with the Scythians, the Sarmatians, the Bastarnae and the Scirii.

51 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Could you check the design document at the first post, are we on the right track?

Seems correct. As a general rule, the Illyrians in the south close to their homeland got heavily influenced by the Greeks and the Macedonians. In the North, the Iapodes and Liburnians got mixed and influenced by the Venetian and Hallstatt cultures. Although for the language, I cannot help at all.

[Lion.Kanzen]

20 hours ago, wackyserious said:

illyrian-portraits.zipFetching info...

Here is the zip file containing the .png for each portrait, could you help me with them? Thanks!

 

Time to make the icons, this hour nobody bother me working in the project.

[Lion.Kanzen]

There is.

ilyricumportraits.zip

 

Edited August 2, 2019 by Lion.Kanzen

[Lion.Kanzen]

[Genava55]

[Genava55]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monunius_I