badosu Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 Less is more. We need to prioritize gameplay affecting ui. What a unit builds is irrelevant. Armor/dmg/ups much more so. You will never open a window while taking engagements, using the fixed panel is much better Tooltips clutter the ui and are almost never worth it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 0ad ui is woefully inefficient at displaying relevant info, decluttering UI. I'd be interested in collaborating on that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 I think having the upgrades in there visible like that somehow might be useful 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 10 minutes ago, badosu said: Less is more. We need to prioritize gameplay affecting ui. What a unit builds is irrelevant. Armor/dmg/ups much more so. I agree, that's why I think what a unit builds and historic information should be hidden, nevertheless the list of what a unit builds should be replaced with icons like @wowgetoffyourcellphone said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 14 minutes ago, badosu said: You will never open a window while taking engagements, using the fixed panel is much better If you're playing against KI offline it's quite useful since the game pauses anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 Imo should be taken off. A player can read history on the civ list, can see what a unit builds by looking at the build panel (which is in serious need of a rework imo) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 IDK that's my opinion with my biases. A think the ui is like this due to artifacts in development, 'good enough'. Similar to maps and balance. At some point one needs to refine the game with gameplay in mind (as it is being done recently by borg and néscio wrt balance for example) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, badosu said: can see what a unit builds by looking at the build panel true though but I think some historic information is what makes this game special 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 I agree, but 'show don't tell'. A more optimized ui could be an option if this is now what wfg desires. That's why I prefer making mods, design by committee without a clear direction or stakeholder only goes so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 Nevertheless. If one makes a mockup that's deemed as an improvement, with assets provided, to most I'd be more than happy to collaborate 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 nice, how could i be of help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 That mockup looks like a good first step. What's specifically you want to improve? That window? That can contain the tabs as you outlined. We would have to change the fixed central panel stats to keep consistency. Would you be up to make a similar mockup for that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 Also. The icons: are there icons we can (re)use for each stat or would we require new assets? For a first step, choosing icons we can use as placeholder work of help. E.g. defensive stance icon as armor etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 Pierce armour could be a shield defending an arrow, crush armour a shield defending a mace etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 i just used random icons from the internet, merged and modified them. In what size and file type do you need them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 We need open source stuff. We can't use anything copyrighted in vanilla. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 yes i'm aware, would be used as a placeholder at first anyway 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 Yeah, given we have a specific art theme and style (e.g. delenda est hero rework not chosen to be upstreamed) we would first use already existing icons and then replace them when/if fitting artwork is produced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 As for dimensions/format, same as those icons. I can't get an example atm but should be easy to find in the 0ad public mod assets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) The icons themselves are not hugely important for implementation (but feasibility to produce them is a blocker). I liked the mockup format you made. Would you be able to produce something similar for the central panel (the one next to the minimap when you select a unit)? I reckon the reduced size should make it a bit more challenging, but improvements in that UI element would be really substantial for players QoL. Edited January 6, 2021 by badosu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) I think attack/armour/speed (maybe gather rate, loot) could be the only stats with improved readability on that panel. More detailed information can be brought up right clicking. Hp and xp/rank being already shown in the thumbnail already Edited January 6, 2021 by badosu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) attack defence health Speed Status effects (maybe there are already existing icons?) all other are already in the game, although I would like to have the "gather" icons slightly changed from the "loot" icons (e.g. add an axe for wood or hammer for stone like in the mockup) they are taken from Maxicons on thenounproject and are under creative commons, i could give the link the third defence one is not good but i didnt find a better one fast should i modify them or make them colourful? i hope this is helpful, let me know Edited January 6, 2021 by nifa 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifa Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 you mean this? I think it's already quite filled, so one would have to make more space although the icons would already save space. One could also make it only for Champions at the space where the buildings are fyi this is how it looks in Cossacks: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan` Posted January 7, 2021 Report Share Posted January 7, 2021 2 hours ago, badosu said: The icons themselves are not hugely important for implementation (but feasibility to produce them is a blocker). Maybe I could give a hand at some point. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badosu Posted January 7, 2021 Report Share Posted January 7, 2021 1 hour ago, nifa said: should i modify them or make them colourful? i hope this is helpful, let me know This looks great for now, thanks! 1 hour ago, nifa said: I think it's already quite filled, so one would have to make more space although the icons would already save space. Just look at that panel and see how much of the space is filled with stuff you (almost) never use. For one the specific name can be dropped. The generic should be replaced with a simple name (eg spearman) imo. The action buttons, apart from looking not great, could be moved somewhere else or dropped for now while we iterate. The ownership section, as good as it looks, could be tightened/moved/reworked (perhaps below the health bar?). The gathered res can be condensated and integrated to the new icon format. Anyway, these are some ideas, but you can see how much we already can do. Remember we have full control of the ui so we can resize the thumbnail, increase width, reuse other panels. For example the panel on the left is empty (I'm afk so can't test) from what I remember. It's used to show garrisoned units and trying bell but it's totally useless for unit selection. One could be imaginative on how to use that real estate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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