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Yeah, but that one also seems the most relevant, doesn't it? Anyways... what you mention is 95% possible with just modifying the config.cfg which I have done already. However this currently only works if one would fork 0 A.D. as it's own code base, as (like written above) there is no dedicated mod.cfg yet, and the local.cfg does only overwrite and not replace the default.config. Would be great if those issues could be addressed, as I assume this could be relevant to a variety of potential mods.

Yeah, and build in Sketch-up, with is nice for fast architectional drafting, but not really suitable for creating game meshes... Do you have Sketchup-pro that can export to .obj? Anyways, propably one needs to rebuild all of these as game-compatible meshes in Blender, as Skech-up meshes are made up from a lot of non-connected primitives AFAIK. Same goes for the texturing, which is not on a single UV-layout but rather lots of single textures. What could work is to use these nice meshes as a baking source to make normal-maps from. Here is a nice tutorial for that in Blender: http://joeyspijkers....malmapping.html Textures could be also baked on a properly UV-mapped game ready mesh in a similar fashion (and with some post-processing in GIMP), but are these textures from a CC-by-SA compatible source? Anyways... keep up the great work on these (for the very least they are great concept "drawings"), but for the others... just don't expect these to be in game anytime soon, unless someone with blender skills basically remakes them. Edit: Ahh, just saw in another thread that is is being done for some meshes already... well cool that this seems to work as a collaborative effort!

Ahh your tips about the local.config were right on spot, just by playing around with it I got the basic behavior and view already (if you press F in game to have the camera follow the unit selected). A mod.cfg would be indeed nice to have, I assume it is on the road map? Out commenting or removing the hotkey settings doesn't seem to work though, as it then seems to fall back on the ones from the default.cfg. Even setting them all to one button doesn't seem to work... maybe that is a "bug" that you can't actually remove controls in the local.cfg? Also the main mouse buttons seem to be hard-coded, e.g. not adjustable by the config file? Switching to left_mouse button for selection and attacking would be nice, but there doesn't seem to be an option in the config file. Next I will have a look at the actual code Thanks again for the hints.

Ahh that sounds promising! I also read that hero units are in the game now (my internet is somewhat slow, so I am still on alpha 11)? Do they already have some sort of item inventory and special abilities? So far I didn't have a look at the code itself, but I might find the time tonight. I will keep you updated on any progress I make (no promises on anything).

Well, basically it would need a fixed camera, zoomed in and always following the player as well as player controls that can be triggered by hotkeys and mouse clicks. Just imagine playing Diablo in the 0AD engine and you got the basic idea. Loot and inventory system would have to follow later... would be great if that was possible with scripts too, I gathered already that the GUI is easily scriptable, so from that side there should be no major barriers I guess. Edit: Well the overall idea is to get a somewhat playable prototype for this idea ( http://www.wildfiregames.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=16308 ) to maybe attract a more skilled coder, so that I can focus on the graphic side of things. Besides I need to refresh my JS coding (non-)skills and have some time to kill over the holidays

Hello First of congratulations for the latest release! Anyways... I was wondering if there is an updated scripting reference available for getting into modding the game... So far I only fund the somewhat outdated (?) references on the wiki: http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Scripter%27s_Reference http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Coding_Conventions#JavaScript http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Modding_Guide http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Mod_Layout I would really like to look into modding camera and player behavior for a small ARPG mod prototype, however I am really not a coding genius, so I would rather only touch the JavaScript code... so how feasible is that with the current scripting possibilities?

DOTA isn't the inspiration at all, in fact I don't really like the genre. However one could also implement a game like that on the same basis as a ARPG I guess. @huntredall: Yeah, Titan Quest is a pretty obvious reference, and I think a game based on 0 A.D. would probably look quite similar. "0.A.D. : Ancient Wars" sounds not too bad either

For multiplayer a more agile, action oriented gameplay like Diablo has is a bit more fun then the relatively slow moving games you mentioned. However I agree, it should be feasible to implement easily in Pyrogenesis and then the "agility" can be tweaked to what is the most fun later. Personally I wouldn't mind to stay within the world of 0 A.D. instead of creating something new. That way we would make sure that the projects stay close together and as little work is duplicated as possible. IMHO the best way would be probably to use this as a supplementing story to what is planned for part 2 of 0 A.D. or even to integrate it with that (see my idea above about a hybrid).

Well... they should just implement what they want, I am not their boss But yes, a common, but overall not to complex "vision" can help finding people. Ahh, ok. But well, wouldn't hurt to implement it now, would it? You could even disable it for now if you absolutely want to stick to your plan. Personally I think multiplayer games would benefit from such units too, but as I wrote it's not really needed for 0 A.D. as a game itself. Hmm... but actually your comment got me thinking... how about instead of making the RPG a separate game/mod, it could also be used to turn 0 A.D. in a ARPG/RTS hybrid. In the story mode (aka part 2) one could seamlessly zoom between "strategic mode" (aka regular RTS) and "action mode" where you control your commanding unit like in a ARPG. Obviously that would change the game-play quite a bit, but it would probably make for interesting coop-games (each controls a squad) and would also make 0 A.D. a pretty unique game. Dunno, just an idea... but I would love to play such a game.

Well, obviously I was partly joking... game design document have a certain merit. However at this point without anyone willing to implement the basics so far I don't see much point in having one (yet). About the hero system, well something similar to what is there in Warcraft3, e.g. special unique units, that you can selectively choose skills/powerups and that can carry items that give them certain updates. IMHO I don't think 0 A.D. necessarily would need that feature, but it wouldn't hurt and it would be (if designed with that in mind) a first step toward implementing more RPG like features. However I am not fully aware of what you have already and neither do I know Rise and Fall, but how it would work in 0 A.D. wouldn't matter so much as long as it brings us a step towards the original idea of an ARPG

See? That is why game design documents are bad Would be cool if at least this would come out of this thread as a result. Any takers for implementing it for fun?

Haven't played them, but I imagine something like that would be another nice step towards an ARPG mod, and would also be a nice addition to the base 0 A.D. game... Interested in trying to implement something like that wraitii? You seem to have a good grasp of the A.I. code already, thus working on a RPG compatiple version of Marilyn could be part of such a project?

Exactly, that is why a design document doesn't help us It would need to be implemented step by step, and if we realize along the way that it isn't fun without any supernatural element, we can easily add it. Has anyone thought about implementing a hero system in 0 A.D. already? I think that would be a good first step to base a ARPG on.

The historical examples, if they exists, were probably purely fictional also, e.g. a way of the victor to justify their rule Somehow I am not a big fan of the whole "noble" theme... and it gets difficult to make a nice cooperative game-play compatible story out of it. Anyways...I think it would be possible to make a ARPG without anything supernatural, and still create a pretty fun game. All this discussion is moot though, unless we find a coder willing to implement the core gameplay mechanics first.

Heh, personally I don't think these kind of top down development style approaches work well with open-source, and collaborative games (SumWars IMHO seems to have failed for other reasons)... I am more of a fan of itterative and interest driven development, e.g. do small steps and let people work on what they want to do. Besides these kind of design documents would probably change every half year when new people join, while the core gameplay mechanics that would need to be implemented wouldn't really benefit from it. But since it is fun to speculate about such things (IHMO making such, most of the time overabitious, game design documents is the only thing that come out of many hobbyist projects), we can start making one here. How about as a back-story we take Alexander the Great's conquest of central asia in order to stray not too far from the 0 A.D. base. The player characters could be new recruits of the wast army, or some tag-alongs looking for fame and fortune, and you could have a diverse style of different enemies, weapons and armors from all the different cultures along the way (they got all the way to the western border of the indian subcontinent). For "magic" we could use some of the (back then amazing) chinese technology like rockets and so on (sorry not a history expert, don't kill me if that was later ), and include different strange animals as companions or steeds. Basically we should try to use as much as possible from the base of 0 A.D. so that both projects benefit and development will pick up quickly. As standard character classes there would be obviously the typical fighter... a macedonian army guy? An archer... some (central asian?) hunter tagging along the army to sell his hunt etc.? And a greek philosopher and scientist who travelled to china and came back with a lot of "magic"? Additionally there could be a celtic guy specialized in domesticated animals, or big axes or such etc. Basically the back-story would fall to the person doing the models for that, just keeping in mind that one should be a close range figher, one a archer and one some sort of specialist with many tricks. Cooperative game-play mode could be to defend a small scout base against an enemy attack, maybe even with some simple placement of defense structures included, and waves of enemies attacking. Alternatively one could also use the RTS A.I. somehow for controling the enemies. Story driven gameplay (preferrably also possible to play cooperativly) could be the conquest and some sort of scouting missions, or straying from the main army to get some treasures your heard off, or having to desert your soon to be massacered platoon, etc. but that could be implemented much later. Important would be to keep it mission based, and not one monolithic story, so that "outsiders" can contribute missions, and the game becomes playable quickly. Missions should also have replayability in mind, e.g. that is why I find that collaborative against RTS A.I. idea worth persuing. Ok that's my quick idea, nothing mandatory

Well, for now there isn't so much to be designed, or? Just have a look at the gameplay mechanics of your std. Diablo type game and implement the basics similary. But I am sure we could come up with a more detailed design document collaboratively in this topic, no? Maybe you could elaborate further what you have in mind? It's great that you think you might be willing to to it though, big step forward for this Edit: for now a "hero" implementation like in Warcraft3 would probably the easiest to start... that way 0 A.D. would benefit too and in case this doesn't really get of the ground, it would still not be a wasted effort. And once you have individual unit based inventory and skill advancement, that could be further extended to more RPG like features or could even be the base for another MOBA type mod.

Cool to see some interest! I guess a lot of the additionally needed artwork could be (at first) gotten from other projects, for example SummoningWars (http://sumwars.org/), which is sadly more or less in development deep-freeze due to engine limitations and the lead developer stepping down. For 2D icons etc FLARE ( http://flarerpg.org/ ) might be a good source too (or OpenGameArg.org in general). And one could have a look at World-Forge or such (or collaborate with them) to get some good and suitable player-models and animations (albeit that I can somewhat decently do myself). The next step would be now to find someone who is willing to implement the basics of camera, controls, gui etc in the 0 A.D. engine as a prototype using 0 A.D. assets. Once we have a working protoype, finding more contributors will probably not be much of a deal. I already made a post about this at my "home-base": http://forum.freegamedev.net/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=3326 and also over at the SumWars forum. Perferrably the coder who does the prototype should be someone from this community though who knows the in and outs of the engine already.

RTS and ARPGs are if you look beyond the outer shell actually quite similar, basically you zoom in a bit more, change the controls and add a loot, inventroy and character skills system. So I thought it would be a cool idea to use 0 A.D. as a base for a ARPG like Diablo. Besides the mentioned changes to the code, one would have to have higher quality character models and some simple changes to the AI I guess. Most of the enviromental art of 0 A.D. is good enough to even stand up to a closer zoom, so that would give us a great start. Not sure if caves are possible too with the 0 A.D. engine, but otherwise an outdoor RPG would be sufficient I guess Sadly I am no programmer, but if we would find a team to work on this, I would for sure contribute to the 3D art department. Additionally to that, there could be a cool new cooperative game-play type where you can team up with a few friend and play against an RTS like A.I. to defend your home town or such. I don't think something like that has been done before in ARPGs, so that would be cool to try out. We could also stay true to the 0 A.D. roots and try to make a ARPG without magic in a somewhat accurate historical setting. Obviously not totally realistic, but also a nice change to all the Diablo clones So what do you think? Anyone interested in taking up the task of coding this as a mod?