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I've updated to revision 13766 and did some cleanups to reduce the patch-size from 23791 lines to 21858 lines. My plan is to split the patch up into several independent patches that can be tested and committed separately. Working with such a huge patch has become a real pain and I spend way too much time merging changes. So the main changes in this patch are: Updated to rev 13766 Integrated stwf's changes. I had nearly all of his changes related to the soundmanager and the scripting interface in my patch (since I needed them and they hadn't been committed yet). He has committed them in the meantime, so I could remove them from the patch. Moved the changes from the qbot-wc folder to the aegis folder because it was renamed Removed modifications of tabs and spaces that were added because I forgot to disable a very annoying feature of codeblocks. Merged the serialization changes by historicbruno. I haven't tested it yet, so it could be partially broken in the patch. EDIT: I've tested the random map generation again to check if I can use h4writer's workaround which requires much less code changes. I noticed that there's no workaround required at all with the current version (v26). Apparently they fixed the problems with arguments objects. ./pyrogenesis -autostart=alpine_lakes -autostart-random=123 -autostart-size=256 v26 Workaround randInt1, randInt2, randFloat1, randFloat2: Load RMS: 7.03415 s Load RMS: 7.10919 s Load RMS: 7.07667 s v1.8.5 unmodified: TIMER| Load RMS: 19.958 s TIMER| Load RMS: 19.9252 s TIMER| Load RMS: 20.0246 s V26 unmodified TIMER| Load RMS: 7.07735 s TIMER| Load RMS: 7.04358 s TIMER| Load RMS: 7.08466 s What a nice improvement. What a pity that this is the only spot where v26 currently performs better than v1.8.5. I've even compared the minimap on a printscreen. It really generates the same map. I replaced the attached patch with a new one without the random map workaround and with some other cleanups (now 21408 lines). Yes, that was a helpful "rediscovery". This profiling tool has been available since a long time but everyone seems to have forgotten it somehow. patch_26_v0.6.diff

I like the idea of a natural sanctuary for the Celts, at least for one the Celts tribes (Gauls ?). The trees were divine symbols to them, and a giant oak would have been a kind of Wonder to them. Of course, you don't build an oak, and anyway, an oak takes ages to reach a massive size. But why not trying to design a unique kind of Wonder : instead of building a structure, the builders could shape a ditch around a mound, and at its top, they would sow seeds of (or plant young) oaks and we would have one or several oaks (an oak circle ?) growing (accelerated, of course) and becoming pretty massive (as a big building) and the Wonder's finishes would be a myriad of relic-kind of stuffs and colorful ribbons hanging in the branches, that the builders would put on the trees, like what we can see sometimes on sacred trees throughout the world (we see that in the Pagan culture). It could be completed also with a few statues or small standing stones. I acknowledge the game's economic and constructive logic doesn't allow the planting of trees with the ressources aimed for a Wonder (stone, wood, gold, etc), but such "natural" wonder would be the closest representation we could get to what the Celts really worshipped, and it will surely give a unique sense of wonder in a Celt settlement. Also, if we consider that the biggest structures in the game are sometimes the kind that actually took years to build (temples, hanging gardens, etc), then the growing time of a tree seems almost acceptable. Even more if we imagine a little bit of Celt magic that could have make trees grow faster... The destruction of such wonder would be as possible as for the other wonders : trees burning and falling + collapse of the mound, back to original ground shape. I admit this idea is pretty difficult to put into the game, but well, I share it anyway. Here's an interesting page on a similar kind of ancient sacred site, mixing tree with land shaping. And here's the kind of oak I think of :

In real life, we make a distinction between meet and vegetable food. Vegetable are cheapest than meet. Meet is often needed as protein sources. Breeding animals convert a lot of vegetable in a little of meet. Some civilisations like Indians can live without meet (they adapt by eating some vegetables that contain a lot of proteins like lentils). So maybe we can also make a difference between the two resources in the game. It could be having -10% attack if vegetarian ration below 90% (and civ bonus for Maurian Indians that would not have to care of it). It could be making them really 2 different resources and buying cost (like female cost 45 veg 5 meet, warrior 50 veg 10 meet 10 wood 30 gold) and possibility to convert veg into meet in corrals. So instead of using only the most efficient way to have food, we would have to manage at least two ways. Instead of bush => farm, we could have bush => farms & hunt => herding (+ fish).

I think "Quit to Desktop" sounds better. Also, a button to "Restart Match" would be nice.

You should be able to just use Alt+F4 if you want to quit the application immediately, so no need for a menu item.

Season would need a new texture, a sort of "decal" that would be overlayed on the existing texture. It might be building-specific but could probably reuse the base texture UV. It could simulate snow covering, vegetation growing and decaying, dust in deserty maps, things like that. Having a day/night cycle means adding dynamic lighting to the game, which is a lot more work. Both would have to introduce big gameplay changes (night would emphasis LOS and stuffs like that, which is not too suited for an RTS in my opinion, at least 0 A.D. would require a ton of changes.) Seasons would slow units down in winter, stuffs like that, which is already less important.

Instead of a day/night cycle, I think it would be better with seasons. This is also a planned feature, see: http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Background%3A_Seasons. There are several advantages to have seasons instead of a night and day cycle, most of them are connected with the visual aspects. Nights for example could be to dark, and it makes more sense if a game in which you build cities and fight great wars spans over two or three years instead of ten days. I do however agree with you that the seasons (or day/night cycle) should affect the gameplay. But all I can think of, is that during the winter stamina (when implemented) should be drained quicker. Also take a look at http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Background%3A_Weather. Maybe the weather would change once each season and affect the gameplay (in contrary to the design document). More gameplay effects could be added this way, for example, fog and snow would reduce the LOS (line of sight). Resource gathering speed could also be affected some way. But if you're not interested in seasons and would only like to do a day/night cycle, I believe that would be a great feature that would probably be added to the game as an additional option.

Evolve is a good and shold be use more than any of one the suggested app but if one of the ones suggested has to be used then GameRanger would be then one to use if they would add supprot for the game

wraitii, I really like your ideas. I agree about not having regenerating berry bushes and also making fishing much faster. I think fish were a major food source in the ancient world, so it makes sense for a more reasonable gather rate. We could make elephants (ivory) and maybe whales into a source of gold. I think having larger farms is worth experimenting with - could have a nice affect on gameplay. Corrals are straightforward, I think.