Farms

[Alpha of the Eagles]

well i dont think the farmer would really just be doing nothing; he'd be working towards reseeding the farm (ie, building it) and then get right to work

Then you have the Age og Kings system, just that you don't have to bother reseeding it manually. So like, a lazy version of it.

[gudo]

The AoK system didn't auto re-seed indefinently. You had to tell it like "re-seed the next three farms that expire." It was perfect, with one execption. It would re-seed farms no matter where they were. A few times, a farm waaaayyy out in the boonies would get re-seeded and I didn't want it too.

Instead of having the re-seed button on the farmstead, (like AoK) it should be on each farm. "re-seed THIS farm when it expires" vs "re-seed ANY farm that expires"

[Mythos_Ruler]

Instead of having the re-seed button on the farmstead, (like AoK) it should be on each farm. "re-seed THIS farm when it expires" vs "re-seed ANY farm that expires"

I would approve of this if I can double-click and/or shift-click multiple farms and click this button for all of the ones I select.

[feneur]

I would approve of this if I can double-click and/or shift-click multiple farms and click this button for all of the ones I select.

(Should be possible, hopefully we'll be able to select all buildings/multiple buildings and queue production in all of them at the same time, so this shouldn't be an exception. The only difficult thing would probably be for things like technologies which can only be done once. Either they should not show up when multiple buildings are selected or perhaps they could get executed in the first building selected.)

[plumo]

An AOK rip-off named Highland Warriors had a system with seasons. In winter: snow : no farming possible, i think.

Even though it is a terrible game, some ideas are worth exploring, like civilians receiving XP for a certain resource they harvest , etc.

[oshron]

I would approve of this if I can double-click and/or shift-click multiple farms and click this button for all of the ones I select.

i dont see any reason why that wouldnt be possible; its the same basic concept as selecting multiple soldiers and telling them to attack the same unit together. this could also apply to other buildings: suppose you select two different barracks and then click on the swordsman unit's button, then both barracks will begin producing that swordsman simultaneously

An AOK rip-off named Highland Warriors had a system with seasons. In winter: snow : no farming possible, i think.

Even though it is a terrible game, some ideas are worth exploring, like civilians receiving XP for a certain resource they harvest , etc.

that sounds like a great idea to me. i remember reading in the design document that it was planned in the polar map that snow would partially melt in the spring and summer and allow you to mine for ore and stone only during those times; it would come to a standstill during the winter, though no mention of farming would come up. disabling the use of farms and perhaps some forage sites would also be a pretty cool detail for maps with seasons enabled

speaking of seasons, what exactly will be the effect of seasons on terrain and objects? will snow just fade in on buildings and the ground when it turns to winter? if not, i think that would be a GREAT detail, and that it would also be really cool if there were some terrain textures for, say, grass that got snow and some that didnt. this would be good if someone wants to portray a region where it gets cold and snows in the winter, but not so much that it ever forms in low-lying or more southerly regions. my own area, southern california, is a prime example of this: it doesnt snow here in the winter, but it CAN get cold, and you can see snow on the mountains in the distance.

now suppose this was extended to a map which simulated a whole continent, like this map of europe:

obviously, africa and the middle east arent gonna freeze over in the winter, but neither are spain, italy, or southern france, while scandinavia, northern russia, and iceland will become covered with snow, even though these regions will presumably use alot of the same grass textures (at least in the current specs of the game, as i understand it). now what sense would that make if, in winter, spain essentially became a glacier? there should be 2-4 different versions of each textures, or however many are necessary to simulate a realistic continent in each season, that show the transition of lower elevations and latitudes into higher ones. so while spain would stay the same in a map like this as you go into winter, northern france and southern england would become partially snowbound while scandinavia would freeze over completely. i noticed this particular problem in a map of the world in an AOM mod where northern canada and eastern russia were permanently snowed over, but scandinavia wasnt, at all times in the game

[Mythos_Ruler]

Count on seasons being pushed back to Part II.

[oshron]

even so, isnt it worth discussing? since seasons are something thats pretty much definitely gonna be included

[Critter]

As long as we don't have to keep manually reseeding the farms, it would be better if it was a toggle.

What about animal farms? Like a dairy or just an enclosed pen? That could be cool. I also loved how animals were a renewable resource in Empire Earth.

[Yihka]

Would be really great to see having farms different kinds of building types:

A Farm

A Animal Farm

A tree farm

etc. All of these would be the same and will just be there to make the game look more interesting.

Or just farms with different kinds of colours. Would be nice.

[Mythos_Ruler]

You will eventually be able to put domesticated animals in the Corral for a constant source of food (and other benefits).

[Alpha of the Eagles]

A Animal Farm

Oh dear.

Pro tip: if there's a pig named Napoleon there, make sausage a.s.a.p.

[satchitb]

Oh dear.

Pro tip: if there's a pig named Napoleon there' date=' make sausage a.s.a.p.[/quote']

+1000 for awesome literary reference.

Until seasons get implemented, how about a Scandinavia-type map where you can't build farms, or maybe, you can only build farms in part of the map (grass, rather than snow). That would be killer.

[Arthur_D]

Yeah, we do have farms here in Scandinavia, so a complete abundance would be weird.

[Critter]

You will eventually be able to put domesticated animals in the Corral for a constant source of food (and other benefits).

Sweeeeeeeeeet. Now I can imagine the villagers having scrambled eggs from their chicken coop.

[Rasunadon]

This is my opinion:

Farms around farmsteads could be able to be ordered in farmsteads too and not only in menus of your units. These four farms would be replaced automatically (but not free). Farmstead count will be limited to 2-3 per territory (what about farm territories with lack of metal and stone but allowing up to 10 farmsteads? maybe lowlands next to river?).

You would be able to build farms nearly wherever you want them (where it is at least a bit flat so no cliffs, no mountain peeks). But the farms placement would effect its yield. So if you built a farm in the rocky valley it will be really ineffective. On the other side, farms near rivers (and after implementing seasons in flooded area (Nil!)) will give you twice food than "normal" ones.

@feneur: Why couldn't technologies be researched in several buildings? If you assign to that research for example three smithies, it will cost you three times (maybe less or only once?) the cost of that technology but the research will be done three times quicker.

[andreaplanet]

I would try to replicate history as much as possible, that is, you can have as much farm land as you want, but it requires many workers to get just some food. Today just one Thresher machine does the work of various hundred farmers. I would time limit the amount of food you can collect without the need to do any micromanagment. So you need a lot of land to feed a city.

Also maybe there should be a basic need of constant food to maintain the citizens, else they would slowly die for starvation like in the history. I'm still unsure about this idea.

[ribez]

I would try to replicate history as much as possible, that is, you can have as much farm land as you want, but it requires many workers to get just some food. Today just one Thresher machine does the work of various hundred farmers. I would time limit the amount of food you can collect without the need to do any micromanagment. So you need a lot of land to feed a city.

Also maybe there should be a basic need of constant food to maintain the citizens, else they would slowly die for starvation like in the history. I'm still unsure about this idea.

i like the starvation concept

It make sense to do raids to enemy's farms, without the need to attack the city, at least at the beginning of the game. And it forces a defensive player to extend the zone to defend.

Edited June 9, 2011 by ribez

[_miso]

If I could give u a little advice, I do not think that fixed positions of farmsteads or slots for farms and similar things will be good idea. After few games online u can predict position of this positions etc. As someone said, Aoe was something like unlimited, maps were randomly created ,u could build as many buildings as u want etc. I agree with pop limit thou. It is more friendly to player if he can build as much farms as he want and everywhere he want, this freedom leads to joy. xD

[gudo]

If I could give u a little advice, I do not think that fixed positions of farmsteads or slots for farms and similar things will be good idea. After few games online u can predict position of this positions etc.

Exactly my thoughts. Another thing to consider is "How much effort would this take to code?" Probably more than it's worth. If people making too many farms becomes a serious problem, then we can just the farms with the nerf stick a lot simpler than coding in a mechanism where farms can only be build in a few, certain locations.

Another thing to think about with limited farming space is the effect on gameplay and available strategies. If each territory has a limit of three farms, then you can be absolutely sure that each and every player will have all three farms per territory. If they don't, their opponent might and that puts them at a food production dis-advantage. Now suppose one of those players uses a strat that relies on high food cost soldiers, while the other uses low food cost soldiers. With limited farming space, assuming each player has max farms (and why wouldn't they?) We can see that the first player with the food heavy strat is a disadvantage. He can't produce more food than the other player produces, but he needs more than the other player does.

[andreaplanet]

i like the starvation concept

It make sense to do raids to enemy's farms, without the need to attack the city, at least at the beginning of the game. And it forces a defensive player to extend the zone to defend.

hehe, a typical middle age strategy when attacking a fortress/city. With a siege you waited months around the fortress.

A note is that probably the wall cost should be much more expensive and/or the farm land should be much wider. In History creating a wall that include also the farm land was far too costly/unpractical. And also to be effective you need soldiers watching the wall, else the attackers could easily build a hill on top of the wall and climb it.

For example Rome had two big walls, the inner Servian Wall build in IV B.C. (red line) and the outer Aurelian wall (black line) build in 4 years between year 271 and 275. The big Aurelian wall where long 12 miles but also at that time the population of Rome where around 500.000 inhabitants! So like nowadays cities, the farming/food creation was done always outside the city walls.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servian_Wall

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurelian_Walls

Another example the ancient Etruscan (later Roman) city of Rusellae (build on a 600ft hill) had a wide and big wall and was build around VII B.C. The walls are nearly 2 miles in circumference and consist of somewhat irregular, unworked blocks of travertine often measuring as much as 9x4 ft (2.75x1.2 m). Still within the "limited" wall area farming was just not possible a part of some trees maybe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rusellae

http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Area_archeologica_di_Roselle

[Mythos_Ruler]

The Etruscan city of Veii, just North of Rome, also had very impressive fortifications, having been built atop a rocky plateau.

A note is that probably the wall cost should be much more expensive and/or the farm land should be much wider. In History creating a wall that include also the farm land was far too costly/unpractical.

That's exactly why I proposed the "curtain wall" concept.

[Rasunadon]

Another thing to think about with limited farming space is the effect on gameplay and available strategies. If each territory has a limit of three farms, then you can be absolutely sure that each and every player will have all three farms per territory. If they don't, their opponent might and that puts them at a food production dis-advantage. Now suppose one of those players uses a strat that relies on high food cost soldiers, while the other uses low food cost soldiers. With limited farming space, assuming each player has max farms (and why wouldn't they?) We can see that the first player with the food heavy strat is a disadvantage. He can't produce more food than the other player produces, but he needs more than the other player does.

1) So he should use another strategy.

2) Wouldn`t be those expensive ones better warriors?

EDIT:

3) I was talking only about limited farmsteads not farms.

Edited June 9, 2011 by Rasunadon

[Sebovzeoueb]

Also maybe there should be a basic need of constant food to maintain the citizens, else they would slowly die for starvation like in the history. I'm still unsure about this idea.

This worked pretty well on Cossacks, as well as needing gold to maintain mercenaries and certain ships, if I remember rightly.