[Millenium A.D. Part1] Saxon Architectual Reference Pack

[Le Druide Gaulois]

Looks marvelous

Thanks!

[Andrettin]

I've found an open-air museum which has a nicely reconstructed Saxon settlement:

http://openarchaeology.info/venues/freilichtmuseum-sachsenhof-greven-de

http://www.heimatverein-greven.de/

The settlement is a Saxon village belonging to the 600-800 AD period.

The village's main dwelling:

The pit house:

The barn (front, side and back):

The source for these pictures are the two links I gave in the beginning of the post.

Edited December 3, 2015 by Andrettin

[Le Druide Gaulois]

Thanks for the reference, Andrettin. It's nice to see how the same people can have different architecture styles depending on where they are settled. While West Stow in England is all made of wood boards this German village is more about timber frame. Reminds me of some Danish Norse buildings.

[Andrettin]

Thanks for the reference, Andrettin. It's nice to see how the same people can have different architecture styles depending on where they are settled. While West Stow in England is all made of wood boards this German village is more about timber frame. Reminds me of some Danish Norse buildings.

That brings up a good question. I don't think we can consider the Anglo-Saxons and the Saxons to be the same people, since the former were strongly culturally intermixed with Angles and (to a lesser extent) Jutes and British Celts. In fact, given their language, it seems probable that the Angle cultural heritage was predominant rather than the Saxon one.

[Stan`]

Strange IIRC saxons did not mix with locals. They would just butcher them and take the land

[niektb]

Isn't that strange actually since both Angles and the Saxons originate from the Northern part of Germany?

[Andrettin]

Strange IIRC saxons did not mix with locals. They would just butcher them and take the land

The Angles were not local, they (together with the Jutes) went to Britain from Germania.

In any case, the Anglo-Saxons did mix heavily with the locals; in fact the English are mostly descended from the island's native inhabitants (they do have significant Germanic ancestry but it is minoritary). What happened was above all conquest followed by assimilation; the quantity of settlers was not massive enough to replace the indigenous population. Many of the Modern White British people have only 30%

From this BBC article:

According to the data, those of Celtic ancestry in Scotland and Cornwall are more similar to the English than they are to other Celtic groups.

[...]

And it shows that the invading Anglo Saxons did not wipe out the Britons of 1,500 years ago, but mixed with them.

[...]

Towns were abandoned; the language over much of what became England changed (to Anglo Saxon, which became English); pottery styles altered; so too even the cereals that were grown, following the arrival of people from the base of the southwest Danish peninsula and northwestern Germany (the Anglo Saxons).

Some historians and archaeologists had wondered whether these changes occurred as a result of the Saxons entirely replacing the existing population as they moved westwards. That might have happened if the Saxons introduced disease, for example.

Others researchers suggested that the existing population simply dropped their old ways and adopted the Saxon way of life.

The new analysis shows a modest level of Saxon DNA, suggesting that the native British populations lived alongside each other and intermingled with the Anglo Saxons to become the English.

[niektb]

But in that we case we maybe should rename the civ to Anglo-Saxons to reflect the faction. (at least I figure most of us had that branch in mind when working on the civ)

Edited December 4, 2015 by niektb

[Andrettin]

But in that we case we maybe should rename the civ to Anglo-Saxons to reflect the faction. (at least I figure most of us had that branch in mind when working on the civ)

Ah, I didn't know. Yes, in that case I think renaming the civ to "Anglo-Saxons" would be optimal to better reflect what the faction is about.

[Stan`]

But in that we case we maybe should rename the civ to Anglo-Saxons to reflect the faction. (at least I figure most of us had that branch in mind when working on the civ)

Well I didn't but heh

[niektb]

Well, I actually thought they were more or less equal to each other but when I needed info I always looked in the Anglo-Saxon history

That's where the civ emblem comes from too.

[wackyserious]

Regarding the Briton presence (IIRC, there are two contradicting statements from two chroniclers during that period, one states that little (or no violence, at all) occurred, and that the Britons in the region where they settled where peacefully assimilated, while the other states that the Anglo-Saxons carved their way though series' of military conquests.

We could try splitting or make a new civ for the Anglo-Saxons in the later stages of development, because I believe that this faction was meant to represent the Saxons during Charlemagne's Saxon Wars, right? A separate Anglo-Saxon faction would fit much more once the Normans are introduced.

I kinda agree that that Anglo-Saxon Britain was a little different in some aspects.

(Well, not that different, since Germanic culture brought from the Northern parts of Europe prevailed, but it can be a little biased if we only mention or refer to the Saxons and exclude the other groups that also migrated to Britain)

The Anglo-Saxon dominion over Britain was often called the Heptarchy

The one who manages to dominate the other groups during their time, are often referred to as Brytenwalda or Bretwalda

Mercia (Angles) dominated the scene for quite some time during the early phases, while near the later periods, the kingdom weakened and the power shifted to Wessex (Saxons)

[Le Druide Gaulois]

Talk about syncronicity! Exactly today I was thinking weather or not we should rename the factionto Anglo-Saxons.

[niektb]

Actually me personally was merely thinking about the Saxons during the Viking Age like this mod: http://www.twcenter.net/wiki/Viking_Invasion_II

But maybe we could somehow introduce a sub faction by offering a 2nd Phase III that changes some civ bonuses / unlocks different champion units / something? Or wouldn't that be a good compromise?

[Stan`]

Well that could be nice

[Le Druide Gaulois]

Yes, I also thought that later on when we have the game well developed we could split the Norse into some subfactions (like the Celts and the Greeks are divided in 0 AD), namely Danish and Norwegian (since Icelanders descend from Norwegian settlers they would be included in the same faction), and maybe Sweden (considering those have many traits in common with the future Rus state).

[Andrettin]

Yes, I also thought that later on when we have the game well developed we could split the Norse into some subfactions (like the Celts and the Greeks are divided in 0 AD), namely Danish and Norwegian (since Icelanders descend from Norwegian settlers they would be included in the same faction), and maybe Sweden (considering those have many traits in common with the future Rus state).

I agree. So the current Saxon faction's buildings and units could be based on Anglo-Saxons, and once there are more units/buildings based on continental Saxons (if there is interest in making graphics for them), they could be split off.

[wackyserious]

Image from the BBC website. Probably a Roman occupation period fort or walled town, occupied by Anglo-Saxons.

More images and information about Anglo-Saxons @BBC website http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/primaryhistory/anglo_saxons/anglo-saxon_life/

[wackyserious]

[wackyserious]

Quote

The Saxons built a place of worship on the site of the present day church of St. Peters. This first church would have been made of wood. A Saxon Church, as it might have looked

Text and image source http://resources.woodlands-junior.kent.sch.uk/townhistory/saxontonbridge.html

[wackyserious]

Source: www.canterburytrust.co.uk

[Stan`]

Is that a stone fortress in the middle ?

Maybe we should add the ability to make fences to this civ. 

I also see a potential trade cart, and some eyecandy that could be made for scenarios.

[wackyserious]

I believe those are Roman period ruins, it would be nice to have those as eyecandy

Individual pieces like these, so that you can create a ruins from scratch

Arches/Doorway ruins would also be nice

Edited April 25, 2016 by wackyserious

[Stan`]

Small Thing I made today

[niektb]

What is it? A corral?