BeTe
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Posts posted by BeTe
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2 hours ago, alre said:
it's not as small as a value when your max pop is lower. for a 200 pop game, one needs some 5-6 barracks, for a 100 pop game, 3 barracks are enough, your eco is smaller and barracks price is relatively bigger. in any case, most important thing is beating down your opponents pop anyway.
Yeah makes sense. Thx for clarification.
One question: if I play "optimally" (balanced production of infantry and workers) will I reach P3 faster or slower on smaller pop limit?
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13 minutes ago, alre said:
if you want less units, that's less pop cap. strenght is relative.
Not sure what you mean? Isn't it absolute? For example if I want to capture garrisoned barracks, I can't efficiently do it with 5-10 (or whatever) units, I need like 20-30-40-50 (doesn't matter actually). It's almost half of my population (all my army) if I set pop limit to 100. Isn't that bad that I need all army to get so small value in return?
Isn't it case I need big blob to do damage (capture or destroy)? Except sieges or eventually some of hero units...
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35 minutes ago, hyperion said:
Because opting for closing in to pop limit will always be required. Sure sometimes you might win (or lose) on the way there and if early boom isn't that fast this will be more likely.
I am still not sure why you mention this in context of this topic... TLDR; I think main part of problem is that you need relative huge blob to make serious damage (except maybe Rams or Hero units). I think I emphasized it in the first post. There are just too many units out there... I don't see reason. Why not have less but more strong units instead?
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I am not sure why people mention pop. limit? It'd make game even worse - you need more time to get to P3 (weapon upgrades, Rams, etc.) so I can make any damage. That prolong fight even more than horrible ~15-20 minutes that we have now.
I'd like to be able to capture something with 5 units, not that I must have huge blob of unknown units that I can't distinguish or micro. I am talking from lower-mid level players perspective, like 1000-1600, which is majority as I could see.
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We already discussed a bit of this here: https://wildfiregames.com/forum/topic/86939-why-units-are-produced-so-fast/
Intro
So we have situation that most of fights start around 15-20 mins (at least with ~1400 players that I play with). In that time we have huuuuuge chaotic blob of units, like 150+ units.
I think it cause few problems:
1. For me as new player it's very hard (and frustrating?) to estimate how big opponent's force is and to send appropriate amount and type of units to defend (or attack). I think overcommitment is not good in RTS.... I guess I will improve skills in this but why not to motivate people to continue play by making game appealing.
2. Hard to distinguish units to find proper counter. Or if I have huuuuge blob in a battle and I want to kill separated opponent's Sieges, it's hard to find 3-4 swordsmans to kill them (I don't want to separate all of the swords).
3. Harded microing, relying more on luck.
4. Performance/lag.
Goal
In this topic:
A. first of all I want to understand if 0 A.D. is intentionally developed like that? I mean, I do understand people don't want to make yet another AOE clone, but most of modern and good RTSes are different regarding this (AOE, SC, WC, C&C Generals, etc.).
B. I want to ask community if all of us agree on this?
C. Discuss solutions:
Like I have on my mind to simply increase price and time for each unit but increase proportionally damage, capture and resource collection. And anything else? Like simply double all of that.
I might take some time to develop a mod or we can try to incorporate it in Community-Mod (although it might be to big change for such balancing project).
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Looking forward to all opinions from everybody. And thanks for replies for (A.) in advance.
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1 hour ago, real_tabasco_sauce said:
ok some additional merge requests:
https://gitlab.com/0ad/0ad-community-mod-a26/-/merge_requests
1. ptol houses -40% capture points, +50% build time (could be too much of a nerf, might make it 33% build time later)
2. axe cav buff: unit deals more damage
3. territory expansion and CC/colony cost:
- town and city phase territory increase is 25%, from 30% and 50% respectively
- CC cost: 300 wood, 350 stone, 100 metal
- colony cost: 150 wood, 200 stone, 100 metal.
- This change is designed to increase the importance of expansion and resource management. my thoughts are also that it will make maps "feel" larger, basically more options for strategy.
- compare to @ValihrAnt's mod:https://wildfiregames.com/forum/topic/68499-territory-mod/#comment-474946
Is expansion actually required if we have plenty of resources around CC? You still can use Barracks to reach that 25%, right?
Maybe also reducing resources ( metal? )would help?
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7 hours ago, thephilosopher said:
Rams can handle nearly unlimited amounts of attacks from skirmishers and other ranged units like archers while taking basically no damage. They can also take out other rams, but it's best to use sword cav or swordsmen to do that. Trying to use skirmishers against rams is a common mistake people make when they're starting out. If you've got an opponent who does that, then send the rams forward.
Wow that's important aspect of army micro that I wasn't aware of. I knew about swords and I used them in above game, but I kept rams to save them from his army. I should not do it since he didn't have swords if I remember well.
Bug how would I distinguish units in such a huge blob and see if there are swords in front? I can't even estimate how big army is...
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44 minutes ago, Gurken Khan said:
I think the big battle was where you dropped the ball:
- you had troops just standing around, including Skiritai; instead of feeding them piecemeal to the enemy archers they could have cut through them
- what you did with your rams was not only a waste of resources but they were hindering you; standing in the way when you were still gathering, not getting to the front (maybe countering the enemy rams) but blocking your path; then instead of holding them back you should've sent them forward, being at least a concern or actually taking down enemy buildings
- make up your mind about stances and formations; I'd wager aggressive and no formations would have served you better
If you review the battle I think you might agree.
Minor points:
- don't have women around the front action
- maybe get farming upgrades and start gathering minerals earlier
- if you use towers also get their upgrades
- have multiple production buildings on a hotkey so you can easily reinforce
Everything IMHO and not trying to be harsh but concise. HTH
Thx a lot man.
Ohhh, so Rams can be used to soak damage from skirmishers and spearmans and to kill his rams, right? Hm, I haven't think about that usage of them...
I guess I underestimated opponent size and that I guess Skiritais are OP against his army. It's very hard to estimate for me as there are too many units on the screen...
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52 minutes ago, chrstgtr said:
See above. Some people think p1 is already too strong. Some people think p3 is already too strong. p2 is the age that needs to get stronger—which I tend to agree with
I think everybody agree that P2 need buff...
But, to explain:
I am thinking about being able to capture or kill something in early game (P1) with infantry - now only cavalry can eventually work. All other strategies are risky and will put you behind in eco if you fail which is high likely with an equal opponent.
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On 11/10/2022 at 7:13 PM, chrstgtr said:
Town phase is p2. This will move one forge tech from p3 to p2. p1 will have 0 techs, p2 will have 2 new techs, and p3 will have 1 new tech.
Making p2 stronger makes p1 weaker.
What about making both P1 and P2 stronger ?
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I feel that I am stuck with advancing in 0AD, especially mid/late game. If someone has time to
- point out my biggest mistakes
- help me to understand why I lost that mid engagements (I had Skiritais and more Forge upgrades)
Thanks in advance.
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Finally some tournament!
I am new player but I want to help.
- In game name: BeTe
- Interested for the following schedules: Weekly
- BO1 or BO3?: BO1
- Seeded or random brackets?: Seeded-
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Not sure about Fedora but I used Snap on Ubuntu. I guess you can do same.
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On 25/09/2022 at 1:00 PM, Stan` said:
Awesome huge list! Respect guys!
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18 hours ago, Stan` said:
Edge. Not beta or normal.
Now it's in stable.
But I am confused, it got automatically updated to A26 for me. I have done anything... How's that possible?
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I am currently using Snap and I want to stay. For some reason I still have 25 for stable:
> latest/stable: 0.0.25b-alpha 2022-09-21 (485) 1GB -
I will check why...
Thx.
P.S.
i have older ubuntu 18.04 LTS
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How to install on Ubuntu Linux? AppImage only?
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8 hours ago, Lion.Kanzen said:
That's different, look how nice it looks for OpenRA:
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Can someone create 0AD channel (?) on Youtube so I can tag 0 A.D. as category for my upload?
This is example of another game: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-1if4nAJ2mo35NgNMjbXJA
and it's visible below video like here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EoY6HHzmvE
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1 hour ago, guerringuerrin said:
@BeTe
I would like to recommend you these two mods also. I give u the links.
At least to me, these two mods are must-have for get the best game experience.
Autociv: it adds many useful hotkeys like buildings ones. It saves you a lot of time. It has hosting tools. Auto civ change for players, kick and bans. U can /team 1v1 /team 4v4 and it sets u up the config.https://github.com/nanihadesuka/autociv
BoonGUI: it shows u stats info in a more detailed way than vanila. How many women, inf and cav u have. Res per minute. also u can see allies stats when u got cartography and have a better overview of the hole team. This is specially useful for res sharing. Also, when spectating, u can see detailed info of tech research, units production, and so on.
Thx, I noticed these in some stream...
I have resistance to install it - as I feel it also makes game kind of unbalanced...
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1 hour ago, Feldfeld said:
In the mod I only fixed food (which is the most critical resource for competitive play in A25)
I have the intention to improve the map by fixing all 4 resources, generalize it so all fitting existing maps can be balanced in the same way, and bring it to vanilla 0AD. I also gathered the support of the 0AD devs interested on the matter. I started a patch in order to merge it to vanilla 0AD. Unfortunately up to now I haven't got the motivation to actually finish it. Now please note that since the upcoming A26 was in feature freeze for quite a long time, there was no chance of the patch getting in that version. I imagine that the next release after that, A27, will be out at least quite a few months later, so hopefully I will regain my motivation by then.
Thanks for the efforts made up until now!
Btw, I had more issues with terrain/space for expansion and later metal/stone when opponent had like 15-20k metal&stone reachable within build range in P2. I had like 1k-2k.
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7 minutes ago, vladislavbelov said:
It might be, but no promises. Because we have limited time and few active people to fix everything.
But that guy who developed mod, couldn't he do it directly in basic 0AD?
However, it is annoying, but I guess it's not the highest priority. It's just important to have it in "backlog".
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39 minutes ago, guerringuerrin said:
U can download feldmap mod from this thread and play Mainland Balanced map
Thanks to you and Gurken. I was looking for Mainland Balanced before, but I thought it's map, not mod and couldn't find guide. I will try this definitely.
Does it fix stone and metal mines? I see only Food and Wood are mentioned.
But still, problem is that I can't play with people who doesn't have that mod... Should we report this to someone to include in next releases?
Should we go towards less units on screen (but keep similar gameplay)?
in Gameplay Discussion
Posted
Yeah, I tried few games on 150-200 and timing is quite similar.
And blobs are smaller and game feels much better. For now at least. I think it will be even better if discussed changes about buffing P2 from community-mods topic (https://wildfiregames.com/forum/topic/83784-introducing-the-official-community-mod-for-alpha-26/) are implemented.