Crowd-Sourced Civ: Seleucids

[Mythos_Ruler]

Some discussion about the Seleucids. I have a draft civ profile up here:

http://trac.wildfire...iv%3A_Seleucids

Please check out the draft above and make suggestions for improvement.

[Lion.Kanzen]

you need that size or original size the emblem? because im not found the original. but must be a Google Drive resource account or a DVd with my old stufff

[LordGood]

It looks an awful lot like macedon...

and we already have 3 hellenistic civilizations

They're getting their own building set yes?

[Lion.Kanzen]

What you mean? Can be more hellenistic kingdoms in the game.

[LordGood]

I may be splitting hairs, but would it be possible to separate the hellensitic building sets by more than just the Civ center?

[Lion.Kanzen]

huh, i agree with this but you know is a lot of work for Enrique and you XD. even finding sources for art.

[Mythos_Ruler]

It looks an awful lot like macedon...

and we already have 3 hellenistic civilizations

They're quite different already even at this early stage of their profile. Also, I've conceptually split the "Hellenistic" factions into two: The Greek States and The Successors. See here:

http://play0ad.com/game-info/factions/

Long story short, each culture gets a common special building and special techs/bonuses. The "Greek States" or "Hellenic States" are Athens, Sparta, and Macedonia. The "Successors" are Macedonia, Seleucids, Ptolemies. See, the Macedonians are the bridge between the two, so get the special building and special tech of each one. Hellenics get the Theater, Successors get the Library, Macedonia gets both.

If we ever add smaller factions, like Thebans and Epirotes, they'd be Hellenic and Successor cultures respectively.

They're getting their own building set yes?

Oh yes. I'd love for them to get their own Hellenistic building set to make them stand out from the Hellenic States culture.

[Lion.Kanzen]

the other can be Minifactions XD.

[LordGood]

I knowww but it would be so cooool!

This game is absolutely beautiful, and I'd like an aesthetic reason to swap out the hellenistic states in my gameplay every once in a while

when the selucids are added that'd be FOUR civilizations with similar building sets

Even the Celtic tribes get different buildings sets now, and there are only two!

[Mythos_Ruler]

I knowww but it would be so cooool!

This game is absolutely beautiful, and I'd like an aesthetic reason to swap out the hellenistic states in my gameplay every once in a while

when the selucids are added that'd be FOUR civilizations with similar building sets

Even the Celtic tribes get different buildings sets now, and there are only two!

Yeah, let's make an all-new Hellenistic building set for the Seleucids.

Their Wonder:

[Lion.Kanzen]

and what is that? XD

[LordGood]

Altar of Zeus!

Bits of the real thing are in a museum in Berlin right?

Edited September 24, 2013 by LordGood

[Lion.Kanzen]

I never seen before that

[Lion.Kanzen]

this could be work for Seleucids

[SMST]

Altar of Zeus!

Bits of the real thing are in a museum in Berlin right?

The Pergamon Altar, and yes, it is in Berlin, and it is awesome. My Greek class went on a trip there once.

[Lion.Kanzen]

huh is Pergamon Altar XD, i knew that Wonder but i don't know the Name that Zeus Altar.

the emblem i was Make it in 11 April 2013 Source:

http://www.wildfireg...68

Edited September 24, 2013 by Lion.Kanzen

[LordGood]

awh, you lucky brony you

I'd love to go to Europe

[Lion.Kanzen]

me too, first Rome, Later Berlin and maybe Paris.

[Nolanjoker]

wow, i want this one, they had best units in that timeframe.

phalanx

cataphract

horse archer

camel riders

Legionaries

[The Crooked Philosopher]

wow, i want this one, they had best units in that timeframe.

phalanx

cataphract

horse archer

camel riders

Legionaries

Some unit like imitation legionaries have little evidence to support its existence and camel riders have little military value.

[The Crooked Philosopher]

The phalanx or Pezhetairos looks like Macedonian instead of Seleucid, we should be careful if we are going to create the unit roster.

[Nolanjoker]

From Appian's Roman History: The Mithridatic War, 87: Quote: Mithridates manufactured arms in every town. The soldiers he recruited were almost wholly Armenians. From these he selected the bravest to the number of about 70,000 foot and half that number of horse and dismissed the rest. He divided them into companies and cohorts as nearly as possible according to the Italian system, and turned them over to Pontic officers to be trained.

[Nolanjoker]

In Rome: Total War, the Seleucids are given the most diverse army of any faction in the game, with units including phalanxes, legionaries, elephants, companions, cataphracts, and scythed chariots. The Seleucid’s historical elite phalanx, the Silver Shields (Argyriaspids) are included, both in phalanx and legionnaire form. The Silver Shield phalanx, as well as other sarissa phalanxes, is conspicuously underequppted for late Macedonian infantry, which was more heavily armored than the earlier infantry of Alexander the Great. The “legionnaire” version of the Silver Shields is more inaccurate. While part of the Silver Shields did adopt the more flexible Roman-style equipment after the defeat at Magnesia, they did not wear segmented Imperial Roman armor, which did not appear until three centuries after the creation of the Silver Shield Legionnaires. A more accurate representation of Silver Shield Legionaires would be something like the Roman Principes. An interesting observation is that when playing as the Seleucids, it is possible to build Silver Shield Legionnaires before the Romans have access to their own proper, post-Marian legionnaires. The Selecuids are given companion cavalry, cataphracts, scythed chariots, and armored war elephants, all of these are mentioned in historical text. The Seleucid cataphract in Rome: Total War, identical in appearance and combat to those of Armenia and Parthia, is actually based off a well-known wall drawing in Dura Europos drawn a few centuries after the timeframe of the game. Whether this depiction of a Seleucid cataphract is correct is difficult to determine due to the scarcity of evidence.

[The Crooked Philosopher]

In Rome: Total War, the Seleucids are given the most diverse army of any faction in the game, with units including phalanxes, legionaries, elephants, companions, cataphracts, and scythed chariots. The Seleucid’s historical elite phalanx, the Silver Shields (Argyriaspids) are included, both in phalanx and legionnaire form. The Silver Shield phalanx, as well as other sarissa phalanxes, is conspicuously underequppted for late Macedonian infantry, which was more heavily armored than the earlier infantry of Alexander the Great. The “legionnaire” version of the Silver Shields is more inaccurate. While part of the Silver Shields did adopt the more flexible Roman-style equipment after the defeat at Magnesia, they did not wear segmented Imperial Roman armor, which did not appear until three centuries after the creation of the Silver Shield Legionnaires. A more accurate representation of Silver Shield Legionaires would be something like the Roman Principes. An interesting observation is that when playing as the Seleucids, it is possible to build Silver Shield Legionnaires before the Romans have access to their own proper, post-Marian legionnaires. The Selecuids are given companion cavalry, cataphracts, scythed chariots, and armored war elephants, all of these are mentioned in historical text. The Seleucid cataphract in Rome: Total War, identical in appearance and combat to those of Armenia and Parthia, is actually based off a well-known wall drawing in Dura Europos drawn a few centuries after the timeframe of the game. Whether this depiction of a Seleucid cataphract is correct is difficult to determine due to the scarcity of evidence.

Rome: Total War was not a good source for references, so if you want real references please don't use Rome:Total War.

About these Argyraspides, 0 AD have them but i think they need a special option like a re-arm with new weapons like sarissa and become a different unit.

About the Cataphract cavalry you mentioned, are they belongs to the Seleucid? If not please don't include it! The fact is Seleucid have Cataphract cavalry, but their identity was shrouded in mystery and they could be Persians, Medians, or Seleucid cavalry unit armed like cataphract with Hellenic armaments. Due to lack of evidence, some skeptic readers and researchers questioned the existence of these units.

There's a website who have some clue about the so called "Cataphract cavalry", here's the address: http://www.earlyridinggroup.org/research_cataphracts.html and i hope that may help.

Edited September 25, 2013 by The Crooked Philosopher

[The Crooked Philosopher]

From Appian's Roman History: The Mithridatic War, 87: Quote: Mithridates manufactured arms in every town. The soldiers he recruited were almost wholly Armenians. From these he selected the bravest to the number of about 70,000 foot and half that number of horse and dismissed the rest. He divided them into companies and cohorts as nearly as possible according to the Italian system, and turned them over to Pontic officers to be trained.

We're talking about Seleucids not Pontus, please find another reliable source of information.