===[COMMITTED]=== Iberian Unit Textures

[TKogumelos]

2 hours ago, Genava55 said:

The breastplate (cardiophylax) is also something from an earlier period right? Not in use anymore during the Punic Wars?

Yes, they stopped being used as a defensive weapon in the middle of the 5th century, become an element of ostentation.

Perhaps it could be understood that Carus uses one to emphasize his leadership position.

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[TKogumelos]

On 04/01/2022 at 11:23 AM, wackyserious said:

Did I get it, or was it the pteruges that you wanted to be player color?

About Caro's helmet I would like to point out that maybe there is an interpretation error with the crest

[wackyserious]

2 hours ago, TKogumelos said:

Yes, they stopped being used as a defensive weapon in the middle of the 5th century, become an element of ostentation.

Perhaps it could be understood that Carus uses one to emphasize his leadership position.

So it can be an ornamental for elite rank units, with only a minimal chance of appearing in unit variations?

We currently use three types of cardiopylax in the game, 1.) circular 2.) square 3.) diamond (seen on the first infantry on the left in the image below. We see evidence for circular ones but the square and diamond ones, could it also be attested for?

[wackyserious]

Also for light armor, are leather vests still okay to be depicted for our units?

I also opt for the following for light armor, supported by the trade and cultural exchanges that was said to have happened.

1.) linothorax

2.) padded clothing (Roman subarmalis? Greek/Egyptian/Eastern padded clothing?)

Also, we have these light armor

Excluding the ones that are depicted as scale armor

[wackyserious]

Figura artesanal de Guerrero Celtíbero escala 1/6. pieza única y exclusiva (losviajerosdeltiempo.com)

[TKogumelos]

4 hours ago, wackyserious said:

So it can be an ornamental for elite rank units, with only a minimal chance of appearing in unit variations?

We currently use three types of cardiopylax in the game, 1.) circular 2.) square 3.) diamond (seen on the first infantry on the left in the image below. We see evidence for circular ones but the square and diamond ones, could it also be attested for?

It doesn't sound like I have read anything about another type of cardiophylax. 

[TKogumelos]

4 hours ago, wackyserious said:

Also for light armor, are leather vests still okay to be depicted for our units?

I also opt for the following for light armor, supported by the trade and cultural exchanges that was said to have happened.

1.) linothorax

2.) padded clothing (Roman subarmalis? Greek/Egyptian/Eastern padded clothing?)

Also, we have these light armor

Excluding the ones that are depicted as scale armor

I think linothorax and subarmalis are Okey. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[TKogumelos]

3 hours ago, wackyserious said:

Figura artesanal de Guerrero Celtíbero escala 1/6. pieza única y exclusiva (losviajerosdeltiempo.com)

@wackyseriousThis figure contains some historical mistakes: too little caetra, the falcata (uncommon in the center of the Peninsula), the metal greaves (after the 5th century they were made of leather). 

Celtiberian warrior of the mid-3rd century BC by José Luis García Morán.

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[TKogumelos]

@wackyseriousThere is only one problem with linothorax and subarmalis, they are represented and mentioned but about the 3rd and 1st centuries BC.
Previously in the south of the peninsula we have representations of a type of padded protection in the shape of an 8 like the one seen in the image:

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[wackyserious]

3 minutes ago, TKogumelos said:

@wackyseriousThere is only one problem with linothorax and subarmalis, they are represented and mentioned but about the 2nd and 1st centuries BC.
Previously in the south of the peninsula we have representations of a type of padded protection in the shape of an 8 like the one seen in the image:

The one above can be easily added since we already have texture asset for it what materials could you suggest? Leather? Pelt? Cloth?

What about this type?

[wackyserious]

So chainmail and linothorax could be reserved for elite rank units then? Since in the game we represent rank progression with equipment progression in a way.

[TKogumelos]

53 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

So chainmail and linothorax could be reserved for elite rank units then? Since in the game we represent rank progression with equipment progression in a way.

The linothorax yes, the chain mail is later and rather associated with spoils of war. 

[TKogumelos]

58 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

The one above can be easily added since we already have texture asset for it what materials could you suggest? Leather? Pelt? Cloth?

What about this type?

Pelt. I didn't have seen something like this before. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[TKogumelos]

Iberian weaponry evolution.600 to 300 centuries B.C. *Left column: low Andalucia, at the center: High Andalucía and south-east peninsula and, on the right: Catalonia.

Defensive:

Comparison chart between the south and east of Spain and the plateau.

Offensive:

Comparison chart between the south and east of Spain and the plateau.

Source: "Weapons, warriors and battles of the Ancient Iberia" Quesada Sanz. 2010

@wackyserious

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[wackyserious]

4 hours ago, TKogumelos said:

Iberian weaponry evolution.600 to 300 centuries B.C. *Left column: low Andalucia, at the center: High Andalucía and south-east peninsula and, on the right: Catalonia.

Defensive:

Comparison chart between the south and east of Spain and the plateau.

Offensive:

Comparison chart between the south and east of Spain and the plateau.

Source: "Weapons, warriors and battles of the Ancient Iberia" Quesada Sanz. 2010

@wackyserious

Very useful, thank you! I saw this on your posts on other forums.

So the large shield boss are from previous centuries, can't we use them for heroes at least?

[TKogumelos]

13 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Very useful, thank you! I saw this on your posts on other forums.

So the large shield boss are from previous centuries, can't we use them for heroes at least?

I suppose that is your design decision, I don't get involved in those things, I only provide information

Edited January 8, 2022 by TKogumelos

[wowgetoffyourcellphone]

7 hours ago, TKogumelos said:

@ 500 A.C. on the left there's the source for that guy's helmet:

[wackyserious]

Do they follow the Celtic manner of wearing scabbards? In the left part of their body?

[Genava55]

43 minutes ago, wackyserious said:

Do they follow the Celtic manner of wearing scabbards? In the left part of their body?

The Celts wore the sword on the right side. Like the Romans.

 

The Iberians and the Celtiberians wore the sword on the left generally, like the Greeks.

 

 

[TKogumelos]

Some depictions of Iberian armors:

Warrior figurines of Collado de los jardines.4th century B.C. (the one at the left wears some type of paddled shirt.) 

One of the Osuna reliefs been made about the 2nd or 1st century B.C. 

Another of the Osuna reliefs. *One of the warriors wears greaves because he is probably Roman. 

Warriors vessel of Libisosa, made around the 2nd or the 1st century B.C. by iberized Celtiberians, the Carpetanians. 

Edited January 10, 2022 by TKogumelos

[wackyserious]

Are those Hellenistic pteruges? and I might be also seeing linothorax shoulder pads, could it be interpreted as that? A Hellenistic linothorax with arm and lower body pteruges?

[TKogumelos]

16 hours ago, wackyserious said:

Are those Hellenistic pteruges? and I might be also seeing linothorax shoulder pads, could it be interpreted as that? A Hellenistic linothorax with arm and lower body pteruges? 

 Yes, that is probably. As far as I know there isn't much information about linothorax apart from the statues and the drawings of the ceramics. 

Edited January 11, 2022 by TKogumelos

[TKogumelos]

I have recently learned that the time span we are working with goes from the 6th century BC to the 1st century AD, a longer period than I had imagined.
So I'm going to contribute some new images.

South-eastern Iberian mercenary chief at the ending of the 5th century BC by José Luis García Morán. 

The duel of Porcuna (a couple of sculptures from the 5th century BC) recreated by Carlos Fernández del Castillo. 

Edited January 13, 2022 by TKogumelos

[wackyserious]

[TKogumelos]

On 19/01/2022 at 12:20 PM, wackyserious said:

Only suggestion:

Actual Iberian representation of greaves

Carro de Merida (6th or 3rd century B.C.). 

Vessel from Numancia in the Celtiberian area. 2nd century B.C. 

Edited January 20, 2022 by TKogumelos