Marian Legionary and Reforms

[Mega Mania]

Roman Republic's armed forces consists of Hastatus (Principes), Triarius, Velites, Eques, Extraordinarius and Equites Consulares with additional siege equipment. But how do 0 AD team implement the change within the Roman Army ranks?

These are the questions:

1. How do 0 AD team introduce new legionary unit?

2. Will the Non-Marian units (Hastatus (Principes), Triarius, Velites, Eques, Extraordinarius and Equites Consulares) become obsolete when Marian Reforms introduced?

3. How to balance the Roman Army after Marian Reforms?

4. Will the Marian Legionaries and other auxiliary units become citizen soldier?

5. Is there any possibility a new Champion unit appear in barracks and forts?

Edited October 17, 2013 by Mega Mania

[Lion.Kanzen]

Second part. Check the Roman Civ Profile

http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Civ%3A_Romans_Republican

"

Keeping with the design approach that a civilisation should be represented at a specific time in history, the Pre-Imperial (Early) Roman civilisation is set in the Polybian period of the Roman Republic, during the Second Punic War (218-201 BC)."

[Gallaecio]

If there is ever a Total War-like campaign mode (which I’m realy hoping for), in-game reforms would make sense. But for the current AoE-like gameplay I think it does not so much.

As Lion says, post-Marian units are planned for the second part of the game.

[Zeta1127]

Actually, as I understand it, the Marian Reforms have been implemented as a special technology for the Republican Romans. The Marian Reforms replace all Republican Infantry with Marian Legionary, a champion swordsman, and allowing for the training of Numidian Cavalry. This has a major economic impact, since only the Marian Legionary can be trained in place of the Republican Infantry and the Legionary's only economic function to build Army Camps, Siege Walls, and Fortresses, making it a late game attempt at a game changer. I am pretty sure this special technology was implemented because the Marian Reforms occurred during the time frame of Empires Ascendant.

Edited October 18, 2013 by Zeta1127

[Lion.Kanzen]

If we put Marisn Reforms, we Have put Polybian, Camilian reform and Imperial reform.

If that happens see how units can be.

http://www.moddb.com/games/rise-of-nations-thrones-and-patriots/news/faction-preview-the-romans-part-1

Edited October 18, 2013 by Lion.Kanzen

[Mega Mania]

If all Roman infantry unit become Champion unit, then who will provide them missile support? Plus Roman army don't just rely on 1 type of cavalry unit.

Edited October 18, 2013 by Mega Mania

[Lion.Kanzen]

But hare builder but not gatherer.

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

I am not actually opposed at all to the idea of introducing reforms to the Romans in game. It would introduce an intriguing aspect to the game which could overlap over to other nations. To that extent then, the Macedonians could commence the game with hoplites and then alter them to pikemen, the Spartans could perhaps do the same later, the Athenians could have a similar mechanic with upgrading their peltasts to ridiculously powerful javelin/hoplite hybrids. Even the Persians could have a technology for changing their infantry to a hoplite form.

[Lion.Kanzen]

I agree with thorfin, but I thing I thinks, this is hard to implement, I say are many reforms

With roman 3 or 4 in this time frame.

With Macedon 1 or 2

With Spartans

With Ptolemies

With Seleucids,

So this change many desing documents. I asked this before, and the answer was that, the document design and second part we can enjoy the changes.

But with tech tree, where put the reforms, at the end? Or following a series of changes?

[Sighvatr]

If Romans get their reforms, then I would like to see romanized infantry for the Ptolemies, Mythos.

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

The primary suggestion I make does not consist of that many difficulties. Allow me to elaborate. For the Romans, the Marian reforms would only require one unit, which exists in game. Obviously a previous one could be introduced if possible, but even that is unnecessary. The Spartan reforms would be quite simple I should think. The Perioikoi could possibly become hoplite peltast hybrids at some point while the Spartiate would change from a hoplite to a pikeman. (Another unit which exists.) The Athenian reform would be similarly simple. (The champions are post-reform so they could be unlocked or upgraded upon research while peltasts require only a few changes which are not that hard. (consider the possibility of using Macedonian skirmisher assets)) The Macedonians would be pretty easy to do also since it requires simply using assets of the generic Hellenes. That leaves it to the Ptolemies and the Seleucids, and I am having a difficult time envisioning much anything for them other than Romanization as Sighvatr mentioned.

[Mega Mania]

The following discussion focus solely on Marian reforms not other faction related reforms. Due to the nature of the title, discussion regarding other faction's reform is acceptable.

Edited October 23, 2013 by Mega Mania

[Lion.Kanzen]

Is because if you give to other factions something, you must balancing for all.

But why only Marian, and policy an and Camilian not?

[Mega Mania]

All i wish to know is Marian Reform but unfortunately i overlook the importance of Camillian Reform.

But think again, how much do we know about the Roman army before Camillian Reform? How far will 0 AD go in order to recreate the Pre-Camillian Roman army?

Edited October 23, 2013 by Mega Mania

[Mega Mania]

Perhaps you should visit http://www.roman-empire.net/index.html.

Hopefully it helps.

[newcivs]

excuseme if i am trolling, but we can put to train this unit on the castra vellum????

[Lion.Kanzen]

What unit?

[Mythos_Ruler]

All i wish to know is Marian Reform but unfortunately i overlook the importance of Camillian Reform.

But think again, how much do we know about the Roman army before Camillian Reform? How far will 0 AD go in order to recreate the Pre-Camillian Roman army?

The game represents the Romans during the 2nd and 3rd Punic Wars.

It is probable we will not put in the Marian Reforms, but we can talk about that more when more features are added to the game.

[Zeta1127]

Then what is with that special technology on the Republican Romans civ profile?

[Mega Mania]

What Mike wish to said since 0 AD was still under development, so it would be too early to discuss such tech and the effects of the reform and not to mention about implementing such reforms to the game.

[Thorfinn the Shallow Minded]

The following discussion focus solely on Marian reforms not other faction related reforms. Due to the nature of the title, discussion regarding other faction's reform is acceptable.

Actually it is relevant to mention other reforms, but since you yourself stated that the title makes such topic acceptable, I suppose we are in agreement. The thing that should be asked is if there would be any game improvement made by implementing any of the above reforms and if so how?

[Mega Mania]

Forgive my negligence, at first i thought it was a discussion about Marian Reforms, but i've never expect other reforms are included.

About the reforms in the game, it would be the team's decision.

[Lion.Kanzen]

Why you expect other are no in game? You see spartan pikemen are in the game like legionnaires. Remember the game is not Rome Total War. Is no focus in a single faction.

[Mega Mania]

Yes i know that, i'm not expecting R:TW but initially i make a mistake when i start the topic.

[Lion.Kanzen]

You can change first topic and then full editor and there you can change the name topic.