[A25 Feedbacks from testing]

19 minutes ago, chrstgtr said:

Clicking 2 buttons (to select all barracks and the unit type) every ~10 seconds isn't fast. The game consists of essentially two elements: economy and military. And, the economy is composed of essentially two parts: gathering and spending resources. What you propose is to eliminate roughly 1/4 of the entire game. A large portion of that 1/4 will already be eliminated by allowing units to be auto-trained. But you want more. Equalizing automated gameplay (that could literally be done while you sleep) with the play of someone who puts forth much more effort (which is still just two clicks every ~10 seconds) should not be done. 

You misunderstood what I meant (Maybe I didn't explain well enough what I meant). I didn't say I want it equalized, I said clicking the same button over and over again is repetitive and kind of boring, therefore an automation here is different than an automation of the build order.

I'm not against to have an advantage doing in manually  (batch training), I am against that this alone should decide if someone wins.

[A25 Feedbacks from testing]

5 hours ago, chrstgtr said:

Just because it is possible to automate something doesn't mean that is should be automated. For example, someone could write a script that does a perfect eco build. If that script was available to everyone then it wouldn't be a problem by your criteria. However, such a script would fundamentally change the game (for the worse) by eliminating all eco considerations. Players should benefit for doing the effort themselves. 

You're correct with your statement but your conclusion does not fit to the autoquqeue for me.

When you automate the build order you loose strategic decisions, which takes away the fun.

When you automate training you loose the need to reclick the same button over and over again every few seconds, which increases the fun for me.

 

Citing from here: https://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/0AD_The_Vision#Snares

The ability to be able to click a button fast should not decide who wins, the strategic thought process behind it should.

[Player positions.]

11 minutes ago, alre said:

mmmh if someone wants to play like mainland but with players in a row instead of a semicircle, (playerPlacementRiver), one can already play Scythian Rivulet. Is mainland mandatory somehow?

No, just wanted tho show @LetswaveaBook how such a change would look like and where he can find how this is done.

[Player positions.]

3 hours ago, LetswaveaBook said:

In drawig number 5 I put the pocket player closer to the center

Here is a mod which does that for Mainland:different_starting_position.zip

The teams are placed in two lines parallel to each other.

 

If you want to know more you need to check out the scripts which generate the different maps and the rmgen and rmgen-common libraries.

 

 

[Player positions.]

6 looks like a lot of fun. Not sure how different 5 or 7 would feel.

[Tasklist for closing out A25]

I wouldn't mind it. As all civs have the option to get rams, elephants don't need to have this huge crush damage anyways.

[r25624, mercenaries]

19 minutes ago, LetswaveaBook said:

If the proposed differential is accepted

The differential has already been accepted and you can also already test the (pre)release/ test candidate, which includes this change:

 

So you can test how these changes play out in game

[How to make a differential.]

Those pages are very helpful:

https://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/SubmittingPatches

https://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/BuildInstructions

https://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/BuildInstructionsGettingTheCode

 

So basically:

Download TortoiseSVN.

Clone the official repo.

Change some code.

Test if it works.

Save the change as a patch.

Upload it manually to phabricator.

 

You can also use command line to do that but it's more complicated to setup.

 

And I'm sure @Stan` or other people at the irc channel will help you get ready to make a patch (although a good time may be after the feature freeze and important bug fixing that is done after that )

 

[Tasklist for closing out A25]

 

3 hours ago, wraitii said:

XP trickle at stable & elephant stable: D3994

3 hours ago, wraitii said:

Lower champion Elephant armour to pierce slightly: D4058

3 hours ago, wraitii said:

Add ram to Roman siege camp & increase cost slightly: D4080

yes.

Don't have a strong opinion on the other ones.

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

Also thinking about including only one tip for the formations.

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

Thinking about either adding tips for all the biomes or removing the savanna one. Opinions?

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

24 minutes ago, Langbart said:

• Catapult: Have all catapults this flaming projectile?
• - Don't know to be honest, but would that matter that much?
• Experience trickle: The picture on the right, but I would include the "Experience Status bar" ( see Options--> Game Session)
• -sure
• Fishing: Can the fish swarm be more noticeable, its barely visible from this angle.
• - maybe the one from DE is better?
• Forge: I would just show one forge, the most beautiful one.
• -which one?
• Map Flare: The one on the bottom, but I would remove that little black bar below the minimap.
• -sure
• Autoqueue: Not a fan of these arrows, do not fit well in there.
• Resource counter: Not a fan of these arrows, do not fit well in there.
• -so just without arrows?

 

28 minutes ago, Langbart said:

Missing, will those be updated as well? (Link to the current pictures)

long term I want to update them, but no time till feature freeze unfortunately, so I will either include the ones from DE if they look better or maybe update just some of those.

Also long term we should think more about what information should really be displayed there and make an extensive list, but that won't happen for a25.

 

About the Experience trickle: Would be good to just include it in the Baracks, stable and elephant stable pictures.

 

 

[on "push" mechanic]

9 hours ago, ChronA said:

Choke points have less gameplay impact. This limits the ability of map designers to finesse away certain balance issues, and reduces gameplay diversity. (See this situation for an example of choke points not working: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPuNEQEomGQ&t=2229s).

True, but choke points only working because of bad unit movement and pathfinding seems also bad to me From my point of view, choke point are restrictive, not because only few units can pass is, but because you can realistically block it with wall and palisades.

9 hours ago, ChronA said:

Same story with attack surface-area and concavity.

Well but for which attacks do you need surface-area? Not sure if I understand your point. Do you think catapults will be too strong because they can theoretically affect more units with their splash damage?

9 hours ago, ChronA said:

It also reduces combat readability and control, which makes it harder to used mixed unit compositions effectively and reduces opportunities for players to distinguish themselves with individual unit micro.

True, but that depends if people use formations or not. Also I'm not a fan of individual micro, so my opinion is very biased here.

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

7 hours ago, Yekaterina said:

what do you think about just the more plain background and the less scratched parchment?

Generally not bad,

could be a bit more symmetrical i.e. the bottom left edge could be a bit less crinkled and rounded

and your version looks very handpainted with the smooth color transitions, which is a design choice, but personally I would like a bit of a light paper texture on top.

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

My opinion would be to stick to the old paper look, but a lighter less burnt and destroyed version. A bit cleaner and minimalistic in style, but still a nice old paper texture.

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

9 minutes ago, Yekaterina said:

Where are the loading screen background files? I think I can edit the images

 

art/textures/ui/loading

10 minutes ago, vladislavbelov said:

If someone could repaint the paper background I'd be happy. It doesn't look good currently.

Also the vignette border on a picture is a bit strong I think.

Agreed.

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

Snapping:

Territory decay:

Triremes:

Roman army camp:

Autoqueue:

 

Carthage Sacred Band:

Catapult:

Embassies & Mercenary Camps

Experience trickle:

Fishing:

Forge:

Gathering:

Kush Pyramids:

Outposts:

Palisades:

Quinquereme:

Resource counter:

Map flare:

war elephants

whales

Forge

Formations

Biomes

Iberian Fireship

Tresures

Barracks

Cavalry stables

Elephant stable

[Updating loading screen pictures and tips]

The current loading screen tips are outdated, both the information, as well as with the visuals.

This thread is to make new nice looking pictures and possibly also crowd check the descriptions themselves.

Text: https://code.wildfiregames.com/D4107

Give your comment, give better pictures.

[on "push" mechanic]

I actually don't mind it that much either. Sure, visually they are a bit clumped, but gameplay wise it seems fine to me.

[When loading Gamesetup]

13 minutes ago, wraitii said:

Can you upload you matchsettings.json  in the user config folder?

matchsettings.json

matchsettings.mp.json

[When loading Gamesetup]

yeah, same error.

["Best for MP" map filter]

4 hours ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

Agreed. Forests in general are too small in the game, at least for the temperate biome.

There will be an update for that https://code.wildfiregames.com/D4059

[A25 Feedbacks from testing]

@ValihrAnt About the biomes: would it help to tweak the resource values depending on the biome? So that trees and bushes in biomes that have only few of them have even more wood and the ones in india could have less, compared to the situation now. Could that help to make them more attractive for MP?

[A25 Feedbacks from testing]

32 minutes ago, Stan` said:

I don't see how? Did maps use smaller actors before?

yes they did. stoneSmall and stoneLarge and some were changed.

[A25 Feedbacks from testing]

@Stan` the mines are probably an effect of the terrain update. But it also makes sense that the alpine biome has plenty of stone.