Grugnas
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Posts posted by Grugnas
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Agree with Finch because f.e. Brasidas from Sparta grants +1 armor to the own skirmishers / champion skirmishers in range and Boudica gives +25% movement speed to all Champions in range, but since champions infantry and cavalry have different movement speed each other and from Boudica, it could be messy manage units in order to always get the buff, and it would make sense having a movement speed buff in formation because all units will move at same movement speed, in particular to the slowest moving speed unit.
Also notice that Iphicrate has a formation bonus auras and a global aura that applies to javelin units only, and since they could even be in another formation with another kind of units, the hero aura is restricted to very limited situations.
Themistocle bonus could even apply to champion train time because they are trainable only in determinated situations (f.e. in mainland or savanna biome often there is no water at all).
Agree on Pericle too.
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I must agree in part, but for example if you kill a woman carrying 10 wood you will gain 1 of each resource and 10 wood that the woman carried plus your soldiers will gain experience per successful hit resulting with being promoted and having higher stats but lower gathering rate. The only downside is that the unit has to stay near or inside a temple in order to regen health, but this can be avoided with cavalry which has a really high food gathering rate while hunting and it can be used as advantage when massing cavalry and get as many animals in the map in order to have a discrete vision of the map. Consider that it may result hard focusing the already damaged unit when many other are around.
Building a stone wall may be a solution but it is aviable in phase 2 and it requires a resource gathered at a slower rate compared to wood when talking about soldier citizens, plus building a wooden wall may be faster but can be risky because you could lack on wood and be forced to train women in order to pump up the wood production and being vulnerable to possible scouts and cavalry raid. Not talking about traders in a "walled" game because it is an entire chapter apart.
I agree that using soldier citizens isn't worth for early attacks, thats why cavalry is nice for slowing enemy eco down, since they can be used for corrals when wood is abundant or for hit and run attacks just to annoy enemy and slow down his economy in order to prevent a possible wall.
Indeed a game can be won with more strategies: a player could focus on sieges / elephant training, champion spam or building civic centers around enemy lines in order to prevent gim to gather further resources and force him into resign.
None force you to booming as said above (constantly training 1 unit at time is more worth in terms of eco growing in my opinion but extremly hard) and the batch size change is an interesting feature since it allows you to optimize phasing, eco growing and units choice. F.e. 2 players could reach different goals because one trained per batches having time to comulate resources while the other constantly trained units and, since the sieges are the most impegnative to fight for units... guess who'll have advantage?
Indeed number supremacy is better than quality.
In some games some units have different population cost despite the effectiveness thay may have (f.e. in starcraft demolisher costs more than a marine but marines are easier to mass and they counter demolishers despite their price / stats), but this is a too wide discussion since 0 A.D. games haven't a standard population cap and finding a balance or any other concept that fit any population limit is really complex and since as you said "balance can be achieved", a citizen soldiers system can be reasonable.
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18 minutes ago, DarcReaver said:
stop arguing about that the Citizen Soldier system is a good concept just because you don't get te problems that result from the system because you are not directly affected.
I'm sorry, no offence but I have to say that you have no clue of what are you talking about because i remind you of the loot system and the gain of killed unit resources.
I had your same thought about the fact that apprently being difensive could be an advantage but I had to change my mind since being offensive.
The game is about denying enemy economy and not cumuling resources like an ant, since resources can even get stockpiled with the result of 10k+ of food and wood in late game, sometimes even metal; I recall that not the best eco score player wins.
A system with citizen soldiers isn't that different from a ringing bell with villagers defending the city.
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34 minutes ago, sphyrth said:
I share your sentiments @Grugnas as a fellow player... especially after watching the good replays posted on this forum.
But the recurring theme is that these guys (Drac and Enrique) have enough playing, and development experiences to have a concrete, long-term vision for this game. And that we just can't grasp the things they're talking about. I'm only waiting for feneur to say something about this.
Regardless where this goes, I'll still love this game.
meh.
Training units 1 by 1 is more efficient in terms of economy growing while using batching is clearly more useful when planning an attack, that's what the "batch of units" is meant to be or at least as i interpreted, but since training batches of units is more easy to manage, the choice is more batches. The concept behind isn't that illogic as affirmed.
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Booming isn't the ultimate strategy since you could grow a specific eco in order to get cavalry asap and mine the enemy economy and gaining resources as loot from the killed gatherers and as resources carried by the killed unit, so I really can't understand why "attacking isn't worth the effort" since it could even be more rewarding than growing own economy. Learning from top players their successful strategies for winning 1v1 games teaches a lot, expecially that team games aren't always comparable to 1v1 games.
Most relevant techs looks quite expensive compare to others.
Since formations aren't implemented yet all the considerations done about such "battallion and formation system" and unit counter don't have a solid enough base.
If you can't face units with their counters, you may want practice more instead of fighting with a formation system which kills micromanagement.
Since we play this game which is a RTS game, I suppose that we have in common the passion for this kind of games and using past experiences in other titles as curriculum in order to proof own correctness isn't really relevant since some players could even prefer and/or maybe find that a non formations system could have an higher skill cap (f.e. does Starcraft even use formations?).
Aren't celtic tribes fast enough compared to other factions in terms of building time and access to a variety of units in a specific time in the game? Looks like some factions are meant to be different from others in some aspects, but since the game is still in alpha, the way is still long considering that f.e. strategies drastically changed from the last alpha.
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43 minutes ago, Hannibal_Barca said:
Champion Infantry Pikemen Walk Speed increased from 7 to 10 <===== Maybe 9 is enough.
there is a 3 movement speed difference between champions and normal units, they will still be the slower champion units. That extra movement will make placement decisions easier to perform while defending support units.
Chamion Infantry Spearman attack rate increased from 0.75 to 0.90 sec <======== Can't we find a more elegant solution for this one? Maybe nerf spear armour.
An armor nerf would make them equal to sword but with extra damage to cavalry, and considering that one of the spearmen champs role is to face champion cavalry which has high damage, this was the best solution
War Elephant Health Points reduced from 750 to 700 <=========== Really disagree with this one, elephants aren't that strong, nerfing them is not called for.
An elephant who attacks a full garrisoned fortress with a couple of towers as support still deals relevant damages and still keeps busy units while there is a support army clearing its way
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Attached here is a patch with few proposed changes which include:
Cavalry Spear attack rate reduced from 3,5 sec to 3 sec
Cavalry Spear has now a 1,25x bonus against cavalry units
Cavalry Spear Walk Speed reduced from 22 to 20
Cavalry Sword Wak Speed increased from 20 to 21
Infantry Pikemen Walk Speed increased from 6 to 7
Infantry Pikemen hack and pierce damage increased by 0.5
Champion Infantry Pikemen hack and pierce damage increased by 1
Champion Infantry Pikemen Walk Speed increased from 7 to 10
Wardog hack damage increased from 7 to 10
Chamion Infantry Spearman attack rate increased from 0.75 to 0.90 sec
War Elephant Health Points reduced from 750 to 700
Mauryan Archer Elephant Health Points increased by 100
Mauryan Archer Elephant Cost Increased by 50 food (now it costs 150f 50w)
Hero Infantry Spearman attack rate fixed to fit the new attack rate
Hero Spearman Cavalry fixed to fit the new changes
Hero Sword Cavalry attack rate reduced from 1 sec to 0,75 sec
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I was thinking to swap Sword Cavalry (from 20 to 21 considering the spear cavalry walk speed reduction that @Hannibal_Barca proposed) and Spear Cavalry walk speed (down to 20) in order to make Spear Cavalry less effective at women raids expecially in phase 1, manteining coherence with their infantry counterpart and give an attack multiplier bonus to spear cavalry in order to be more effective vs other cavalry classes despite its low attack rate.
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Unique like this
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I agree with you saying that Carthage should be able to build all 3 embassies, only 1 per type in order to make them unique. The funny thing is that Celtic and Iberian embassies have both a sword cavalry which are very similar with the fact that Celtic Sword Cavalry trainable from the embassy has lower moevement speed than actually a Gaulic \ Briton Sword Cavalry has and that iberians don't really have Sword Cavalry units to train (just like Gaulic swordmen aviable for ptolemaics and iberians from celtic embassy but for Gauls themself).
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Sparta: - MADNESS?? This is Sparta!
Gauls: - I forgot to take my potion today.
Romans: - I'll feed you to the lions
Persia - One King to rule them all
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I think that balancing is the most important thing and it should come even before new features since determines the players preferences too. Player shouldn't be forced to pick those most popular civs because of their units strength, but civs should be picked because of their particularity in terms of gameplay (say no to skiritai, say yes to pikemen!!).
Returning in to the topic, I think that healers are not worth their cost because 250 food is too much for those weak units. With weak I mean their overall attributes. Rank 3 healers are underrated because they heal pretty good but they techs are too expensive and rank 1 healers aren't much efficient, considering the fact that if their range is 20 mt for healing they will be very vulnerable to the enemy melee units. They could have increased healing rate and increased hp healed by changing the hp restored from absolute value to percentage in order to heal any unit in the same time, decreasing the effect of elephants and maybe giving priority to low hp % units.
Converting units can be interesting. Only a priest at once can try to convert an unit by "locking" that unit to a position for tot seconds (something like 10 - 15 sec?) and doubled time for champions (maybe decreasable by a tech research in temple).
Area effect priests would be probably too significant.
I like the idea of the camp, since i proposed a similar stuff (Garrisoning priests in the tower could let them heal from the tower with an increased range letting them heal from a secure place). The particularity of the camp could be that those camps can heal aoe allies too, since temples don't heal ally units if not garrisoned.
I'm still waiting to see that "Druid healings increase healed soldiers attack rate" for celtic tribes since it would be really cool
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Map: Survival of the FitNESS!
This time i lost because I had a bad micromanagement since i ordered my units to repair a building while gaia spawned and attacked. Since the Hero unit can't repair things, he's gone on the road to nowhere being caught by gaia rams. Managed to arrive 2nd despite the numerous treasures impossible to take
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On 7/1/2017 at 11:32 PM, asiga said:
Other minor aspects that maybe could be improved are corrals (if I'm understanding it correctly, you need to manually kill the animals, but it would be more convenient to have some workers doing the farm work automatically).
would be nice to have a system like Warcraft and Starcraft where you could just right-click the icon making the stable train animals continously every time the building finish to train an animal, if food is aviable. The skill of the player is to keep corrals going without let your hunters stop to gather food. Actually if you continuosly train sheeps and keep the number of stable and hunters equal, they won't stop to work
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On 7/2/2017 at 2:19 PM, fatherbushido said:
You don't provide a color set ;-)
else:
thanks for the tips, I made this for the yellow player, and, as you can see, there is a minimap that shows how colors can be distinguished each other.
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On 5/2/2017 at 4:10 PM, LordGood said:
Sounds like you could have used some palisades with all that unnecessary ship wood.
That's true. By the way if you consider the wood spent for the dock + 4 fish boats (which make me focus all the organic units on wood only) and the wood I should have spent for grainfields + houses in order to rise more my population, probably I couldn't have so much time / resources. Probably i just had to ask my allies for help tho
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11 hours ago, borg- said:
THE LOOM: + 50% life for womans, cost 250 food. The aim is to make women less vulnerable, especially to early attacks such as romans rush cav. With 250 food you make 5 women, i think it expensive for the beginning of the game.
Changes: cost 100 food and 30% increase life. And maybe new tech in p2, 200 metal and increase armor in 2 or 3. This would make it more viable in the beginning of the game and making the game a little more balanced mainly against cav rush.
I often use that tech, expecially after using "Wicker Baskets" tech for fruit gathering rate, it comes in handy when rushed by Roman or Macedonian cavalry in phase 1, honestly I like that as it is now.
QuoteGarden: Increase 20% houses capacity populational, cost 500 wood, 100 stone. Not bad, but would only be useful when you have a fair amount of houses. At that moment you probably already have a good economy, being able to build new ccs, castles and others, which also give capacity, making it a little useless.
Changes: I no have much ideas, but maybe lower the price for 400 wood and 0 stone.
This is a quite expensive tech, maybe 400 wood instead of 500 wood is fair since most of the times, when unlocked, it will grant something like 20 - 30 population (450 wood for 3 houses) even if the bonus increases constantly more houses you have
QuoteInfantry recruit: All infantry -10% time of training, but -5% in life. cost 100 food.
Changes: -10% time of training, no changes in life. cost 300 food.
I kinda agree with that, because If you refer to the Persian Barrack, I'd say to ulteriorly decrease the time of training to -20% because having units with lower hp means that they will die faster and you'll need to replace them, by the way -10% time on infantry is tricky because saying that all infantry train faster of 10% means that you'll be able to train infantry in 9 seconds instead of 10 seconds. If you take for example a ranged unit in phase 3 has 66 health and most of the units will deal more than 6 hp point damage in 1 second, so, basically the training time / hp cost ratio is not worth it, considering that even Champions will "benefit" of that tech.
Also I'd like to point out at Fertility Festival that it is not so useful for civs with houses that grant 10 population because they will need half number of houses than civs like Celtic, mauryans and iberians. Something like an halved price for those 10 pop houses could totally balance that gap.
Healer techs from the temple are too costly considering that healer are already expensive by themself (250 food cost is maybe too high)
Carthaginian "Colonization" tech could cost same resources as the Persian Architecture tech. "200 wood and 200 stone" for a relevant tech vs "500 wpod and 500 metal" for -25% build time.
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2 minutes game
Map: Pompei
Placed between enemies and sea, tried to gather wood with all my units relying on ships for gathering food but, suprisingly, there was no fish in the left side of the sea and gathering food from grainfields would have been pointless because roman spear cavalry would have killed all my women resulting in a waste of resources, same for women on wood because cavalry can easly outflank spearmen and i should have to halt them anyway for defending otherwise enemy troops could kill my gathering units despite the aggressive stance of those. Same for sentry towers, since skirimsher cavalry over damage those. Looks like sentry towers are effective only vs infantry. Asking for resources to my allies would only result on a slower death. Enjoy the short replay.
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11 hours ago, Servo said:
This game in multiplayer means war and boomers seldom win over aggressive ones at even skills. But in single player it's either practice or fun. I choose fun.
Although this game has better safeguard against rush but not safe for raiding.
Since buildings aren't that effective against rushers, the only strategy you can adopt is to reply with another attack, sometimes I find fun to build a massive head quarter and cover my territory with towers aswell, by the way it is not really effective as training soldiers and fight for further resources, even for defending from a rush as happened in the last alpha, expecially in 1vs1.
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28 minutes ago, Feldfeld said:
We can also consider increasing their starting grade (instead of increasing base HP and armour, which still seem very logical to me), so they won't only be tank but also will deal more damage. It is just an idea.
this isn't a bad idea at all, by the way ranged units don't gain any attack damage more when they rank up, they gain range and maybe movement speed if i remember right. However, as any elephant unit, they have no techs aviable, making them even weaker for a phase 2 unit. I mean that in phase 2 blacksmith upgrades are aviable already, so, any civ with archer cavalry could potentially be in advantage already just unlocking 1 technology.
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maybe an HP and armor increase can be interesting. For now they are just "cavalry archers" with lower movement speed and no techs aviable.. Would be fun to see that berserker sprint tho. Wind speed elephants ftw.
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Darker Brown for animals, in that way they won't confuse with terrain, and same color can apply for bushes too since they its food aswell, actually bushes have same color of the orange player, or maybe pink, like the color of the meat. Stone is ok, and metal and yellow player color could swap colors since with a darker yellow, a blinking white dot could be seen easier than a lighter tone and, in my opinion, it is more eye candy than the actual yellow color
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10 hours ago, sphyrth said:
A Compass for the Map. No need to explain why it's a Nice-to-have.
But what I kind of want as a consequence is to make that gold map border a little bit thicker so that I could use it to rotate the camera angle and (therefore) the map.
also pings on the minimap, different color for resources since they are hard to find. Animals to hunt are hardly recognizable in the minimap, and when a player has yellow color, it is harder to see blinking white dots when underattack, and yellow is easly be confused with a metal mine.
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@fatherbushido thanks for the resources, I'll check deeper into it. However in the actualy situation 20 slingers can destroy a fully upgraded siege tower, with or without the Demetrius aura. Basically 20 slingers are cheaper then the tower and they are even stronger, without counting the fact that it is vulnerable to sword cavalry just as slingers or any ranged unit is.
By the way I can't understand the crush damage adjustment because basically the siege towers are sieges and they are meant to attack buildings, by the way they are hybrid units and they can attack units too dissipating the crush damage inflicted to the buildings tho. And please, notice that iberian defence towers cost much less and they have garrison limit of 8 units by the way they shot more arrows than a siege tower garrisoned with more units. I think that one solution could be, for example, granting to the siege tower the same techs of the defensive towers could be an extra buff to those and an interesting "synergy" since they are siege and towers too keeping their difference constant. In that way the siege tower could have increased arrows shooted by the same number of units garrisoned in it at cost of extra techs, increasing the damage aswell even keeping the actual stats.
Ifrates aura
in Gameplay Discussion
Posted · Edited by Grugnas
Thanks for have noticed my error, but that 21.2 whitin formation is clearly not intended because as far as i remember, units whitin formation move at same speed of the slowest unit. If you try to move Iphicrates' formation and a lone skirmisher, you'll notice that the lone skirmisher will move faster.
Probably units in formation should show all the same movement speed.