Lion.Kanzen Posted January 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Genava55 said: juegos de caballos "Práctica de caballería" is a more accurate, but "torneo de caballería" fits as well. Spoiler https://www.labrujulaverde.com/2019/05/hippika-gymnasia-los-torneos-de-caballeria-romanos Spanish reference about what is this. Referencias en español. @Duileoga estamos viendo si las mascaras estarán relacionadas con la hippika gymnasia. Dice Quote Los primeros ejemplos de este tipo de máscaras en el contexto romano se encuentran en las representaciones triunfales que celebran las victorias sobre los enemigos celtíberos o galos. Las pruebas sugieren que inicialmente se fabricaron con materiales orgánicos, como las máscaras de cráneo sobremodeladas o enyesadas que podían adornar monumentos públicos en la Galia prerromana. A partir de finales del siglo I a.C., empezaron a adoptar la forma de cascos totalmente metálicos y se fueron adaptando progresivamente al gusto grecorromano. Por lo tanto, hay que abandonar la idea de que la gimnasia hippika se tomó prestada del desfile ecuestre romano llamado lusus Troiae y que los cascos de máscara formaban parte de una antigua tradición itálica. I'm traslating for duiloga... Edited January 9, 2020 by Lion.Kanzen 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion.Kanzen Posted January 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 this is traditional origin. https://books.google.hn/books?id=ZwzADQAAQBAJ&pg=PT105&lpg=PT105&dq=hippika+gymnasia+++lusus+Troiae&source=bl&ots=EQmZY8aLG7&sig=ACfU3U1-fSpgIOyC35WRXs3LdV-mxNGU9A&hl=es&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjhkfzTwvbmAhUBwlkKHTTODt0Q6AEwAHoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=hippika gymnasia lusus Troiae&f=false But here is some in portuguese. http://www.portugalweb.net/historia/viriatus/Lusitanos_02.asp.htm Quote CASCOS De cobre ou bronze, uns tinham um orifício no fundo, por onde saía o cabelo ou crinas, fig. 6 e outros em bronze, com duas ou três cimeiras "à grega" ornados de crinas ou penas. A estas coberturas de cabeça, geralmente eram acrescentadas uma espécie de viseira, em forma de máscara humana, chamada "bucula", que tinha como objectivo defender a cara, fig. 7. Translation. Helmets Some had a hole in the bottom of the copper or bronze, from where the hair or manes came out, fig. 6 and others in bronze, with two or three "Greek-style" summits decorated with manes or feathers. To these head covers, a kind of visor was usually added, in the form of a human mask, called "bucula", which had the purpose of defending the face, fig. 7. Figura 6 Figura 7 Nothing more than that. The only article about that is that genava said. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted January 9, 2020 Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Lion.Kanzen said: "Práctica de caballería" is a more accurate, but "torneo de caballería" fits as well. Reveal hidden contents https://www.labrujulaverde.com/2019/05/hippika-gymnasia-los-torneos-de-caballeria-romanos Spanish reference about what is this. Referencias en español. @Duileoga estamos viendo si las mascaras estarán relacionadas con la hippika gymnasia. Dice I'm traslating for duiloga... -Buenas y gracias por las traducciones , sería chulísimo ver como una o varias unidades de los lusitanos al subir de rango llevaran esas máscaras tan exóticas . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion.Kanzen Posted January 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 1 minute ago, Duileoga said: -Buenas y gracias por las traducciones , sería chulísimo ver como una o varias unidades de los lusitanos al subir de rango llevaran esas máscaras tan exóticas . Todavía no encontramos pruebas , hay un articulo pero, no podemos acceder a este. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted January 9, 2020 Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 -Buenas , antes hablando con Report reply Genava55 que me comentó que;"También creo que sería una buena idea tener al menos dos facciones. Una centrado en los iberos no indoeuropeos y otra centrado en los indoeuropeos en la península ibérica (celtas / celtíberos / lusitanos). No es posible diferenciar a todos los grupos étnicos en el juego, por lo que generalizar es necesario incluir el máximo." ,y luego de ver este mapa ; Podríamos dejar 2 facciones locales en la península ; "Íberos" y "Celtíberos"(esta segunda ya solo por su nombre deja clara su ubicación e historia), siendo los "Lusitanos"y "Vascones" una segunda opción pero sin desestimarlos . Sería insuficiente históricamente por lo que podríamos crear otra facción a nivel europeo que serían los Celtas/Keltoi/Galátai que llagaban desde Portugal a Turquía(Gálatas) , atravesando toda Europa(puesto que la facción de los "Galos" solo cubre a los celtas de las actuales Francia y Bélgica). a continuación les traigo unos videos de reconstrucción arquitectónica e historia de los "Celtíberos" ; -Del Video; "Poblado Fortificado..."-Mirar los minutos (ver tre los minutos 2:32-3:17)- 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted January 9, 2020 Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 (Menciona herrerías y estructuras únicas además de una posible maravilla para la facción de la que buscaré una reconstrucción o un boceto artístico para ilustrarla. Creo que se podría hacer la arquitectura celtíbera a partir de la referencia arquológicas de las ciudades de Numancia y Segeda.) (Aquí se nos cuenta sobre Historia de las guerras celtíberas , se aprecia arquitectura indígena , armas de los nativos y un rápido vistazo a la ropa femenina en el minuto (7:45) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted January 9, 2020 Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 posdata ; Creo que estos vídeos ayudarán a los artistas y diseñadores gráficos del juego a tener una clara visión sobre su estética arquitectónica y orientarse para crear nuevos edificios del ámbito del juego . Aún falta información y espero aportarla pronto para ustedes. (Disculpen las molestias) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted January 9, 2020 Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 27 minutes ago, Lion.Kanzen said: Todavía no encontramos pruebas , hay un articulo pero, no podemos acceder a este. con suerte se encontrarán otras fuentes aunque sean en otros idiomas.(Tratándose de los Lusitanos , habrá mucha em portugués) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion.Kanzen Posted January 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Duileoga said: con suerte se encontrarán otras fuentes aunque sean en otros idiomas.(Tratándose de los Lusitanos , habrá mucha em portugués) Si igual pocos hablan Portuguese y menos portugués peninsular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted August 19, 2020 Report Share Posted August 19, 2020 La mujer como depositaria de la memoria social en la Hispania prerromana https://www.despertaferro-ediciones.com/2020/la-mujer-como-depositaria-de-la-memoria-social-en-la-hispania-prerromana/ Celtíberos cortadores de cabezas https://www.despertaferro-ediciones.com/2019/celtiberos-cortadores-de-cabezas/ Los celtíberos y la guerra https://celtiberiahistorica.es/es/celtiberia/los-celtiberos-y-la-guerra Las saunas castreñas https://www.castrosdeasturias.es/castros/44/41/14/.-las-saunas-castreas Charlas sobre las saunas de la Edad del Hierro en Cedeira https://www.castrosdeasturias.es/noticias/418/charlas-sobre-las-saunas-de-la-edad-del-hierro-en-cedeira La guerra en la Gallaecia antigua: del guerrero tribal al soldado imperial https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/307a/848376274ae3048b2624f8715432fa0c3823.pdf Descubren una “sauna” de la Edad del Hierro casi intacta https://www.historiaespanaymundo.com/secciones/made-in-spain/descubren-sauna-edad-del-hierro-casi-intacta https://www.facebook.com/caminante.de.la.historia.mas.recondita/posts/1778084445648642?__cft__[0]=AZWccRmn4BhWR8CsJwLX2Bn2OS8LQF34xMKgwV1aOhCC_8MBDL9Hg3JIrim5i1fIEkrYNhOg_E-bPxLpqn8mkFuR2bRXT1LWh9kjlm5iuqusII_D53jWAWsZAbSZ4fNqcWltojoHO4gpE_iVqStnGPiPr_4fBnjHsElXqgU3ZwgOgrmtm-yEMyuc54K8xV6VLMA%26__tn__=,O,P-R 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted August 19, 2020 Report Share Posted August 19, 2020 For those reading Spanish fluently, it seems I found a detailed article about sauna in NW Hispano-Celtic cultures: https://revistas.unav.edu/index.php/cuadernos-de-arqueologia/article/download/27839/23445 Bonus: 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted August 20, 2020 Report Share Posted August 20, 2020 Does Desperta Ferro have an English language publication? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted August 21, 2020 Report Share Posted August 21, 2020 On 12/31/2018 at 11:11 AM, LordGood said: The Numentia reconstructions are the basis for much of the current Iberian faction's thatched buildings, It's nice that a new building would fit in, but what new elements would be added? Ritual sauna as a building? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimate Aurelian Posted August 21, 2020 Report Share Posted August 21, 2020 2 hours ago, Genava55 said: Ritual sauna as a building? Maybe it could heal units garrisoned inside it? Like CC but much faster heal rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted September 5, 2020 Report Share Posted September 5, 2020 https://www.facebook.com/CastilDeGriegos/posts/2249602671745226 https://www.facebook.com/CastilDeGriegos/posts/2249573321748161 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted September 7, 2020 Report Share Posted September 7, 2020 (edited) On 21/08/2020 at 7:51 PM, Ultimate Aurelian said: Maybe it could heal units garrisoned inside it? Like CC but much faster heal rate. It was more about the current situation with the Iberians mixing references from different cultures and peoples. Notably the Iberians have Viriathus as a hero. I suggested in the past either to make at least two different civs or to more clearly distinguish the other peoples in the Iberian roster and building tree. Edit: Different approaches to the problem Edited January 17, 2021 by Genava55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted September 7, 2020 Report Share Posted September 7, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Genava55 said: It was more about the current situation with the Iberians mixing references from different cultures and peoples. Notably the Iberians have Viriathus as a hero. I suggested in the past either to make at least two different civs or to more clearly distinguish the other peoples in the Iberian roster and building tree. I suggest we use recently committed Hero Selection code to differentiate some civs. While non-branching civs use the code to choose hero, branching civs use it to choose a branch, each with 1 or 2 possible heroes. Iberians are the best example for branching for sure (Iberians, Celt-Iberians, Lusitanians). I would preferrrrr a separate civ entirely for the Lusitanians, but the code is now there for branching. There's a lot of ways to present this, and not every civ needs to do it the same way. For instance, in DE the Spartans branch slightly when you choose Cleomenes III as your hero. Choosing him removes hoplites and replaces them with phalangites and he unlocks walls. So, for Iberians if you choose Variathus it could swap in a different building set and a slightly different unit roster. Edited September 7, 2020 by wowgetoffyourcellphone 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lopess Posted September 10, 2020 Report Share Posted September 10, 2020 I want to create a mini mod on github for the Lusitanos, just to play with this idea a little, something as if it was done initially between the Britons and the Gauls (using almost everything the same with occasional changes). So what would be the different units that the Lusitanos would have? Would it have a special structure? And which icon would it be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted September 12, 2020 Report Share Posted September 12, 2020 On 8/19/2020 at 9:27 PM, Genava55 said: For those reading Spanish fluently, it seems I found a detailed article about sauna in NW Hispano-Celtic cultures: https://revistas.unav.edu/index.php/cuadernos-de-arqueologia/article/download/27839/23445 Bonus: Buenas , estuve investigando ; Encontré el aspecto de esas saunas , ubicadas entre las culturas Lusitanas y Galaica (celta) , son unas reconstrucciones de fuentes similares a las que usted mencionó . *Disculpen las molestias. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowgetoffyourcellphone Posted September 12, 2020 Report Share Posted September 12, 2020 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted September 22, 2020 Report Share Posted September 22, 2020 (edited) @Lopess @Duileoga Sadly I don't have the time to give advices on a new mini-faction, I just got a new job and I am really busy for the following months. Furthermore I am already helping Europa Barbarorum's team, which is time-consuming. In addition, Spanish is not my mother tongue and I am still learning it. Finally, I don't know enough the Iberian peninsula to rely on memory. So basically I could help mostly by relying on reading, for which I am not in the best position in this context. In the future, I can ask Trarco if he wants to participate here. I can simply remember you that the Iberian peninsula during the iron age is a quite diverse place. - There are non-indo-european cultures, three groups can be schematized: the Iberians, the Palaeo-Basques/Aquitanians, the Turdetani. The latter being heavily influenced by Punic civilization. - A growing Celtic presence, mostly driven by the Celtiberians. Their material culture is heavily spreading among the Vaccaei, the Vettones and the Gallaeci. - Another indo-european remaining presence, associated to the Lusitanians and probably also to the Gallaeci and the Vettones. Either it is an older Celtic culture from the Bronze Age, or a sister branch of the Celtic languages and cultures. They share heavy similarities with the Celts (notably with the worship of Epona, Endovelicus, Lugus) but their language suggests some important differences. The massive difference in the material culture is related to the culture of the castros or castreña: https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultura_castreña https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castro_culture You can find a lot of resources on the FB page of Celtiberia I already gave above, but also here in English: https://dc.uwm.edu/ekeltoi/ There is an audio podcast at the end of this table of contents: https://www.despertaferro-ediciones.com/revistas/numero/arqueologia-historia-25-celtiberos/ There are a bunch of books you can find on library genesis: Los pueblos prerromanos de la península Ibérica Los celtiberos Prehistoria y protohistoria de la Península Ibérica There are some academic publication on the Western people of the peninsula: LAS COMUNIDADES DE LA EDAD DEL HIERRO EN EL OCCIDENTE DE LA MESETA “¿Guerreros o bandoleros? Las formas de combate de los pueblos de la Meseta Occidental a partir del armamento de los yacimientos abulenses (ss. V-I a.C.) Finding resources on the Vettones is quite easy: https://www.academia.edu/2981562/Nuestros_ancestros_los_vettones https://www.academia.edu/2053713/Los_Vettones_Arqueología_de_un_pueblo_protohistórico Edit: https://www.facebook.com/TANITdivulgacion/posts/1755140541304108 https://www.facebook.com/TANITdivulgacion Edited October 31, 2020 by Genava55 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted September 22, 2020 Report Share Posted September 22, 2020 On 9/10/2020 at 11:25 PM, Lopess said: I want to create a mini mod on github for the Lusitanos, just to play with this idea a little, something as if it was done initially between the Britons and the Gauls (using almost everything the same with occasional changes). So what would be the different units that the Lusitanos would have? Would it have a special structure? And which icon would it be? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted September 22, 2020 Report Share Posted September 22, 2020 So there are evidences for spearmen, swordsmen, javelineers, light cavalry, heavy cavalry, slingers. The most common symbol for the Lusitanians is the lunula: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lusitanians#/media/File:Lúnula_lusitana_de_Chão_de_Lamas_(M.A.N._28589)_01.jpg 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duileoga Posted October 1, 2020 Report Share Posted October 1, 2020 Buenas ; Estoy trabajando con @Lopess (a quien le doy las gracias )para desarrollar los "Lusitanos" y aquí les traigo un boceto de las posibles unidades y estructuras para ellos; Estructuras ; Edificios comunes (15); (Español);-----------------------------------------------(original) 1.Centro cívico;------------------------------------------( Trebopala) 2.casas;--------------------------------------------------(Trebo ) 3.Almacén;-----------------------------------------------( ... ) 4.Alquería;-----------------------------------------------( Treb harase ) 5.Corral;-------------------------------------------------( ... ) 1.Oveja;---------------(Oilam ) 2.Cerdo;---------------(Porcom ) 3.Cabra;---------------( Comaiam ) 4.Gallo;----------------(Kulyakos) 5.Toro;----------------(Taurom ) 6.Vaca;----------------( Bandue ) 7. Cordero ;----------(Angom) 6.Torre de defensa ;----------------------------------------(... ) 7.Cuartel;---------------------------------------------------( Treb coriam ) 8.Herrería;--------------------------------------------------( ...) 9.Templo;---------------------------------------------------(Treb ailatio ) 10.Muralla;--------------------------------------------------( ...) 11.Huerto;--------------------------------------------------(Olca ) 12.Mercado;------------------------------------------------( ... ) 13.Puerto;--------------------------------------------------( ...) 14.Fortaleza;-----------------------------------------------(Briga ) 15.Torreta de defensa;--------------------------------------(...) Puerta;----------------------------------------------------(Gab) Edificios especiales (5) 1."Maravilla" ;/¿?/;-------------------------------------------(...) 2."Castro mercenario";-----------------------------------(Bria coria ) 3."Monumento reverencial";------------------------------(Crougia Deiwos ) 4."Sauna";------------------------------------------------(Bormano) Unidades ;(27) (Español);-----------------------------------------------(original) Infantería ;(4) (Reclutados en ;"cuarteles") 1. Lancero raso ;---------------------------------------------( Gestikapoinan ) 2. Hondero ;-------------------------------------------------( Trokalobutiam ) 3. Espadachín ;-----------------------------------------------( Caetranan ) 4. Escaramuzador raso ;-------------------------------------( Iovaman ) (Reclutados en ;"cuarteles "y "centro urbano") 1. Lancero ;--------------------------------------------------( Gestikapoinann ) 2. Hondero ;--------------------------------------------------(Trokalobutiamm ) Infantería de élite ;(2) (Reclutados en ;" fortaleza" ) 1. Lancero de élite ;------------------------------------------(Scortamareva) 2. Escaramuzador ;-------------------------------------------(Clona tekonac ) Infantería Campeona;(1) (Reclutados en ;" fortaleza " ) 1. Campeón;---------------------------------------------------( Ambakaro ) Infantería (mercenaria); (3) (Reclutados en ;" castro mercenario " ) 1. Mercenario Conii ;------------------------------------------(... arimos ) 2. Mercenario Túrdulo ;----------------------------------------( ...arimos ) 3. Mercenario Vetón ;------------------------------------------( ... arimos) Caballería;(2) (Reclutados en ;"cuarteles " ) 1. Lancero ;----------------------------------------------------( Epones Pretre ) 2. Escaramuzador ;--------------------------------------------( Epones Aeiste ) (Reclutados en ;" Cuarteles"y "centro urbano") 1. Escaramuzador ;--------------------------------------------( Epones Aeiste ) Caballería de élite;(2) (Reclutados en ;" fortaleza " ) 1. lancero ;----------------------------------------------------( Ambakaro Epones ) 2. Escaramuzador ;---------------------------------------------( Katuvaram ) Caballería mercenaria ;(2) (Reclutados en ;" castro mercenario " ) 1. Caballería Galaica ;---------------------------------------------(... arimos ) 2. Caballería Astures ;--------------------------------------------( ... arimos ) 3.Caballería Vetona ;----------------------------------------------(... arimos) Civiles;(3) (Reclutados en ;" centro urbano") 1. Mujer;------------------------------------------------------------(Petanim) (Reclutados en ;"Mercado ") 2. Comerciante;----------------------------------------------------(... ) (Reclutados en ;"Templo ") 3. Sacerdote;-------------------------------------------------------( Ampilua ) Armas de asedio;(1) (Reclutados en ;" fortaleza") 1.Ariete;--------------------------------------------------------------(... ) Navíos mercenarios ;(3) (Reclutados en ;" Puerto") 1.Balsa pesquera galaica;-------------------------------------------(...) 2.Navío mercante fenicio;------------------------------------------(... ) 3.Navío militar cartaginés ;-----------------------------------------( ...) Héroes ;(3-5) (Reclutados en ;"Fortaleza ") 1.Viriato ;----------------------------------------(Viriato ) 1.Púnico ;---------------------------------------(Apimano) 3.Cauceno;--------------------------------------(Kaikainos ) (invadió áfrica) (Para la "IA" no encontré suficientes jefes lusitanos importantes , por eso creo que sería mejor poner nombres de tribus) (Sigo buscando información y cualquier ayuda o corrección es bien recibida ) Disculpen las molestias* 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genava55 Posted January 17, 2021 Report Share Posted January 17, 2021 LOS CASTROS Y LAS GUERRAS LUSITANAS CAP3 El Legado Celta en España~Canal Historia España. El Legado Celta de Galicia | Documental Los pueblos celtas en la península ibérica | Gonzalo Ruiz Zapatero Castros de la Edad de Hierro en el área noroccidental(...) La indumentaria de la Edad del Hierro en la Península Ibérica PUEBLOS GUERREROS DE NAVARRA - Guía arqueológica de los castros la Edad del Hierro de Navarra. Castro Celtibérico de CASTIL DE GRIEGOS. Checa (Guadalajara) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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