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Good. Just give a name to the first percentage, it's salvageability, but maybe you can think of some other name. You could start with a 50% default for everything, to be fine-tuned later on if wanted (and food maybe could be ignored, because it's weird to salvage it). Incredibly complicated! And why? Why shouldn't walls and towers give a refund? Their stone was among the most salvageable resource. You said it yourself how things should be already, at least for buildings: And that's it! You later used the word "elegantly", then do it so: simple, no steps, no caps, no gaps, no radius, no more parameters, emulating existing processes, or their reverse. There you basically proposed to use unit(s) to unbuild structures, to be rewarded what I quoted from you at the beginning. Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't get why you would need ANY extra rule. What I quoted from you produces a simple rule: salvaging is unbuilding. For units, I can't help but keep saying that you don't need any extra rule! You use the same rule as with buildings: just unproduce them. Why complicate the ship rule with a radius, if you could just click a Salvage button on the ship, and then click a Dock, and all should be automatic from there? The ship would travel to the Dock, garrison, and get salvaged. All the radius thing is not simpler, not needed, not realistic, and not intuitive because the unproduce rule imitates that of buildings. Same with siege engines. Besides, you state you can dismantle (some of) them in one's territory, when one is not able to construct them there in the first place, incurring a logic gap. I agree doing so should be part of the game (with those big engines being extremely slow in return), but that's not yet there. When it is, yes, dismantle them wherever they can be constructed, to keep following the simple unbuilding/unproduce rule, but in the meantime it would be incoherent: the disassembly being realistic, while the assembly isn't. No. Scorched earth tactics should not be ultra-fast, that's exactly the point not to get the unsightly simultaneous collapse of everything (by the AI at least). What should be ultra-fast is deleting some building or unit that is bothering the player (I'm exaggerating with "ultra", it could take a very few seconds). The whole point is: you can use Self-Destruct, but you can't abuse it. The key is what I said: "only gets noticeable the more buildings at a time one wants to destroy". Thus, the best way to deal with all these and other issues at the same time seems to be modifying Self-Destruct the way I explained before (queue buildings, queue units in parallel if considered, and sequentially in each of both queues drain their HP at like 1000/s, etc), and all this has nothing to do with Salvage, there's no resource reward, because it's simpler and faster to execute.
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Also if you could add tool tips. When on dark theme, it is had to tell which buttons you can click and not click (see photos). Could you have some other colors, pwease. Also, do you use github or gitlab or any of those type things? It might be easier for other people to update or something
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I loaded some maps, and it worked. Can you make it so you can load mods for it, like if you are making a map for a mod that adds new structures. Because it was saying a certain civ name was undefined, but it was, just in a mod. Maybe you already added the setting, but I didn't see it
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By Grautvornix · Posted
All right here is my proposal: a refund is limited to a percentage of the resources it took to construct something, say, 50%, multiplied with the current health status of the object, i.e. a ship at 60%health gets 30% refund. all refunds are tied to a condition: ships must be within the perimeter (30m) of your own dock. Outside that area there is no refund. siege engines must be on your own territory, no refund outside. buildings are more complicated: some should not give a refund (walls, towers), others only give a refund if not under attack since 15s and fully owned, and if one own unit is present in their vicinity (radius 20m). Deletion wiht refund becomes a salvaging teardown: the building loses health over, 10 seconds, the resources arrive at the end, any enemy damage during that period cancels it. Deletion of buildings without anyone nearby, or not satisfying the other conditions is immediate and without a refund. All of this remains configurable as I am not yet sure about the best settings (distances, level of refund, criteria, teardown period) I'll adapt the mod and test it first before posting. Done testing. Please see below for the mod. WIll also put it onto mod.io and hope it can be signed @Stan`@ltms recover-resources.zip README.md -
By Grautvornix · Posted
OK, point taken - how could that be addressed? Should we introduce steps and/or a cap, like 0% finalized- 100% refund, up to 70% finalized - 30% refund, more than 70% finalized - no refund anymore. Deletion after completion - 30% refund. Would that work for you? Currently no salvaging of destroyed buildings exists and they can be immediately deleted anyway at the moment. Requiring units (no siege engines) to actively destroy own buildings woud prevent doing that to a whole group of buildings at once already. Would you really want to use valuable units to destroy that one storehouse that's not needed anymore jsut to get back, say, 30 wood? For me this could be an emergency aspect to get more resources if none is in reach and no bartering is possible anymore, e.g. after a devastating attack of your enemy. Of course, but for gameplay and simplicity I would possibly tend towards the same level of resource refund (we could use the same mechanism). But isn't that a contradiction? If it shall be ultra-fast (scorched earth tactics) it cannot be queued as this would take too long.
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