SMST
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Posts posted by SMST
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The Romans didn't. In fact, they never ever expanded their empire east beyond the Sargos and the Caucasus mountains. So they barely had any political or military contact with India. Thought, they would fit into the game. (there are, as I understand it, Indian environments and Indian textures)
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Your textbook may be right. Nontheless, a naval tradition seems to have existed in the Levante before, regardless if the people are called Phoenicians or Canaanites. (though I would call the in-game faction Phoenicians, I think we can stretch so far?) Remember that New Kingdom Egypt employed Levantinian mercenaries to build and crew their galleys. I would certainly reduce naval combat in the mod compared to 0 A.D., but would the Phoenicians have the strongest navy. (followed by the Mycaeneans. Hittites may be worst at navy of all.)
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Phoenicians are an early iron age civilization, coming in around 1100 B.C. or something. So if the lack of a highly naval civ is a big drawback, maybe focusing on or including that time period would be a better idea.
Does anyone know much about Ugarit? Maybe they had significant naval capabilities.
I looked it up, and in my history atlas, the Phoenicians show up around 1500 B.C., so they were contemporary with the Egyptian New Kingdom. They did not colonize, however, until ~900 B.C. So in the mod, they would be "Native" Phoenicians, which would be quite different from the Carthagenians I believe. (no mercenaries, for example)
I also think the Mycenaean Greeks are usable. They would be strong heavy infantry (the first bronze breastplates date around the end of the Mycaenean period) and elite chariot units. (nobles) Maybe some light infantry as backup.
The trouble with the Nubians would be that there is probably not enough info. They would be also quite similar to Egypt, I guess, so you have gameplay issues here.
About the rest of the cultures listed under not usable/practical I barely know the name so I am no help there ...
I still think, Assyrians and Babylonians should be branches of one "Mesopotamian" faction, because they were quite similar. (though they were arch enemies, of course) I would go for Chaldaean Babylonians rather than Kassites, because that was the time Babylon was at its peak. (Nebuchadnezzar and all)
Edit:
Oh, and my history atlas states that the Nubians who conquered Egypt around 750 B.C. were indeed the Kushites.
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Looks ... well ... out of place.
But I like the model. -
Nice ones!
@Aldandil: It has worked for me in Empire Earth and AoK. I think it will work in 0AD, too.
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Hm, somehow FOW screws up sky textures. At least with me.
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How can I dare ever release anythin of my own device if there are such pictures to look at?
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That's why I said it doesn't belong here.
The top part of my post is relevant of the topic. The other part is just a explanation of my little sidethought some posts earlier.
I wounderfully know the purpose of this topic. And my questions regarding the Scythians was if they would fit into the timeframe. Apparently not, so drop that subject.
So ... no Persians, no Skythians. Somewhere earlier in this topic was the mention of a Nubian/Kushite/(whatever the correct name is for this specific timeframe, please don't burn me alive ... ) faction, which would also be pretty neat.
Undisputed, I think, are the following factions:
New Kingdom Egypt
Mesopotamia (what do you think about the Assyrian/Babylonian subfaction idea?)
Hittites
Mycaeneans
On dispute:
Phoenicians (I still think they belong there)
Nubians or whatever you like them to be called
Some obscure Steppe faction (?)
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Okay, cut out Persians. But I think that Phoenicians would be rather different than Carthagenians. And just for gameplay reasons, almost none of the other civs (except maybe the Mycenaeans) have naval capabilities, so there must be some decent naval civilisation - if you don't want to skip naval combat entirely, that is.
Couldn't steppe factions go along with Skythians or is this too far of a stretch? I don't think that the funny names you brought up mean anything to people, no offense intended.
If you were using bronze-age Italians, they wouldn't be 5th century Etruscans. They'd be bronze age Terramarans, or some other actual bronze age culture. Recognizably, verifiably Etruscan people don't show up in the archaeological or historical records until the iron age."Bronze Age" is just some generic age description I came up with. The age names in PG:E are not referent to the culture they depict. (that is why I try to find non-generic names) Ages are meant to portray development states of that culture. For example, "Iron Age" Italians would be Republican Romans as they appear in 0 A.D.
Doesn't really belong here, though.
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Nice pictures. I am struggling if I should include the Etruscians as Bronze age Italians in PG:E.
As for me, the choice of civilisations for a Bronze age mod would be:
1. Egypt (New Kingdom)
2. Mesopotamians (Assyrian and Babylonian subfactions)
3. Phoenicians
4. Hittites
5. Mycenean Greeks
6. Persians (I know, a bit out of timeframe, but it would allow to re-create the conquest of the Middle east by Cyrus. If not, then go for Medians instead)
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Nice suggestions. Shouldn't the Ptolemaioi have elephants, too, or is that Polirieme really so special that it must be included? Sadly, I do not know much about the military of the Hellenistic states, other than that they were a good mixture of native and Hellenic military tradition.
If needed, I would help with dirty actor and entinity scripting, provided someone makes textures and models first.
Oh yeah: Shouldn't that be a opportunity to revamp the Celtic faction as well? A seperate Gaulish and British faction would be good and more accurate I think. See my PG:E thread, where I did some humble experiments with Celtic units to distinguish the two civs a bit more.
Some random thoughts about the revamped Greek faction (may be similar to yours)
Subfactions Athénai, Sparté and Thébai.
Athénai SU:
Super Infantry: Thurephoros (after Iphikrates' reforms)
Super Ranged: Ekdromos
Athénai Heroes:
1. Miltiades
2. Themistokles
3. Pericles
Sparté SU:
Super Infantry: Homoios Lakédaimonion ("equals under the Lakedaemonians/Spartans")
Super Ranged: Helotes Messenikos ("Messenian serf")
Sparté Heroes:
1. Leonidas
2. Pausanias
3. Brasidas
Thébai SU:
Super Infantry: Hieron Lochos ("Sacred Band")
Super Ranged: Peltastes Thrakios ("Thracian skirmisher", Thebans employed them first and foremost, I would go for "Akontistes" for the regular Greek skirmisher unit)
Thébai Heroes:
1. Pelopidas
2. Epaimendonas
3. ?
EDIT:
Oh, and about the Hellenic league bonus: I don't like the notion of giving any civ any particular advantage/disadvantage against another specific civ. In my opinion, this damages gameplay, for if a player chooses Macedonia, the other player will almost certainly choose Rome. I would prefer it that way that any civ can beat any other civ on equal terms. (given enough strategic thinking and a good play on the civ's strenghts, of course)
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"next alpha version, from formations to a Savannah biome."
Golden Words.
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Don't get me wrong.
I said it before, I am very delighted that you include such a great variety of biomes. -
Photoshop, GIMP, Paint.NET, Corel Photo Paint and many others.
Programs in Italics are freeware.
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Include this one. Please.
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Forgive me if I am wrong, but from various stuff I read throughout my phase of interest for ancient civilisations, I've always thought that Northern Africa was much more like the European Mediterranean in respect of climate and specifically much more wooded, before the desertification you mentioned took place and shifted it into the desert/semi-desert of our days.
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Northern Africa is not much of a savannah, especially not in the ancient Period.
But the setting allows for awesome Zulu or Ethiopian mod factions.
So I am very happy to have this.Btw is there any possibility to get some additional biomes (or factions, for that matter) in future alpha releases?
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Hello to you all! I have taken up the work on PG:E again and are now back.
I am right now working on the detailled research of each faction, starting with the French and the British factions. (I work on this pair at one time, as they were closely related to each other and I want them to be in some ways each other's antagonists. I am doing that with several other nations as well) Specifically their representation in the Ancient Era is what I am working on right now.
0ad has British and Gallic Celts both into one faction. This is fine, but here, I need to differentiate these two cultures as they belong to different factions.
Since the French faction will be more of a defensive faction throughout the game, they get the heavier armoured units and better defensive structures. Only there will you find the 0ad Celts clad in mail. Generally speaking, they are the more "civilized" Celts. (as the Gauls probably were, historically)
The British, on the contrary, have better offensive capabilities and rely more on light to not armoured infantry and light ambush cavalry. Their attribute will be the famous war paintings on body and face, which no French unit will have. They also get a slight speed bonus for their infantry.
I've done some artistic work to visualize you my ideas. These units are by no means final, but they will give you a general idea of my plans for Ancient French and Britons. They are using 0ad textures of the alpha release, though I'd prefer them to have custom textures in the finished mod.
That depends on how complicated you want to make it. The more techs that have to be researched for something to happen, the more your mod leads towards a simulation game (i.e. sim city) and away from an rts game. Some prefer quick and dirty RTS's -- not much of an econ, with it easy to rush - for example, red alert, red alert 2. Others prefer more of a simulation. For example, Empire Earth and Civilization. The more technical something is the more it annoys certain people, while others are happier.
Well, for that matter, this mod will be more like a simulation. In fact, technology is a key feature to the game. First, it is the prerequisite to age up, as mentioned before. (four innovations + four random technologies = age up button gets active at civ centre) Second, said innovations are vital to unlock several game features. For example, there is a innovation called Agriculture that unlocks farms in age 2 or another called Mechanized Warfare, which gives you WWI units and first tanks in the Imperial age. Third, technologic status strongly influences the opinion that AI players have of you, so a highly developed empire will have better chances to get an alliance than a primitive barbarian tribe.
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But I am not sure any of them have been recorded. And I'm not sure where this list is on the Trac wiki.
There is some Greek voice stuff in the Alpha release, I believe.
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It would surprise me if I could find any Carthagenians or Persians there.
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Well, please note that those people who do harm in the name of their religion either just pretend to have religious reasons (Crusades) or simply misunderstood their religion. (creationists, islamists)
Other than that, I agree with you in that religion should have less impact on society as a whole and rather be someone's personal opinion.
There are just these small nuances in "have it your own way" or "your own way is weird, but have it your own way" (still appropriate) or "your own way is bad, you must have it my way" that upset me.
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I'd wait for him to start killing or threatening to kill before saying he's that extreme.
Well, I dislike people who think their opinion is firm and irredicable and the only way to answer any thing under any circumstances. And there are such people on both sides.
It's also easy to say 'be tolerant' when you're a majority looking down at a minority. Edit: Especially when 'being tolerant' to some religious people means don't ever dare question anything, even if it doesn't make any sense.
I don't have figures, but I think, at least in Western Europe, where I accidentaly live, one can speak no longer of a "religous mayority". In fact, the numbers of agnostics, atheists or areligious people are increasing.
And religion does not have to be logic. The point of religion is not, in my opinion, to give you any scienticific or philiosphical model how the world should work, but it provides you with a model that is not as changable, which gives understandably more security to some people. Religion also strongly depends on its community and the sharing of common rites and lifestyles.
I'll just keep my mouth shut on this one. smile.gifSorry if I was too harsh. However, it read to me like some of the fundamental atheists I've met in my life. Not fun, believe me.
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Agnostic and IN-tollerant of religion- i hate the idea and all religion is just--seems totally illogical and stupid.
You are just as bad as the religious fundamentalists out there.
I am ... I don't know what I am at this moment. I was raised Roman-Catholic, but I have changed my beliefs from Deist to Agnostic to Atheist to Agnostic back again, and I am now something like a Pantheist. I do not believe in a personal god that relieves you from sin or punishes you with eternal torment in hell, but I do believe in some power, that holds this universe together, keeps it running. This now may be called by each individual as he or she wants it to be called - God, the natural powers, the Great Green Arkleseizure, whatever. For myself, I have no real name for it.
"Name it then as you will, Name it Happiness! Heart! Love! God! I have no name for that! Feeling is all in all; Name is but sound and smoke."
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Hold on a minute. Are those new mediterranean terrain textures?
Ancient Mod for 0 AD
in Game Modification
Posted
Egyptian powerful navy = Phoenician mercenaries, as I posted before.
I have a depiction of a Phoenician galley in my atlas, unfortuanetly, I have no scanner.
If we can find Egyptian ships that are not made of straw, it is a safe bet though, that they are Phoenician, at least in origin and sinliar in design.