Roads: Roads? Roads!

[eduh]

Or maybe roads that are automatically built and only change the texture of the map, but don't give any benefits, like Empires, Dawn of the Modern World.

In this game, each time you build a building, a road links to the network

http://www.google.es/imgres?q=empires+dawn+of+the+modern+world&um=1&hl=es&safe=strict&client=safari&sa=N&rls=en&biw=1437&bih=760&tbm=isch&tbnid=nmI9sM88fzcS2M:&imgrefurl=http://www.knowledgesutra.com/discuss/tftmdt-empires-dawn-modern.html&imgurl=http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eXuQpz2EMG8/0.jpg&w=480&h=360&ei=EFFHUPjcIdKX0QXzmICIDQ&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=782&vpy=455&dur=1306&hovh=194&hovw=259&tx=132&ty=96&sig=112759824945151730934&page=2&tbnh=133&tbnw=177&start=26&ndsp=30&ved=1t:429,r:21,s:26,i:223

http://www.google.es/imgres?q=empires+dawn+of+the+modern+world&um=1&hl=es&safe=strict&client=safari&sa=N&rls=en&biw=1437&bih=760&tbm=isch&tbnid=cGZk_yeELP4e4M:&imgrefurl=http://worthplaying.com/article/2003/12/1/reviews/13974/images/21397/&imgurl=http://worthplaying.com/wpimages/e/m/empiresdawnofthemodernworld/21397.jpg&w=1024&h=768&ei=EFFHUPjcIdKX0QXzmICIDQ&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=840&vpy=303&dur=2095&hovh=194&hovw=259&tx=195&ty=110&sig=112759824945151730934&page=3&tbnh=138&tbnw=196&start=56&ndsp=30&ved=1t:429,r:9,s:56,i:281

empires dawn of the modern world

[AllenY]

Maybe when you build a road, it is ignored unless you select your unit and make it snap onto the road manually?

I've seen roads implemented great in Imperium Romanum but that's a city building game.

[NoMolester]

You could give weights to the squares of the terrain grid, if they have a road on the square you give them less weight, when a unit tries to go from point a to point b they will calculate the number of weights in the possible paths and follow the one that requires less weight. And so they will always try to follow the road.

[Shafe88]

What would be cool when building roads if you could build bridges too.

[quantumstate]

You could give weights to the squares of the terrain grid, if they have a road on the square you give them less weight, when a unit tries to go from point a to point b they will calculate the number of weights in the possible paths and follow the one that requires less weight. And so they will always try to follow the road.

This conflicts with making the pathfinder run really fast. Potentially you could do it but we decided it wasn't worthwhile trying when we have enough trouble as it is. Apparently for AoE2 they had a developer spend a whole year of full time work on the pathfinder which gives an idea of how it can be tricky.

[Pedro Falcão]

Apparently for AoE2 they had a developer spend a whole year of full time work on the pathfinder which gives an idea of how it can be tricky.

When i first played AoE2 (I think i was 8-9 yrs old) i noticed that my workers didn't get stuck on each other as they did in AoE1 when there were many working close.

[NoMolester]

This conflicts with making the pathfinder run really fast. Potentially you could do it but we decided it wasn't worthwhile trying when we have enough trouble as it is. Apparently for AoE2 they had a developer spend a whole year of full time work on the pathfinder which gives an idea of how it can be tricky.

darn O.o

What kind of algorithms are you using for the pathfinding.

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

The better idea for now is doing shift + right click commands to your units in order to have them follow your desired path.

[quantumstate]

darn O.o

What kind of algorithms are you using for the pathfinding.

Currently there are a couple of forms of A*. The long range one is a standard grid based A* but then there is a short range one which uses more exact geometry directly from the entities which is used to construct a network which A* is run on. (The differences between the two are responsible for siege and ships getting stuck currently.)

[NoMolester]

Why are you using two different algorithms, i supose that the long range doesnt need all the processing and exactitude that the short one needs so you made two of them to waste less processing ppower in the long walks?

And how does the computer knows which one to use, with a minimum distance?

And how are you going to solve the ship problem (i did notice it when i was playing)?

And what possible solutions do you have for an hipothethic road implementations?

[quantumstate]

Why are you using two different algorithms, i supose that the long range doesnt need all the processing and exactitude that the short one needs so you made two of them to waste less processing ppower in the long walks?

And how does the computer knows which one to use, with a minimum distance?

And how are you going to solve the ship problem (i did notice it when i was playing)?

And what possible solutions do you have for an hipothethic road implementations?

I won't go into large amounts of technical detail here, there has been some work on changing the pathfinder implementation which has stalled. The long pathfinder creates a series of waypoints which are a fixed distance apart, the short pathfinder routes between these. The short pathfinder handles dynamic things such as other units and also creates more direct paths rather than tile based movement.

The solution for roads is to not have roads. The team will not encourage implementation of roads for part 1. If some contributor came up with a wonderful well performing pathfinder which works with roads then it might be integrated but this is very unlikely.

[NoMolester]

I won't go into large amounts of technical detail here, there has been some work on changing the pathfinder implementation which has stalled. The long pathfinder creates a series of waypoints which are a fixed distance apart, the short pathfinder routes between these. The short pathfinder handles dynamic things such as other units and also creates more direct paths rather than tile based movement.

The solution for roads is to not have roads. The team will not encourage implementation of roads for part 1. If some contributor came up with a wonderful well performing pathfinder which works with roads then it might be integrated but this is very unlikely.

Oh, now i understand. I am thinking in studing a masters in AI perhaps in o year, i like all this pathfinding stuff is very interesting.

The long algorithm takes in account all the non visible terrain? I mean, if there could be black fog of war and how does the algorithm would work with it?

[Lion.Kanzen]

Oh, now i understand. I am thinking in studing a masters in AI perhaps in o year, i like all this pathfinding stuff is very interesting.

The long algorithm takes in account all the non visible terrain? I mean, if there could be black fog of war and how does the algorithm would work with it?

if you solve that, problem we make a Statue from you XD

[NoMolester]

so i guess the answer is no Y.Y

[Lion.Kanzen]

so i guess the answer is no Y.Y

yeah its very hard to solve

[NoMolester]

Well , I think that, before start thinking in ways to improve pathfinding gameplay (roads and stuff), we should solve our current pathfinding problems. That is a huge problem if we can't have a descent fog of war without pathfinding mayhem.

I wish i could help but i have NO IDEA how to solve those problems nor i have any suggestions for it; so the only thing i can do is to wish the best for the programers involved.

[ribez]

Well , I think that, before start thinking in ways to improve pathfinding gameplay (roads and stuff), we should solve our current pathfinding problems. That is a huge problem if we can't have a descent fog of war without pathfinding mayhem.

I wish i could help but i have NO IDEA how to solve those problems nor i have any suggestions for it; so the only thing i can do is to wish the best for the programers involved.

look to these threads, you will find some useful inputs

http://www.wildfiregames.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=15363

http://www.wildfiregames.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=13042

http://www.wildfiregames.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=15270

[quantumstate]

The pathfinder does not account for fog of war in any way. It is highly unlikely that this will ever change. Fog of war is a graphical effect that only the player sees.