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Thorfinn the Shallow Minded

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Posts posted by Thorfinn the Shallow Minded

  1. I think that a problem that is summarised to an extent by Nescio is the issue with arguing that just because wood is used, spearmen should require wood.  Probably a better approach to take would be to have most basic units cost some ratio of food and wood with the amount being arbitrary to an extent.  Cavalry, being more expensive to field, would cost not only more food, but also an amount of metal, and any unit that begins with an amount of experience would similarly cost metal.  Champions would cost even more metal while mercenary type units could cost only metal.  

    Stone should probably only be reserved for siege weapons and buildings made available in the Town Phase.

    Metal would be an additional cost when building structures available in the City Phase.  

    I think that what could be explored in much more depth, however, would be the time investment.  For most technologies, I think that it would be interesting to not necessarily care as much about the amount of resources spent on a technology compared to how long it would take to research.  The same could be considered with units, in which the training time, something I covered a good while ago, is ridiculously short compared to even fast paced RTS games like Starcraft.  

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  2. 1 hour ago, Stan` said:

    That could be done with status effects. Javelin units attacking shields and putting a malus on armor @Freagarach

    I would definitely find that interesting with the strategic potential it could provide.  At one point ranged missiles and to an extent melee attacks could be relatively harmless against most shielded units until javelins disable that, leading to a cool hammer anvil effect.

  3. 1 hour ago, Nescio said:

    Although it's possible to hurl rocks of c. 500 g, which would have high impact, in practice sling projectiles were much lighter, under c. 50 g, sometimes as little as c. 5 g. The lighter the projectile, the higher the speed and range, and the greater its penetrative power; tiny bullets would go deep into the enemy's flesh and were very difficult to extract; besides, their small size made them difficult to see and dodge.

    Just to nitpick to boost my meagre ego, lighter does not necessarily imply better penetration.  The primary factors at work are size and density.  A huge rock might not be able to be launched at a very high velocity, yet its mass would compensate, giving it a large degree of momentum.  The issue with its size then comes with pressure, in which the area in contact with a surface works against that.  

    1 hour ago, Nescio said:

    Rhodian slingers > Iranian archers > Cretan archers > non-Greek slingers > javelineers

    Obviously you were generalising, but I think that it should be pointed out that the javelin could have functions unlike the others in that they could to an extent render shields ineffective or at least unwieldy.  

  4. Depending on the type of weight of the sling projectile, I think that there is a valid reason to give them the ability to ignore armour to a limited amount.  Javelins, being even heavier should have even better abilities to penetrate armour at the cost of requiring a good deal of micro to not get caught out after launching a volley with their short range.  



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  5. 1 hour ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

    It offers RTS-like control in a battlefield setting.

    I don't really see how that gives too dramatic of a difference unless my understanding of RTS-like control is different from yours.  Sorry if I am coming off as a skeptic; I think that an idea like this has potential, and if I could think of a suggestion to make it more engaging and not just make it feel, if you pardon this sounding harsh, like a Total War clone.  


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  6. I don't seem to follow what you mean by left panel.  Could you clarify?  If you are referring to the attachment, I had trouble opening that up, probably a fault on my end.  Either way, assuming the icons mentioned match the general concept of guard and use a more historical basis for the shield design, it has my approval for what that's worth.

  7. I have to say that the icons look a lot better in the way you have streamlined them.  The primary point I would criticise would be the shape of the shield; obviously you were working off of the previous iteration, and I understand your desire to be conservative about the changes, but the shape seems to be ported right out of a fantasy setting.  I think that the game might be better served with a simpler shape such as a legionary's scutum.  Otherwise, great work.

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  8. To put forward another Hellenistic structure, the Altar of Zeus at Pergamum would be be a plausible option.  The Attalid dynasty based in Pergamum was directly from Lysimachus' successor state, and the structure is in an incredible state of preservation due to the meticulous work of German archaeologists.


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  9. 1 hour ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

    An Oikemene mod or something Greek focused that adds all these factions would be pretty cool. 

    Valid point.  There are definitely some that would have some great potential depending on how they were designed.  

  10. Hello to 0 A.D. fans and community members

    As you may have noticed, there have been few recent developer posts on game progress.  With that in mind, I will be taking some time to fill in the community with the first April update.  

    A lot of artwork has been done to incorporate more historically informed, hellenistic architecture into the Ptolemy faction.  This in turn compelled our resident art workaholic Lord Good to introduce a couple new factions into the 0 A.D. roster that have been sorely missed.  

    Many of you might be thinking that the Chinese might be making their debut, but recent posts have shown that there is practically zero, if you’ll pardon the pun, interest in that faction being in the game.  Instead, he has painstakingly created an entirely unique faction to the fray which gives me the pleasure of announcing the first additional faction that will come out this coming alpha: The Thebans.  

    The Thebans are an infantry and cavalry civilisation, famous for their sacred band hoplites and their hegemony of Boeotia.  As this highly demanded faction sounded good to a variety of people, the team has taken the adage that more is more, and as a result, there are a few more civilisations to introduce, each more unique than the next.  (Here we see Thebes, once proud, under the three year long occupation of Sparta after their attempts to maintain Boetian hegemony.)


    Next we have Syracuse, a prominent naval power that made use of some of the most extraordinary inventions of Archimedes. (This image depicts the famous Syracusan port, which served as the stage for a decisive naval victory for the the Peloponnesian League during Athens' disastrous Sicilian campaign.)


    Additionally there is Epirus, employing war elephants and led by the tactical mastermind Pyrrhus.  (See a recreation of the battle of Heraclea, victory so great it has been called 'Pyrrhic.')


    As a rival to Athens in trade and on the seas, Corinth comes into play as credited as the source of triremes and some of the most popular pottery prior to introduction of Athenian black figure ware.  (This image shows the cosmopolitan architecture of this city-state.)


    The Achaean League also makes a showing as the nemesis of Macedonian attempts at conquest.  Philopoemen, often called the “Last of the Greeks,” is one of the iconic heroes that leads this federation.  (Philopoemen, pictured below, was more famous for his cavalry experience, but since he could walk, is represented as an infantry unit instead.)


    On the other side is the Aetolian League.  This collection of city-states was infamous for its actions of piracy and raiding and functioned as a key rival to the above faction.  (This screenshot shows the new and completely unique architectural set that will be used for them.)


    Joining the roster from Asia minor as well is the Attalid successor state.  This nation was centred around the highly defensive metropolis of Pergamum and was a staunch ally of Rome, with its economic and commercial capabilities making it a highly influential regional power.  (Pergamum, shown below, was praised as one of the most beautiful cities, housing landmarks such as the Altar of Zeus, which has yet to be implemented into the game.)


    And coming once again from Peloponnesus is the rival of Sparta, Argos.  The Argives fielded a formidable army with an elite contingent that may have even rivalled the best Spartans and were home to a their own unique form of democracy. (See the Argive hoplites nonchalantly drive away a group of Celtic raiders.)


    I hope that these announcements have made you as excited as me as we embark on a new chapter in 0 A.D.’s history.  Much of this might seem worrying to people as the workload to incorporate this many factions into the game may increase substantially, but the team was able to arrive at a unanimous decision regarding this by removing all non-Hellenic/Hellenistic factions from the game since people have been complaining almost constantly about the overly diverse representation of various people groups.  Thanks for reading, and stay tuned for 0 A.D.’s forthcoming Alpha 24: Xenophobia.

    Tune in next month as 0 A.D. begins introducing the ever popular mechanic of micro-transactions in the form of loot boxes.

    • Haha 10
  11. I feel like a lot of this discussion centres around a key sort of point made at a lecture for GDC about 'cursed designs.'  Essentially games can sometimes have two or more contradictory goals that make the end game experience they plan to make impossible.  The classic RTS game essentially does this by having two components to the game: the economy and the military, both of which require attention to win, but given the realtime nature of the game, this makes it difficult to immerse oneself in.  For instance, a player could be having an intense battle when they realise that they've forgotten about the harvest season.  This oftentimes leads to designers attempting to rectify the issue by putting the focus on one aspect or the other.  Company of Heroes relies purely on area control for the basis of economy while the emphasis remains on a company level with the military.  City-builders represent essentially the opposite camp, letting the economy be the driving force of the game.  

    This sort of dichotomy I would say is essential to recognise for the future of 0 A.D, and depending on which aspect is preferred, the developers should work to streamline the other as much as possible.  Of course it isn't a matter of going with one extreme, but the limitations should be recognised.

  12. I don't get the problem with the infinite queue.  I can't say I'm totally correct here, but the amount of resources that could be collected from a site in Rise of Nations were virtually infinite, which is a reasonable basis for the feature.  

    It's a simple quality of life feature that is optional; the same can be said for things such as rally points.

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  13. Simple sort of idea that I think is worth considering: Having the Theatron building widely available seems like a bit much.  The Spartans were hardly known for their love of drama, and I'd say whenever we do think of Greek playwrights, only Athenians come to mind.  That all said, it would make sense for that structure to be exclusive to Athens and perhaps making its effects more interesting than a simple buff to territory.  As to what it could be, I can't necessarily say.  Maybe it could make workers within x radius work faster; I'd be open to better ideas though.  

    Another structure that I would say is sorely missing from the Athenians is having an academy structure for a variety of technologies.  Maybe there could even be minor yet exclusive ones that reflect philosophical teachings of various schools.  The list goes on.  

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