oshron

ill consider those other ones. any comments on the other factions?

because id rather have a spanish-speaking mexican general than simply make up one. plus, santa anna was a pretty important general. plus, it gives the confederates someone else to fight(one of the confederate wonders is the alamo mission). he's also from a time when mexico was pretty much indepent, back when it was the Empire of Mexico as for the gold, its more because of the spanish belief that they had lots of gold. it may not be historical, but it works as a non-military advantage for them and complements their cultural power perhaps. and the reason i didnt include montezuma (the second, i presume you are meaning) is because he wasnt as big of a commander as cuahtemoc was; cuahtemoc was actually capable of beating the spanish and repelling them, so he's in there as a hero instead of montezuma

in addition to my mythology idea, i also have ideas for another post-0 AD game that would, instead of being based on mythology, take a more realistic and historical approach while still emphasizing fictionalization and even alternative history. this one im currently calling "Atlas" and would span from the renaissance period to the not-too-distant future. here's a list of all the factions i currently have down: -- Aztecs (semi-historical but mostly emphasizing alternative history where the Aztecs are never destroyed) -- Balkans (encompassing the whole of the Balkan Peninsula and possibly the former Byzantine Empire, but giving particular attention to Greece and Bulgaria) -- Benelux (a collective Dutch faction) -- China (giving attention to the Ming and Qing dynasties as well as the current Republic and People's Republic) -- Confederates (an alternative history faction, focusing on the Confederate States of America) -- Deutschland (the imperial and capitalist German faction) -- Fennoscandia (a collective Nordic and Baltic faction, but giving particular attention to Sweden) -- France (this speaks for itself, but this France would focus mostly on Napoleonic France) -- Germania (an alternative history faction, focusing on Nazi Germany) -- Great Britain (focusing not only on Great Britain but also on the whole of the United Kingdom and teh former British Empire, meaning that Canada, Australia, and New Zealand are also encompassed in this faction) -- Habsburgs (an Austro-Hungarian faction, but as a whole, it encompasses all of eastern Europe except for Russia and Turkey) -- India (focusing not only on India but also on the whole of the Indian Subcontinent, meaning that Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka are also covered here) -- Israel (though the name focuses on the State of Israel, this refers more to the Jewish community as a whole) -- Italy (focusing primarily on the former Kingdom of Italy and the Roman Catholic Church) -- Japan (focusing on the whole of the former Japanese Empire) -- Ottomans (officially just a Turkish faction, but since its the Ottomans, it also covers whatever territory they held, so Egypt is covered here as well) -- Russia (imperial and post-soviet Russia) -- Saracens (a collective Muslim/Arab faction focusing on primarily on Muslims in the Middle East proper and in North Africa) -- Soviets (the Soviet Russian faction, alternative history) -- Visigoths (a collective Iberian faction, encompassing both Spain and Portugal as well as their former colonies, so South America is also represented here) -- Yankees (the historical American faction) -- Zulu (updated from a former collective African faction, now focusing solely on the Zulu and the countries in southern Africa where they currently live) what do you all think? again, this is more for fun than for actually realizing it EDIT: though this increases complexity and the difficulty of actually designing the game, let alone actually making it, each faction also has about eight civ-specific characteristics, all of which are based on history. as yet, im not trying to make any one culture specifically focus on one aspect of the game, except maybe for the dutch faction, which i plan to have as the primary naval and trade power for the game. anyway, the traits are set up as this: 2 military advantages 2 military disadvantages 2-3 non-military advantages (this could be anything as long as it doesnt concern military) 2-3 non-military disadvantages each civilization also has one distinct cultural power, eight hero units (mostly historical and ideally spread out over the course of teh game), four unique technologies, four wonders (also ideally spread out over the course of the game, but some, like the yankee wonders, are lumped into a relatively short time), and, finally, ten different unique units. but not all of these unique units are actually absolutely unique; some of them are shared between factions, like the Confederates and Yankees both get the Minuteman unique unit, and the Russians and Germanians share the Circassian Mountainman unique unit here's teh civ-specific traits that i have so far: AZTECS --infantry have more attack and health, and defensive structures have more resistance to attack --the Aztecs lack conventional cavalry and mechanical units until the Enlightenment Era --the Aztecs can build additional Civic Centers from the very beginning, and they mine gold faster and carry more of it --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: EL DORADO :: makes building construction and repair cost only gold for a short time Heroes: --Ahuizotl --Cuahtemoc --Lopez de Santa Anna Unique Units: --Jaguar Warrior (heavy infantry, drains health from enemies, re-equips with guns, available for the entire game) --Aztec Cavalry (melee cavalry, trains from Barracks and captured Stables from teh Reformation to Enlightenment Eras) --St Chamond 75mm (rapid-fire field gun, available from the Industrial to Atomic Eras) --Zapatista (guerilla infantry, available from the Imperial to Computer Eras) --Assault Jaguar (heavy infantry, available from the World War II Era onwards) --Disruptor Ship (heavy torpedo ship available from the Genetic Era onwards) --ADS Railgun (light artillery that fires concentrated heat available sometime in the future) --Blowpiper (specialized ranged soldier available from the start to the Enlightenment Era) Unique Techs: --Chinampa (allows the Aztecs to make Aquafarms earlier) --Recoilless Guns (makes gun infantry fire faster) Wonders: --Great Pyramid [of Tenochtitlan] (available from the very beginning) BALKANS --(still lacking military advantages) --(still lacking military disadvantages) --Universities cost less, build faster, and research techs faster --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: ?? :: i dont yet have a balkan power, but one idea is ORACLE, which reveals a portion of the map Heroes: --no heroes yet Unique Units: --Varangian Guard (heavy melee infantry available from the start to the Enlightenment) --Seimeni (mercenary infantry available from the Reformation to Napoleonic Eras) --Armatolos (combination melee/ranged infantry available from the Enlightenment onwards) --Klepht (combination melee/ranged thief*) --Zeta Raider (special forces infantry available from the Space Era [as in the space race] onwards) --Dominator UAv (unmanned* kamikaze* aircraft) --Stradioti (mercenary cavalry available from the Exploration to Reformation Eras) *thief: this only applies to unique units. some UUs are "thief" units that steal some of the opposing player's resources when they kill a unit or destroy a building *unmanned: this is more of a designation than anything. unmanned units have half the population cost of similar units. ex: where a regular fighter/bomber would take two population slots away, the Dominator takes only one *kamikaze: pretty self-explanatory. kamikaze units can commit suicide and collide with a ship, a building, a stationary air unit, artillery, or mecha. this deals massive damage in the same way that a missile unit does, so it does more damage to that unit than the plane would regularly, oftentimes destroying it instantly Unique Techs: --no unique techs yet Wonders: --no wonders yet BENELUX --(still lacking military advantages) better warships --(still lacking military disadvantages) --Markets and Market techs are cheaper, and Shipyard techs are researched faster --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: IMPRESSMENT :: passive, allows warships to convert enemy ships to your side at random Heroes: --Abel Tasman Unique Units: --Privateer (combination melee/ranged thief available from the beginning to the Enlightenment) --Blunderbuss (heavy infantry that hurts enemies in a larger area than other infantry, available from the Enlightenment to the Gilded Era) --Boer (combination civilian/military* infantry) --KCT Elite (special forces infantry available from the World War II Era onwards) --Hydrate Bomber (specialized torpedo boat that fires torpedoes loaded with methane hydrate to immobilize, damage, and sink enemy ships in a large area) --NKT-48 Spartan (heavy HAAK*) --Stradioti (mercenary cavalry available from the Exploration to Reformation Eras) *civilian/military: this designates a soldier that doubles as a civic unit, capable of gathering resources and constructing buildings *HAAK: "Humanoid Autonomous Armored Knight", the game's version of mecha, based on knightmares from Code Geass Unique Techs: --The Flying Dutchman (ships do more damage to other naval units) --Voortrekkers Wonders: --Castle of Good Hope CHINA --(still lacking military advantages) lower mechanical costs --all units have less health, and mechanical units have less armor --(still lacking non-military advantages) --Era Advancement research takes longer, and their Merchants are all-around worse POWER: YEAR OF THE DRAGON :: steadily increases the population capacity with each Era Advancement. by the time they reach the very last Era, their population capacity has grown by 125% Heroes: --Zheng He --Zuo Zongtang (aka General Tso) Unique Units: --Chu-ke nu (one of the few archer units, available from the beginning to the Interwar Era) --Dragon Gunship (missile ship available from the Exploration to World War I Eras) --Boxer (light infantry available from the Imperial to Space Eras) --Hurricane Seeder (specialized ship that creates a hurricane arounditself to hurt other ships, available only in the last era) --Banner Troop (melee infantry available from teh Reformation to World War I Eras) --NKT-48 Spartan (heavy HAAK*) --Stradioti (mercenary cavalry available from the Exploration to Reformation Eras) Unique Techs: --no unique techs yet Wonders: --Forbidden Palace --Porcelain Tower CONFEDERATES --(still lacking military advantages) --mechanical units take longer to create and their infantry and cavalry cost more --food is farmed faster and Universities are built faster and research techs faster --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: CAMOUFLAGE :: makes infantry and civic units invisible while idle. im actually doing everything that i can to not stereotype the civilizations Heroes: --William Travis --Robert E. Lee --Stonewall Jackson Unique Units: --Jinete (light counter-cavalry available from the beginning to the Reformation Era) --Overseer (combination melee/support cavalry, he can be tasked on a resource to make civic units gathering from that work faster. this is the only reference to slavery in America that i plan to make) --Minuteman (light infantry that trains and moves faster than other infantry, available from teh Englightenment onwards) --Demolition Ship (kamikaze ship available from the Enlightenment to the Revolutionary Era) --Confederate Camelry (all-terrain counter-cavalry, based on a Confederate camel corps in Harry Turtledove's How Few Remain, available from the Industrial Era onwards) --M-388 Davy Crockett (nuclear artillery infantry, this was an actual type of weapon that was designed but never implemented for the cold war, available from the Space Age onwards) --M3 Bradley IFV (infantry fighting vehicle) --Supersoldier (super-heavy infantry available from the Genetic Era onwards) Unique Techs: --Indentured Servitude (citizens cost less, the only other reference to slavery, and even then only vaguely) Wonders: --Alamo --Pentagon --Supercollider --Rosenberg Institute DEUTSCHLAND --(still lacking military advantages) soldiers cost less gold --(still lacking military disadvantages) --(still lacking non-military advantages) --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: UNIFICATION :: steadily makes buildings better in all aspects depending on how many Civic Centers you control: if you have 5 or less, they are 15% better for each one you control; if you control 10 or less, they are 10% better for each one; if you control 11 or more, they are 5% better for each one Heroes: --Gebhard von Blucher --Otto von Bismarck Unique Units: --Teutonic Knight (heavy religious cavalry available from the beginning to the Revolutionary Era, Teutonic Knights can convert enemy units like a Holy Man) --Doppelsoldner (anti-cavalry infantry available from the Exploration to Enlightenment Eras) --Needle Gunner (nothing devised yet) --Zeppelin (airship available from the Imperial Era onwards, this is an early bomber aircraft that also deals massive damage in an area when it is destroyed and hits the ground) --37mm Flaming Onion (early mobile anti-aircraft available from the World War I to Atomic Eras) --Jaguar 1 Rakete (guided missile tank available from the Space Age onwards) --Gas Grenadier (specialized infantry that uses poison gas, available from the World War I Era onwards) Unique Techs: --Ninety-five Theses --Unrestricted Submarine Warfare (submarines do more damage to ships) Wonders: --Brandenburg Gate --Reichstag FENNOSCANDIA --(still lacking military advantages) --(still lacking military disadvantages) --Hospitals heal units faster and University techs are researched faster --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) higher gold costs POWER: ??:: no power yet, but previous ideas include PLUNDER (makes all of your units "thieves") and BERSERKERGANG (makes them do more damage when low on health) Heroes: --Charles XII Unique Units: --Hackapelite (light cavalry available only in the Reformation Era) --L52 ARCHER (special self-propelled artillery available from the Computer Age onwards) Unique Techs: --Dynamite --Socialized Medicine Wonders: --Utti Jaeger Center FRANCE --(still lacking military advantages) better artillery --(still lacking military disadvantages) --(still lacking non-military advantages) better defensive buildings --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: ??:: no power at the moment, but an old idea was INVULNERABILITY Heroes: --Joan of Arc --Napoleon Bonaparte --Charles de Gaulle Unique Units: --Hot Air Balloon (early air reconnaissance unit) --Voltigeur (light infantry available from the Napoleonic Era onwards) --Spahi (combination infantry/cavalry* available from the Revolutionary Era onwards) --Rafale C Stealth Fighter (early stealth* fighter craft) *infantry/cavalry can switch between cavalry and infantry modes when the situation calls for it; they start off as infantry and switch to cavalry automatically when told to move over a large distance, increasing their speed and becoming more effective against regular units cavalry are good against *stealth indicates that the unit is inherently invisible. unlike teh Confederate Camouflage, stealth units are always invisible until its very close to the enemy. in the case of stealth planes, they cannot be seen at all unless they are near certain buildings such as towers Unique Techs: --Coureur de Bois (citizens hunt better) --Maquis Wonders: --Notre Dame Cathedral --Arc de Triomphe --Eiffel Tower GERMANIA --(still lacking military advantages) more tank armor --higher tank costs and infantry have less resistance to attack from Unique Units --(still lacking non-military advantages) more building resistance --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) weaker citizens POWER: BLITZKRIEG :: for one minute after activation, all units are trained faster and move faster, but cost more at the same time Heroes: --Erwin Rommel --Otto Skorzeny Unique Units: --Teutonic Knight (heavy religious cavalry available from the beginning to the Revolutionary Era, Teutonic Knights can convert enemy units like a Holy Man) --Doppelsoldner (anti-cavalry infantry available from the Exploration to Enlightenment Eras) --Circassian Mountainman (heavy infantry available from the Revolutionary Era onwards) --Zeppelin (airship available from the Imperial Era onwards, this is an early bomber aircraft that also deals massive damage in an area when it is destroyed and hits the ground) --H-44 Bismarck (heavy battleship) --V-3 ICBM (early ICBM) --Gestapo Officer (special unit that can go Incognito* to sneak into enemy territory, but you can only have 10 of them at a time, availabl from the Interwar Era onwards) *Incognito is a special skill that some Unique Units have, allowing them to dress as an enemy civilian and enter enemy cities without fear. they cant attack while doing this, but they cant be attacked, either. this is mostly given to assassin units so that they can hit vital points in an enemy army, like a hero Unique Techs: --Master Race --Autobahn (increases teh movement speed of mechanical units over land) Wonders: --Zeppelinfield --Volkshalle GREAT BRITAIN --planes do more damage to other planes and HAAKs (mecha) are built faster --(still lacking military disadvantages) --(still lacking non-military advantages) better buildings --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: IMPERIALISM :: has two effects: on non-provincial maps, additional Civic Centers are free; on provincial maps, construction on foreign or unclaimed soil is not slowed down, and unclaimed territories can be seized by building a military production building on that territory Heroes: --Arthur Wellsley Unique Units: --Longbowman (cheap, long-ranged infantry available from the beginning to the Reformation Era) --Mortuary Cavalry (melee cavalry available from the Reformation to the Napoleonic Era) --Congreve Rocket (elite grenadier/artillery infantry available from the Englightenment to the Gilded Age) --Green Jacket (sniper infantry available from the Napoleonic Era onwards) --Maori Mercenary (light infantry available from the Revolutionary Era onwards--remember, this is alternative history & fictionalization of real cultures) --SAS Commando (special forces infantry available from WWII onwards) --Tortoise A39 (super-heavy tank available from WWII onwards) --Chamberlain Knight (specialized infantry that makes HAAKs better when they are garrisoned inside them, making them faster and stronger) --MMAA-11 Glasgow (early HAAK meant to complement the Chamberlain Knight) Unique Techs: --New Model Army Wonders: --Imperial Palace HABSBURGS --(still lacking military advantages) --(still lacking military disadvantages) navy is worse off --(still lacking non-military advantages) --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: CONSCRIPTION :: allows Habsburg citizens to become soldiers instantly at the cost of gold Heroes: --Vlad the Impaler Unique Units: --Grenzer (anti-cultural infantry available from the very beginning onwards) --Winged Hussar (light cavalry available from the Exploration to Napoleonic Eras) --Uhlan (cavalry with a bonus against armored vehicles available from the Napoleonic to World War II Eras) --Kaisershutzen (special all-terrain infantry) --Panzergrenadier (heavy infantry available from the Interwar Era onwards) --ADGZ (heavy armored car available from the Interwar Era onwards) Unique Techs: --ISW Tytan Wonders: --none yet INDIA --(still lacking military advantages) defensive structures are built faster --(still lacking military disadvantages) --uranium is mined faster, and more resources are acquired through market trade --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: ?? :: Heroes: --Shivaji Unique Units: --Rajput (available from the beginning onwards) --Gurkha (special forces infantry available from the Revolutionary Era onwards) --Sepoy (light infantry available from the Revolutionary Era onwards) --Bangalore Torpedo (anti-building heavy infantry available from the World War I Era onwards) --15A Kolkata (destroyer available from the Computer Age onwards) --Zamburak (light artillery cavalry available from the beginning onwards) --Tortoise A39 (super-heavy tank available from WWII onwards) --Chamberlain Knight (specialized infantry that makes HAAKs better when they are garrisoned inside them, making them faster and stronger) --MMAA-11 Glasgow (early HAAK meant to complement the Chamberlain Knight) Unique Techs: --F-INSAS Wonders: --Taj Mahal --Red Fort ISRAEL --(still lacking military advantages) missiles are cheaper --(still lacking military disadvantages) --(still lacking non-military advantages) technology researches faster --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: ?? :: currently lacking a cultural power, but an old idea was "Divine Intervention" which would prevent all damage for a short time Heroes: --(no heroes yet) Unique Units: --Camelry (all-terrain cavalry available at any and all times) --T.A.R. 21 Brigadier (all-purpose infantry available from the Computer Age onwards) --Delilah Fighter (combination fighter/missile plane available from teh Computer Age onwards; it carries one missile at a time which it uses for great damage, and then switches to standard fighter equipment until it returns to an airport for another missile) Unique Techs: -- Wonders: --Dome of the Rock --Desalinization Plant ITALY --(still lacking military advantages) lower infantry costs, lower building costs and faster build rate --(still lacking military disadvantages) infantry have less health --(still lacking non-military advantages) better religion --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: ALCHEMY :: allows certain resources to be used interchangeably: gold = iron, uranium = khrusionite (fictional resource), and wood = stone Heroes: -- Unique Units: --Swiss Mercenary (combination melee/ranged infantry available throughout the game) --Redshirt (combination civilian/infantry) --Arditi (special forces infantry that uses grenades against tougher units and buildings) --Paratrooper Plane (specialized plane that deploys infantry at a drop point available from the Interwar Era onwards. though its very expensive, its individual cost is less than the combined cost of the infantry) Unique Techs: -- Wonders: --Tower of Pisa (leaning or not leaning?) --Sistine Chapel JAPAN --(still lacking military advantages) mechs are built faster --(still lacking military disadvantages) weaker and more expensive cavalry & armored vehicles --technologies are researched faster and fishing ships gather more food faster --(still lacking non-military disadvantages) POWER: ADAPTATION :: lets the player reverse-engineer enemy technologies for their own use whenever they capture an enemy Civic Center. very rarely, a unique or advancement technology will be researched. Heroes: --Oda Nobunaga Unique Units: --Samurai (combination melee/ranged infantry available througjhout the game) --Ninja (special forces infantry available from the Reformation Era onwards) --Kachi-metsuke ("sword police" counter-infantry available from the Gilded Age onwards, they are most effective against other unique units) --A6M Zero (kamikaze fighter/bomber available from WW2 onwards) --T08A2 (heavy gatecrasher* available from the Digital Age onwards) --Raikou (super-heavy artillery available only in the last age) --Paratrooper Plane *gatecrasher: mecha-siege Unique Techs: --Meiji Restoration (makes technologies research 50% faster, but only in the Gilded Age Wonders: --Himeji Castle --Tokyo Sky Tree

totally agree; absolute realism should never be more important than balance and enjoyable gameplay. hence the persian unique unit in AOK: who's gonna care how anachronistic it is when youve got a line of war elephants marching on a town??

i can think of only one suggestion outside of completely changing the game, and would probably come in a later release: two more phases after City. the fourth phase would be Empire, comparably in international status to what the earlier roman empire was to its surrounding countries, and the fifth would be Legend, when your civilization becomes so large and powerful that memory of it is never lost(again, as was the case with rome) though not for the initial release, i would also suggest a third official release of 0AD that would include more civilizations that the initial civilizations didnt encounter(like perhaps the Han Chinese and Yamato Japanese) from 500bc-500ad, fitting in with the previously established criteria because, from what i can tell, the civilizations at the moment are just rome and whatever peoples they encountered, with 500bc-1bc for the first release and 1ad-500ad for the second release, so i think worldwide cultures for both periods would be the next logical direction to go in

whatever! the idea is the same!

i know, i just personally prefer hercules to heracles. in the final version, he would have the more correct name

ive done some more work for the heroes and favor generation of the first five cultures: the celts, egyptians, greeks, mesopotamians, and norse. i should also clarify that, for the project, each civilization will be one of three types: either Soverign, with one or two "leader" hero units and usually a mass-production hero, Heroic, with mythological characters as heroes who never actually die but can be knocked out but will revive under certain conditions, or Chivalric, with just a cheap, weak mass-production hero. these are based on the Egyptians, Greeks, and Norse from AOM, respectively. CELTS (Sovereign) the celts get a King as their sovereign and the mass-production Druid the celts get favor by having a druid plant a tree and then having mortals pray around it, basically just stereotypical pagan ritual EGYPTIANS (Sovereign) like in AOM, the egyptians get a Pharaoh and the mass-production Priest. however, im contemplating replacing the Priest with the Magician, since magicians are mentioned as being present in egyptian courts in the bible and that would also leave priests available for another culture or as a regular unit also like ikn AOM, they get favor by building monuments GREEKS (Heroic) like in AOM, the greeks get favor by praying at temples and they have a different set of heroes for each major god. i currently have it as this: Zeus gets Jason, Odysseus, Bellerophon, Leonidas, and finally Hercules. im missing a hero to go between Jason and Odysseus for a second advancement hero Poseidon gets Theseus, Hippolyta, Atalanta, Alexander, and Polyphemus. again, im nissing a second advancement hero here. Hades gets Oedipus(?), Chiron, Orpheus, Perseus, and finally Achilles. im not sure if oedipus would go well here, and im missing a hero for the advancement between orpheus and perseus MESOPOTAMIANS (Chivalric) the mesopotamians get favor simply by building cities; all of their buildings very gradually generate favor, so they are encouraged to build large cities to get more favor faster. however, im having trouble with the mesopotamian heroes. my first idea is Priestess, based on the epic of gilgamesh, or maybe just Priest would be better. another idea i had a long time ago is simply Nobleman, a chariot-riding hero NORSE (Chivalric) like in AOM, the norse get favor by fighting, and their heroes generate favor very slowly simply by existing. this time around, the norse heroes are Jarls, not hersirs, which are permanently mounted noble warriors. theyre good at fighting myth units, but not much else

same here thats one of the reasons im making all these written designs, to cut back on the work the modding teams would do if and when this becomes a possibility for the first time since i started this project, im working on filling in the information for each of gods for every culture and not just the ones that i want to do. im starting with the descriptions of each god and ill amost desperately try to get focuses, techs, MUs, and godpowers for them afterwards

again, those other pacific and prehistoric MUs would be included to fill out the rest or to fill in as either weaker or stronger MUs for their respective cultures. one reason i wanted to include the Ripper Dragon is because one of the new hawaiian gods is a goddess of lizards, and what could be more fitting than a giant monitor lizard? im also planning to make some tributes to old films and literary works in bestiary and myth units for some cultures, particularly the cro-magnons, like their bestiary would be more realistic versions of the crystal palace dinosaurs, ie, one of the huntable animals introduced as cro-magnon bestiary would be Iguanodon, a dinosaur. aside from that, there would also be a set of cenozoic animals for a more realistic cro-magnon environment. another thing i wanted to emphasize with some of these cultures is the idea of lost worlds, like in conan doyle's famous novel or in king kong or journey to the center of the earth. to that end, there would probably be Gigantopithecus huntable animals in reference to king kong

i mainly use wikipedia to get the initial ideas and pantheon setups for each faction; its basically just scratching-the-surface research, which would be backed-up by legit written research later on. btw, i redid a few of the factions the other day while waiting for replies: i finished the new aztec and mayan pantheons (had to go for a bit of a stretch on just one god for the mayans, but it does have legit grounding), i redid a bit of the chinese pantheon (confucius is now the neutral "god" of that faction), the polynesian faction has been completely redone with only hawaiian gods, though i plan to/may do some additional research into their counterparts from other pacific cultures if i absolutely have to, teh serbonian pantheon has been almost completely redone with additional greek/minoan deities (a legit minoan goddess is the new neutral god, Atlas has replaced Ophion as the "evil" god, and Thalassa has replaced Amphitrite as the "good" god). the new serbonian pantheon also goes on the largely indefinite minoan pantheon by having mostly goddesses as both major AND minor gods. im also thinking that, since the minotaur is not a minoan creation and is already taken by the greek culture, there can be compensation with the serbonians by putting bull imagery in alot of their units, like the bows of their ships would be adorned with bull-horn-like ornaments, and there will certainly be a good number of bull-like myth units for them. ive also got the Focus, Bonus, and God Powers for all three of the greek major gods, though nearly all of it is borrowed from AOM: Hades' ranged soldiers fire their weapons faster (ie, in the time it takes for one of Zeus' archers to fire one arrows, an archer of Hades fires two, something like that) and buildings have more health and more resistance to attacks. his bonus means that there is a 15% chance that his fallen soldiers will return from the dead to fight again as Shades, and these shades grow more powerful as you progress through the game. finally, Hades' godpower is Sentinel, taken directly from AOM, makes Hades send four living statues to defend one of your civic centers from attack Poseidon's cavalry have more health, and his ships not only move faster, boosted by Poseidon's salty winds, but they also have more resistance to attack from naval myth units and are more resistant to the effects of enemy godpowers, but they can still be destroyed by these Zeus' melee infantry have more health and do more damage to buildings. thats all there is for his focus, but he makes up for it with his bonus and godpower: the followers of Zeus can get more favor faster, and have a higher maximum limit of favor (where other major gods give only up to 100 favor, Zeus gives 200). finally, Zeus' godpower is absolutely deadly: he sends down one of his lightning bolts to immediately blow a single enemy unit off teh face of the earth, though it doesnt affect all units. these unaffected units would be special heroes that would appear only in campaigns. im also recopying my old document on the pantheons into a new document with a new format as for cro-magnon myth units, its not just gonna be ice age animals like mammoths and terror birds that will be included, but also some ferocious dinosaurs and fitting cryptid animals. for those who dont know, a cryptid is a reported animal whose existence has not yet been proven or disproven, like bigfoot. these cryptids will be included as myth units for alot of cultures, like the megalania (that komodo dragon on steroids i mentioned earlier) is occasionally sighted, though these have not been cofirmed. in reference to this as well as to give the polynesians a good early myth unit, the polynesians will get the Ripper Dragon myth unit, or Varanus priscus. alot of the other myth units will also be based on both existing and fossil animals, like the thunderbird myth unit for the iroquois will be based on Argentavis, the largest flying bird ever, and various. alot of cryptids out there have been identified as dinosaurs, so these would be ones to apply to teh cro-magnons if they are either not needed for another culture or if the cro-magnons need another unit. alot of the ones that WILL go for the cro-magnons are the ones from sub-saharan africa, as is the case with mokele-mbembe, a naval myth unit, and kongamato, a flying one

okay, ive redated a few parts o the timelines and have decided on a few other things: CELTS: the timeline itself is not changed, but ive decided to replace one of their major gods, Balor, with a scottish god. however, my research has turned up nothing. anyone know who was one of the more important scottish gods? CHINESE: the timeline, again, is not changed, but i figured out what the last major god will focus on. the "neutral" major god will focus on either Daoism or Confucianism (with the "good" god focusing on Han china and the "bad" god focusing on Qin china) CRO-MAGNONS: the dates are adjusted to range from 10000 BC to 5000 BC. their last armory advancements are still copper weapons. also, since the cro-magnons are going to seriously lack in the departments of siege and navy, theyll have more powerful myth units earlier and two-thirds of their minor gods will give out naval myth units(so that the player always has the option of getting a naval myth unit for that advancement) POLYNESIANS: teh dates are adjusted to range from 300 AD to 1778, which are the dates of hawaii's colonization and their first contact with europeans, respectively. like the cro-magnons, they will lack severely in a few departments, but will have more ships than the cro-magnons. as before, their invented myth units will derive from all over the pacific and not just polynesia, so there will be some australian cryptids and fossil creatures in there as well SEMITES: the beginning of the semitic time period has been readjusted to 2348 BC, which is the approximate date for the flood in the bible. the ending date still goes to the fall of carthage. i also came up with an option for single-player mode: Turn Off Myth Units, in which you have the option of playing the game without mythological units to help you, but you can still research mythical technologies to help your civilization

i do see where youre coming from. the main problem is that not all the polynesian/pacific cultures have enough going for them to make a single military for them. what i had been trying to emphasize earlier was mainly that the hawaiians would be the major religious source, since theres alot of hawaiian deities, but as far as i know, theres not much military going for them, so that where the philippine weapons and whatever come in. australasia would be in there mostly for myth unit inspiration and for bestiary (teh idea is to have a few different animals and plants for each culture, so the polynesian wildlife would mostly be australian ones simply because there arent many large animals in the polynesian proper) maybe it would be best to make it focus mostly on hawaii and continue to call them polynesians. the otehr pacific myth units would still be in there, though, because i'd have to make something completely original otherwise. besides, wouldnt you like to play as an island culture who can set beef-up komodo dragons on your enemies? or how bout divebombing them with giant eagles? those are some of the polynesian myth units i have in mind the earlier date was just from an apparently mainstream theory that lists that as the earliest POSSIBLE date for human colonization of polynesia, not necessarily teh earliest DEFINITIVE one i think ill just look into my history book to get a good name. what i want to date from is teh portion of the stone age when agriculture and domestication came into use and then date forward to the copper age. another idea i had for the cro-magnons was that they cant research armor technologies and begin the game with very little, but gradually increase as they advance and their models acquire more animal skins, hides, and furs as they advance, and that adds to their armor

having the aztecs and mayans as seperate factions was how it was originally, and how it was portrayed in AOK and in the unreleated Empire Earth 2. not sure why i lump some together and why others are seperate; in anotehr RTS project of mine, theres two seperate factions for americans, germans, british, and russians while the balkan states are lumped together in just a Balkan faction and the spanish and portugeuese are lumped together in the Visigoth faction. in any case, oftentimes with factions that represent several different peoples, there will be one major god that is the "patron" of a particular people or region within that faction, like the Mesopotamians are divided so that Marduk represent Babylon, Ishtar goes for Sumer, and Tiamat for Assyria, which are th three best-known mesopotamian cultures. with the mesoamerican idea before, it was to be that one major god each would go for the aztecs, mayans, and inca, and the original thought with the chinese faction would be that one would go for Han Chinese, another for Qin Chinese, and i havent yet figured out what the other one is. perhaps ill extend the chinese timespan and base the third subfaction on that. if its such a problem with the polynesians, then the name will just be changed to Pacific and still represent those different cultures. a major one for that culture, though, is to represent Hawaii; the polynesian timespan is dated from the earliest possible time that polynesia was colonized to first contact with europeans, which would be right before they got modern weapons. oh! idea! instead of Polynesian or Pacific, maybe Oceanic would be better? by that im not referring to the ocean itself but to the continent of Oceania, of which Polynesia is but a region the cro-magnons are gonna be a bit of a stretch historically. it was actually very hard for me to find correct dates to the beginning of the late stone age, when cro-magnons appeared, to the end of teh european copper age; the copper age implementation would allows us to not only give them a little bit more technology and buildings. but maybe thats just cuz i stupidly only used wikipedia as a source there; i have a historical atlas, i should use THAT! in any case, i was trying to date it from teh late stone age, when allot of the bits and pieces of technology that remained in the bronze age and later, like farming, domestication, pottery, and bows & arrows, all started to come into use. if i were to put it into an armory sense, the cro-magnons would start out with Stone weapons, then move on to Polished Stone, Obsidian, and finally Copper. the myth units are also a bit of a stretch, but it seemed appropriate, and even though their gods are greek in origin, i dont need to stretch out the greco-roman myth units any more than i already have alot of those are just th greatest possible time period, and its not just random dating, they all have significance: the iroquois are dated as such because 4000bc is around when the mysterious Copper Culture in wisconsin appeared, and 1492 is the first significant contact with europeans for north america as a whole. its not really that their faction would take place in that year, but that, as their faction advances, technology they developed at that time would become available then. like with the japnese, they too would start with simpler weapons in their "yamato" stages but as the come towards the end and enter their "sengoku" stages, they would begin to have really advanced weapons like tempered steel. for that matter, the chinese are also gonna be a bit of a stretch in that i plan for them to have some gunpowder weapons even if its a bit anachronistic (remember, ensemble already did this in AOK, giving anachronistic war elephants to their persians; absolute realism shouldnt get in the way of enjoyable gameplay). my idea for the mythology version is to extend the game's phases from just 3 to a total of six "Eras" but they would functionally be the same, representing a phase of civilization rather than a specific time period as was the case in Ensemble games or in Empire Earth (in EE, the ages were specifically named things like World War II Age, and so on). they all start off in the Archaic Era, the dawn of that civilization, progress to teh Barbaric Era, when they begin to develop military, the Classical Era, when their religion is better-established, the Civilized Era, when they begin to create cities, Heroic Era, when they become very well known to their neighbors (case in point, the romans werent very well known until rome got really big and they began conquering places; before them, the main player was greece) and finally teh Mythical Era when that civilization has become so large, so powerful, and so well-known that their names are known throughout the rest of history and has achieved legendary status. aside from the potential of acquring a few more units in the game(not just MUs but also maybe a few more "super units" for later times depending on the major god) and the extended time period, as well as the implementation of mythology, the game would be functionally similar to 0 AD; why complicate things by making entirely new game functions aside from what is necessary for the setting? as for balance purposes, if one civilization is more advanced than another, it will have a severe weakness, though, like in 0 AD, the romans will probably be one of the more rounded civilizations. that being teh case, their major weakness will probably be in mythology, so theyll have only one super-powered MU where others would have two or three, and they'd probably only have one destructive god power (im thinking Eruption in tribute to Pompeii) where other civilizations would, again, have two or three. im trying to make it a general rule that each civilization has at most two super-destructive godpowers that simulate natural disasters or otherwise, like the ones for the greeks are Solar Flare and Lightning Storm thats why its divided into four parts with five civs each, so that only five need to be worked on at a time. tbph, i think making new civilizations like taht would probably be comparatively easy to coding 0 AD has been as a whole

i just finished up with the starting and ending dates for each of the factions AZTECS :: 1248 - 1518 AD CELTS :: c330 BC - c410 AD CHINESE :: 221 BC - 220 AD CHRISTIANS :: 33 - 1272 AD CRO-MAGNONS :: 9500 - 1700 BC EGYPTIANS :: c1570 - c1070 BC GREEKS :: c1600 - c300 BC HINDUS :: c2600 - c1300 BC HITTITES :: c1800 - 700s BC IROQUOIS :: c4000 BC - 1492 AD JAPANESE :: c250 - 1573 AD MAYANS :: c250 - c900 AD MESOPOTAMIANS :: c3100 - 539 BC NORSE :: c780 - c1100 AD PERSIANS :: c450 BC - 644 AD POLYNESIANS :: c6000 BC - 1778 AD ROMANS :: 753 BC - 476 AD SEMITES :: 3760 - c150 BC SERBONIANS :: c9600 - c1450 BC SLAVS :: 500s - 1387 AD whaddaya think?

theres going to be at least one myth unit for each minor god in a faction, so that means that, at the very least, fifteen myth units to a culture. this is only the bare minimum, though, and many minor gods will have two myth units, oftentimes a naval myth unit in addition to a walking or flying one, and some others have two walking myth units, but no minor god has ONLY a naval myth unit, because not all maps will have water where naval myth units could be of use

again, alot of them are just in there to fill things in. maybe instead of apep himself(?) it could be Apep-spawn?

in the matter of teh greeks, im also dividing some greek mythical creatures among the hittites (since a fair amount of greek legends take place in turkey and the hittites will be deriving alot from troy), the romans (since there arent many well-known roman myths that werent borrowed from the greeks), the Serbonians (this would have some more obscure mythical creatures), and even a few to the christians, kind of as filler. but the greeks are gonna have most of the better-known greek monsters, like the ones featured in the 12 labors of hercules. just a sec, ill bring up what i have for myth units so far. the second listing with different bullets shows more recently applied MUs that may conflict with those of other civilizations CELTIC -- Banshee -- Dullahan -- Green Knight -- Irish Elk (a bit of a stretch, since this is a fossil animal, not a mythical creature) -- Knucker -- Lake Maiden -- Lake Monster (another slight stretch, since this is based on the Loch Ness Monster) -- Lambton Worm -- Phantom Lion (another stretch, since this is a modern british cryptid) -- Questing Beast -- Vortigern Dragon -- Warg (tip-of-the-hat to tolkien warg is actually an old english or old norse word) ** Aughisky ** Giant Boar ** Firbolg ** Water Giant ** Fomorian ** Jack-in-Irons EGYPTIAN -- Ammit -- Apep -- Apis -- El Naddaha (another stretch, since, as far as i know, this creature is only known from present-day sightings; its something of a ghost) -- Giant Scorpion -- Inpu Warrior (aka Anubite) -- Magician (another stretch, actually derived from the Bible) -- Mummy -- Petsuchos -- Scarab -- Serpopard -- Shezmu -- Sphinx -- Sutekh Beast (or Set Animal, iirc; its been a while, but this is supposedly teh animal that Set had the head of) -- Uraeus -- War Turtle ** Sand Giant some of the egyptian units here are borrowed from AOM, like the war turtle, petsuchos, and inpu warrior GREEKS -- Arachne -- Centaur -- Cerberus -- Chimera -- Colossus -- Cretan Bull -- Cyclops -- Hamadryad -- Harpy -- Hydra -- Medusa -- Minotaur -- Naiad -- Nemean Lion -- Nereid -- Scylla -- Stymphalian Bird -- Sun Chariot MESOPOTAMIAN -- Apkallu -- Asag -- Humbaba -- Labbu -- Pazuzu -- Rabisu -- Scorpion-man (i took this AOM unit from the egyptians and gave it to the mesopotamians because they actually had scorpion-men in their myths, called girtab) -- Shedu -- Sirrush ** Amphisbaena ** Hunimuin NORSE -- Alfar Archer (another tribute to tolkien ) -- Einherjar -- Fenris Wolf Brood -- Fire Giant -- Frost Giant -- Garm -- Grendel -- Gulon -- Huldra -- Jormund Elver -- Midgard Snake (this is supposed to be like the sea monsters that attacked beowulf while he was in a swimming race that made him lose teh race) -- Mountain Giant -- Otso -- Troll -- Valkyrie ** Gullinbursti since ill be dropping the dwarven civilization, the svartalfheim myth units would be transferred over to the norse, or to another culture, probably the christians, for consideration: -- Ajatar -- Battlepike -- Battle Bull -- Dainsleif -- Fafner -- Gargouille -- Gevaudan -- Gram Knight -- Great Eagle -- Haltija -- Nix -- Sleeping Knight -- Wanderer ** Iku-Turso ** Nakki ** Lempo ** Flesh-eating Slug ** Surma ** Odva CRO-MAGNON -- Dimetrodon -- Dire Wolf -- Gorgon Beast (aka Gorgonops torvus) -- Mokele-mbembe -- Predammonite -- Saber-tooth -- Tyrant (aka Tyrannosaurus rex) ** Emela-ntouka ** Kongamato ** Muhuru JAPANESE -- Tengu -- Disciplinary Demon ** Abura-bo **Abura-sumashi **Akateko **Akki ** Amoronagu ** Arikura-no-baba ** Ashi-magari ** Bake-kujira ** Bakeneko ** Baku ** Chinthe ** Daidarabotchi ** Daitengu ** Funayurei ** Goryo ** Harionago ** Heikegani ** Hihi ** Hitodama ** Isonade ** Ittan-momen ** Kamaitachi ** Kanbo ** Kappa ** Karura ** Kawa-uso ** Kijo ** Kitsune ** Kitsune-tsuki ** Kiyohime ** Kurage-no-hinotama ** Kyubi-no-Kitsune ** Majin ** Mizuchi ** Namazu ** Nekomata ** Noppera-bo ** Oni ** Onmoraki ** Onryo ** Raiju ** Ryu ** Samebito ** Shachihoko ** Shin ** Taimatsumaru ** Tanuki ** Tatsu ** Tennin ** Tsuchigumo ** Tsurara-onna ** Umibozu ** Ushi-oni ** Wani ** Yagyo-san ** Yama-bito ** Yama-otoko ** Yaoguai ** Yuki-onna MESOAMERICAN (which will be divided into AZTEC and MAYAN) -- Feathered Serpent -- Giant Bat CHRISTIAN -- Antaeus (a greek giant from the theseus myth, in The Divine Comedy, antaeus helped dante and virgil by lowering them down into the lowest circle of hell) -- Behemoth -- Cherub (not the steretypical nude infant, no, this is a legit angel, a warrior of God Himself) -- Furies (tormentors of the greek underworld, in The Divine Comedy, they nearly attacked virgil and dante when they tried to get into Dis, but an archangel came down and told them otherwise) -- Hellhound -- Leopard (a bit of a stretch, but in The Divine Comedy, one of the animals dante was attacked by as he first approached limbo was a leopard, which embodied the sin of extravagance. -- Leviathan ** Demogorgon ** Sea Monk ** Unicorn ** Greyhound ** Archangel ** Basilisk ** Hobgoblin ** Peluda ** Cockatrice ** Gargouille ** Tarasque ** Fiery Serpent ROMAN -- Automaton -- Bronze Bull -- Cacus -- Charybdis -- Crinaeae -- Epimeliad -- Eurynomos -- Faun -- Geryon -- Giant Bee -- Giant Boar (instead of one particular boar, theres just a generic giant boar for the game, since those tend to be pretty common in mediterranean myth) -- Karkinos -- Laistrygonian -- Leokampus -- Python -- Orthrus -- She-wolf -- Siren -- Thule -- Vrykolakas ** Bacchanal AMERINDIAN (being reorganized as IROQUOIS) -- Giant Bear -- Giant Toad -- Jersey Devil (another stretch, but this is actually mentioned in amerindian legend) -- Marimonda -- Mohan -- Sasquatch -- Skin-walker -- Stone Giant -- Thunderbird -- Tupilaq ** Piasa ** Cadborosaurus ** Churubusco POLYNESIAN -- Poukai ** Burrunjor ** Taniwha ** Bunyip ** Turehu SLAVIC -- Baba Yaga -- Vampire -- Werewolf as an aside, the manticore, which is technically from greek mythology, apparently comes from persia, so manticores will be put in as a persian myth unit if another slot needs to be filled in for them

sounds like a good idea to me. i was planning for the greeks to be set somewhere between the mycenean civilization and the death of alexander teh great the time period is supposed to be ambiguous, more for simplicity than anything else, because some civilizations would become invalid if just one time was chosen: if i chose a middle ages time period for the norse and persians and christians, then the egyptians would be pretty much invalid. if i chose just an ancient time period, then the norse, christians, and aztecs become invalid. see the problem? therefore, the time period for the game is ambiguous and, depending on what time period each culture derives from (ie, late bronze age for greece and viking age for norse), that culture will have different advantages. for example, the greeks would be from an earlier time than the norse, so there would be compensation by making their MUs (myth units) tougher, or something like that, while the norse would put more emphasis on their mortal soldiers since theyre from a later time period and are more advanced (iron weapons and such). the oldest civilizations would be either the Mesopotamians or the Serbonians/Minoans/Atlanteans in these cases, but the atlantis one would be the exception to the rule because atlantis was supposedly far more advanced than contemporary cultures, so it would emphasize weapons and technology instead of mythology i was planning to derive from three major sources of mythology for the roman faction: legit roman deities that originated there, such as deified emperors, etruscan deities, and borrowed greek deities. the roman major gods are Quirinus (deified Romulus), Mithras (an etruscan god that was well-liked by the legionnaires), and Jupiter (aka Zeus, borrowed from the greeks) dont you worry about the pantheons; ive already got ALL of them sorted out. i made that my first priority when designing the cultures the main problem i found with the polynesian and amerindian cultures is that there were simply not enough deities or spirits that i could find that could serve as major and minor gods, so i derived from several im trying to make it so that no one myth unit is actually reused, but there ARE a number that are fundamentally similar to others, like several different ones will have throwing, bucking, ramming, fire-breathing special abilities (seperate powers, typically one to a unit) but id like to try to differentiate them as much as possible. as for certain aforementioned myth units, they too will go to just one culture instead of being officially repeated: harpies, minotaurs, and chimeras, for instance, will all be greek units, but the gryphons/griffins will be persian units, and the basilisk is planned to be a christian unit; im trying to fill in the more obscure ones first since theyre the ones that will really need it. as for arachne, she's kind of in as filler. invented myth units arent too far out there; AOM already did alot of that, like the prometheans, servants of oceanus, avengers, anubites, and war turtles. as long as they have some mythical basis, they qualify. for that matter, i plan for alot of the cro-magnon units to be based on prehistoric wildlife even though their pantheon is derived from the greek titans some reference to titans in myth units will almost certainly be present, but pretty much all of the titans, and a few stretches of them, are also in the game, mostly as major and minor gods. for example, ive got helios in as a last-age minor god for the greeks, more as filler, really, but he also gives the greeks teh deadly Solar Flare godpower the monsters-being-granted-by-the-gods thing is, again, more for simplicity and balance, and, again, this was already done in AOM, in which gods would grant a myth unit even if it wasnt associated with them at all(for some reason, Dionysus is the one that had the Hydra myth unit for example, and Artemis had the Chimera, and several norse gods gave giants even though the giants were the sworn enemies of teh norse gods). thanks for some of those ideas; i already had sirrush and humbaba down for the mesopotamians, but not many of the those egyptian ones

hey all. i got bored last night and worked a bit more on the mythology idea. im now thinking that it would be a good idea to redo a number of the civilizations, such as the composite and entirely fictional civilizations. tell me what you think: Celts = (no changes) Egyptians = (no changes, except maybe specifically dating to the bible era to coincide with two later cultures) Greeks = (few changes, like only deriving from greece after the fall of the minoan civilization, with teh trojan war being the earliest date to derive from) Mesopotamians = replaced with either Sumerians, Assyrians, or Babylonians, but i would still prefer to keep this one as is, though, of course, giving it specific dates Norse = (no changes, but dated only to the Viking Age) Chinese = (no changes as yet, since i havent come up with much else, but Han China should probably be a major inspiration) Cro-Magnons = (no changes) Hindus = Indus? since this is the earliest known culture from the Indian Subcontinent, it would seem appropriate Japanese = (no name changes, but this one would probably have the greates span of time, at the longest stretching from the Jomon period to pre-gunpowder Japan, like pre-Tokugawa Japan, or at the shortest from the Yamato period to the Warring States Period, which i think would be preferred. or, it could be from the origin of japanese civilization to the introduction of buddhism, since the japanese pantheon is going to derive solely from shinto) Mesoamericans = Mayans, Aztecs. perhaps this could be divided into two seperate civilizations, with one replacing the dwarven Svartalfheim culture. the aztecs would probably have better military and buildings while the mayans would have better technology and mythology. at the greatest, this would date from stretch from 1000 BC to pre-columbian Mexico Christians = this would probably be the latest of the cultures, deriving from the rise of christianity in the Roman Empire possibly to either the end of the crusades or to when the christians began replacing the pagan cultures, maybe the latest being to when they began demonizing Thor Hittites = obviously, from the rise to the fall of the hittite civilization, with troy being the earliest or latest date depending on when the hittites rose or fell (im not too sure on teh date at the moment) Levantines = redone to their former name of Semitic Peoples, or maybe just to Semites. the culture itself is meant to be a composite of the Israelites/Hebrews, the Philistines(and other "antagonistic" cultures from the regions around israel; i only say antagonistic because this one derives alot from the old testament, where the hebrews are teh goodguys and the philitines, etc, are badguys), and the Phoenicians/Carthaginians. as such, this would date from around the origins of judaism, the Creation (), or the flood to either the fall of carthage or the rise of christianity Persians = PERHAPS redone to Medes, but it would otherwise be exactly teh same, deriving solely from zoroastrianism for the pantheon, so it would date from the rise to the fall of that religion Romans = THIS one will be MUCH harder to date. im thinking that maybe the roman culture here will focus just on the western empire, not only for simplicity's sake but also because the eastern empire was mostly greek, so it would date from the founding of rome to the original fall of the western empire Polynesians = the only other name that could possibly fit here would be Pacific. in any case, this would date from the original colonization of australia by the current natives to the earliest date when those peoples came into contact with foreigners. this one would militarily derive alot from the maori and philippine cultures, the pantheon from various polynesian mythologies, and the myth units would be derived not only from the mythology but also from the pleistocene wildlife of australia, especially those rumored to still be around, such as the Megalania, a giant carnivorous lizard thats basically a komodo dragon on steroids Svartalfheim = ive completely given up on the dwarf civilization Slavs = no changes. at the latest, this would derive from the historical pagan lithuania, which resisted christianity long after the rest of europe had converted Amerindians = i'd LIKE to keep in this culture, but maybe it would be a good idea to derive it more from one specific tribe than just all of them at once. if nothing else, it could derive just from cultures in eastern north america, because those are the tribes that the vikings would have encountered Serbonians = again, i'd like to keep this one. this would basically be greece before the mycenaeans, ie the minoans, but it would also derive alot from the mysterious "sea peoples" culture that may have caused the fall of the minoan and/or hittite cultures, but for the game, it would also derive alot from the atlantis myth. in the current pantheon i have set up for it, two thirds of it are derived from greek oceanic deities, especially obscure ones, and the remaining third are fictional olmec gods. these will probably be replaced. i also came up with a new idea: cultures that are dated only to the BC years must wait longer than other cultures to build additional civic centers, but, in exchange, their mythology is even stronger

ive never played AOE3, so i dont really know how that works back to the myth units, i think i know how it works: you cant control when you get them, but you still lose resources, though it costs far more than in AOM, like everything costs three times as much favor as before, to make them rarer and they are, to compensate, more deadly. cuz in AOM, after a while, it gets to the point where you just say, "oh, that guys has a minotaur...w/e"

the thing is, i honestly cant imagine it working any other way that wouldnt simply be copying something else

my thought was that the myth units that are generally more powerful or rare in mythology, or even the ones that are one of a kind, could be summoned only one at a time. like you could only have one chimera, since there was only one of that particular monster in mythology(as in the classical greek chimera that bellerophon killed), wheras you could get up to three cyclopes (since there were originally only three of these in mythology), and you could get as many centaurs as were spawned for you, though it should probably be capped some point or it could alternatively be based on what phase each one becomes available in in addition to their level of power, like you can get, like, 20 each of centaurs, cretan bulls, and arachnes (the earliest MUs for the greeks), and get progressively fewer with each new temple. btw, i looked over my document again and saw that cyclopes are actually available much earlier than i remembered, so they would probably be the strongest of the earlier MUs and you could probably only have five at a time. it would probably also be that they would have a severe weakness to something, maybe to javelinists because of the odyssey, where odysseus put out polyphemus' eye with a sharp wooden stake also, i recall one element from the Percy Jackson & The Olympians books having do with monsters. it is explained in that series that monsters dont actually die; they are just sent to the underworld for however long, which may be from a few days to a several thousand years, and die by exploding into orange powder, or something like that, and they return after a while. that could justify some of the monsters' reapperances EDIT: oh, another good edit i think would be to change some of the pre-existing 0 AD random/skirmish maps with some mythical elements, like god powers would be invoked by gaia to simulate natural disasters (ie, a tropical island could sometimes explode in a volcanic eruption, or a field will sometimes experience an earthquake, stuff like that) as well as some myth units appearing. i was looking over the intent for the polar map, Northern Lights, in that document i was linked to earlier, and i couldnt help but think that that map would be even cooler/more dangerous if a number of norse myth units were added, like mighty frost giants, ravenous fenris brood wolves, and maybe even a deadly kraken

yes, i have looked into it quite a bit. all of the deities are legit celtic gods and goddesses and most of the myth units are from celtic mythology, though there are a number that are based on arthurian legend. gimme a moment (loads up document): the Green Knight and Lake Maiden are available from the same minor god, Epona, and serve as land and naval units, respectively, and both are taken directly from arthurian myth: the Green Knight was some kind of giant, undead knight in--obviously--green armor that galahad(or gawain; cant remember atm) fought, and the Lake Maiden is an invented myth unit based on the Lady of the Lake, who gave arthur his sword, excalibur, in some versions of the myth the Questing Beast was encountered by Tristan and was later slain by the knights of Camelot. its available as a myth unit by worshipping Lugus finally, theres the Vortigern Dragon. this is another invented unit, but is based purely on athurian myth. it was one of the two dragons fighting in a subterranean cave over which king vortigern, one of arthur's predecessors, was trying to build a castle. it is arguably the most powerful celtic myth unit EDIT: i think ive figured out how the mythology could work with 0 AD's pre-existing elements. instead of training myth units willingly, you have to build temples to a particular deity, and you can only have one for each "rank" of deity. depending on the culture, they could be different (ex: for the christians, there wouldnt be actual temples to the archangels, which serve as the minor gods for that cultures, but some other kind of shrine to them). the temples then gradually generate the myth units at the cost of however many resources as if the god that temple is dedicated to summons it, and weaker myth units take less time than stronger ones, and some would have strict limits(like you could only have three cyclops whereas you could have a dozen centaurs). and a new requirement would come up for advancing to the next stage of civilization: in addition to doing whatever else is required, you also have to build a certain number of temples (like to get from the first stage to the next one, you would have to build a temple to a "lesser" deity (for the greeks, hermes, morpheus, or hestia), and then you could advance once fulfilling the other requirements. to get to the stage after that, you would need to build one to a deity of the next level (ex: demeter, apollo, or hephaestus for the greeks) and then another one for that same age to another one of the next level after that (dionysus, artemis, or ares). next stage, two more temples(first athena/hera/aphrodite, then helios/hekate/persephone). building those last two allows you to advance to the final stage(if there are four in 0 AD, like im imagining here), and then maybe there could be one last temple to your Major God (ex: Zeus, Hades, or Poseidon for the greeks) that allows you train something even stronger than any of your other units (like a Titan as there was in AOM) or maybe it just gives bonuses. in fact, maybe the last one could grant protection against god powers for units near it or in the same territory in it(ex: your enemy tries sending meteors at you using a god power, but your temple to, say, Zeus protects your town from it)

sorry for the late reply that could maybe work for a type of random map in which your main method of getting resources is looting, but i dont think itd really be feasible for every map any help you could give would be much appreciated. in fact, ill just tell you all the cultures that i have planned and which ones need the most work. on top of that, if you could tell me some more details from 0 AD that could be used for them(ex: some kind of building or what basic units that are in the game that would be appropriate for that culture), that would be much appreciated, too. actually, i just realized how much i would need to type, so im gonna break it down into parts. ill give out some more when i get some feedback. Celts (ive got all the Focuses and myth units for the minor gods down, but im still lacking in mythic techs and god powers. these should mainly be derived from all the peoples who lived in the british isles: the scots, the picts, the irish, the britons, all of em) Egyptians (again, ive got all the myth units but most of the focuses, techs, and god powers are still missing, and im also lacking in details for the Major Gods: Osiris, Ra, and Set) Greeks (ive got pretty much everything here, but i still need god powers for Aphrodite and Hephaestus, techs for Athena, Demeter, Dionysus, Hekate, and Persephone) Mesopotamians (theres still alot i need here: focuses, techs, and god powers for every minor god and at least four more myth units. theres alot that needs to be filled in here, so ill only give the info on request) Norse (im missing alot of focuses, techs, and god powers here)