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MontezumaRevenge

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Posts posted by MontezumaRevenge

  1. 2 hours ago, nwtour said:

    Как по мне и вариант "Павлин обыкновенный" и Pavo cristatus - правильные для этого поля. То есть переводчик решает какой стилистики придерживаться.

    Spoiler

    Как по мне, то дважды писать по-русски практически одно и то же - это тавтология. Латинские названия, если я правильно понимаю, призваны познакомить игрока с латинским названием, иначе зачем они тогда вообще нужны? Во вторых:

    2 hours ago, nwtour said:

    игра становится более доступна для людей которые впринципе английские буквы не знают.

    Spoiler

    На сколько я понимаю, всё-таки PEGI для подобных игр составляет 12-13 лет... Это как бы предполагает, что человек владеет школьной программой 6-7-го классов, а значит встречался и с английским, и с биологией... Насчёт китайского языка, то я думаю, что Китай не такая уж и дремучая страна, чтобы транслитерировать латинские буквы фауны на китайский или даже в "палладию". Нонсенс! Мне кажется, что комбинирование латинского названия, которым прекрасно пользуются и в России, и в Китае, вместе с местным обычным названием - более грамотный шаг, нежели коверкать латынь до "фонетического" суржика. А если вам нужно указать, что "этот павлин - обычный", то лучше это сделать в строке GenericName, а не занимать позицию, как мне кажется, для латинского международно понятного названия. Если моя логика права, то латинские названия добавлены как раз для того, чтобы служить универсальным названием, по которому можно ориентироваться, так как латинские названия - международный стандарт, понятный всем биологам и прочим. По той же логике ваша "ксантория" из словаря СССР - это GenericName, а "xanthoria" остаётся на латыни как - SpecificName. Да хоть медицинские препараты возьмите: где бы их не произвели, грамотные фармацевты состав пишут на латыни. Никто не пишет воду как "аква" русскими буквами. Латинское название служит как раз для того, чтобы однозначно определять что перед вами, а русское - понять предмет "в общем". Дело в том, что это даже не вопрос "стиля и предпочтения". Да, мы транскрибируем национальные названия городских центров, горожан и т. д, но юниты "гайи" с их латинскими названиями - это не часть нации Римляне, чтобы их латинские наименования транскрибировать в русский или китайский.

     

  2. 13 hours ago, nwtour said:

    There is no standard. In different cultures, geographical, historical and biological terms may differ.

    Localization is the process of bringing to the local culture, and not about unification

    U kidding me?

    13 hours ago, nwtour said:

    For example: If in the game the Greek center is called "ἀγορά" - those who speak only English will be unhappy. They don’t need such a standard if it’s impossible to read

    I don't meant it at all...

    13 hours ago, nwtour said:

    I have a Russian encyclopeia open - there is 50 percent Latin transliteration.

    I live at Russia and it's to hard to explain this huge difference between local bio-name and russificated latin names of bio-groups. But no one in Russia call peakok as "PAVO CRISTATUS" in common life LOL!

    13 hours ago, nwtour said:

    Machine translation is added by certain people - their nicknames are on the right in the interface.

    Ok! Fine! If you give me ability to unblock blocked translations I would review and fix at least at Russian and Ukrainian languages. Because there also small mistakes at Edes Iovis translated at Rus as Lovis, egyptian words etc. My Transifex account name is Apheidas.

  3. 13 minutes ago, nwtour said:

    @MontezumaRevenge
    The game has the concept of "SpecificName" - for plants this is the Latin language, for Greek buildings this is the Greek name in the English alphabet, for Egyptian buildings these are names with ancient Egyptian symbols

     

    The game does not separate them. The translator decides how to write correctly in the current language. You propose to completely disable the translation of "SpecificName" - IMHO this is a bad option. You can join the ranks of translators and replace incorrect transliterations in transiflex.

    Manually? That is useless, because I noticed, that my manual corrections were "rollback" into dumb-machine translation at every game text update. I think, if you want to make right multylingual game, you should order one and only one translator such it did Wesnoth devs. Translator who will follow some one style and standard. That is all I can say. But why you can't separate modern latin animal names at it's own group - that is really mystery... May be devs really should follow Age of Empires 2 way and do not play with ancient dead languages without any professors at team or consultation???

  4. 19 minutes ago, nwtour said:

    But for each plant there is a Russian-language name

    Russian language names looks very similar to latin but they have typical russian endings such ксантория. They not save latin endings as phoneme. "Я" - it's not "u" like at word "umbrella" it's "ya". And latin ending "-ae" for plural is not save in mirror-transcryption, changing it into deep "ee" like at "wheel" but more deeper - "ы". Usually russian language names are not 100% mirror of latin word in russian letters. 95%, 99% but not 100% of phonetical, so even plant-names should not be considered as blind latin "tracing paper" transcryption. Translators of each particular language can decide whether to copy the name of the Latin, transliterate or translate into the local scientific name, but it still profanation practice, because so-called "local scientific name" already have it's own place under latin name.

  5. 39 minutes ago, nwtour said:

    Please provide a link that this is incorrect practice

    The biological latin names are not simple "latin words". Even medicine write composition using non changeble latin words. It even follows from the logic of the game, this name falls out of the context of buildings and units, and for all nations it is written in Latin as an animal genus, taxon, and so on. What references can there be if no one translates biological Latin letter by letter? It even looks like a collective farm. Example: royal pelargonium (Regal Pelargonium). It never occurs to anyone in delirium, except for illiterate aunts, to write it as "рэгал пеларгониум". There is no need to confuse ancient Latin names with modern biological names in Latin - this is the level of the collective farm "70 years without light." On Academician, most of the words are ancient names, and not taxones or genus. Even the very same "tuberculosis - туберкулёз" no one writes as "туберкулёсис", besides, the Russian name is already present. Why even distorted to enter? All I suggest is to remove all these "кристатусы" and "локсодонты африканусы", leaving the Latin name at the top and the Russian normal name at the bottom. You don't want to understand me at all. No one takes words like Loxodonta Africanus from an elephant in square brackets of transcription, but translates with such a meaning as if it were Russian in itself and almost dictionary word. If you leave it in the game, it will be a complete "collective farm".

     

    Spoiler

    Даже исходя из логики игры, эти названия выпадают из контекста зданий и юнитов, и для всех наций написаны на латыни как род животного, таксон и так далее. Какие тут могут быть ссылки, если никто не переводит биологическую латынь побуквенно? Это выглядит даже по-колхозному. Пример: пеларгония королевская (Regal Pelargonium). Никому в бреду не приходит в голову, кроме безграмотных тёток, написать это как "рэгал пеларгониум". Не надо смешивать античные латинские названия с современными биологическими названиями на латыни - это уровень колхоза "70 лет без света". На Академике большая часть слов - это античные имена и названия, а не таксоны и рода. Даже тот самый "tuberculosis — туберкулёз" никто не пишет как "туберкулёсис", к тому же русское название уже в наличие присутствует. Зачем ещё коверканое вписывать? Всё, что я предлагаю - удалить все эти "кристатусы" и "локсодонта африканусы", оставив латинское название вверху и русское нормальное название внизу. Вы меня совершенно не хотите понимать. Слова как Локсодонта Африканус у слона никто не берёт в квадратные скобки транскрипции, а переводит с таким смыслом, будто оно вовсе само по себе русское и чуть ли не словарное. Если так и оставить в игре - это будет колхоз чистой воды.

     

  6. 14 minutes ago, Stan` said:

    Well they keep requesting us to give us phonetic readings so they can translate it to their language scripts.

     

    But this is incorrect practice... No one scientific encyclopedia was split latin names into phonetic... Because that is the sense of latin name... You can phoneticaly translate Roman units and buildings because every nation at 0 A.D. have their own language but you should not corrupt biological terms. Turn biological latin names into chinese "phonetic" - it's comlete profanation!

    screenshot0001.png.3ed30a599cb873787767746e5af1fc8b.png

    Паво кристатус - should be Pavo cristatus. Because player allready know that is a peacok when he read (Павлин).

  7. 4 minutes ago, Stan` said:

    That's assuming that Russian speaking people, and people speaking CJK languages can read latin in its original script. It's unfair to them. 

     

    Not understand... Russian or CJK players would read both names - russian or CJK name + latin name. All fair.

    I don't know any scientific literature where latin names were transcripted... Everywhere were: (local name) + (latin name writted by latin).

    Example:

    https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Бурчеллова_зебра

    https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/平原斑馬

  8. 2 hours ago, Stan` said:

    Sadly we have to let translators translate them, for non latin fonts, e.g Chinese, Japanese and Korean.

    What you mean? For example: we have name Zebra at animal name and we have Equus quagga as latin name at english translation. So, correctly will be if word "Zebra" would be translated, but "Equus quagga" will be constant for every languages.

    Incorrect variant:

    EN: Zebra / Equus quagga

    RU: Зебра / Эквус квагга

    GR: Ζέβρα / Eκυυσ κυαγγα

    ZH: 斑馬 / 斑驢

     

    Correct variant:

    EN: Zebra / ⋒ Equus quagga

    RU: Зебра / Equus quagga

    GR: Ζέβρα / Equus quagga

    ZH: 斑馬 / ⋒ Equus quagga

  9. I noticed that some language packs not just translate latin animal names but also trying to [transcript]. I think both methods are huge mistakes. Can you please erase current mistranslation and lock latin names (only latin names) for fauna at all languages at both columns to prevent subsequent wrong transcription?

  10. 12 minutes ago, Stan` said:

    We're not at that level of imprecision, though.

    One of the most important reason for me to play 0 A.D. and AoE2 is that "non-target" shooting system. Projectiles could make more damage, but they should not be infinity. You can make some scale such "mana" but with arrows quantity, which would be rechargable near barracks or other military buildings. Or you can use RoN:RoL system with mobile support ammo carts/units with recharging aura. In DE mod as I remember, units are able to switch their weapons. Ranged units with no projectiles may switch into military until they didn't recharge their arrows etc.

  11. 17 minutes ago, wowgetoffyourcellphone said:

    We can change them to green crosses. :) 

    Also the "Red Cross"©®™:rolleyes: as medical symbol appears at priest's "healing circle" ornament, when player's colour is red. That's why I offer "herbal" style to show healing borders. My philosophy is simple - if you make ancient-based game, you should use ancient-based design style.:greek: At least, we can try to search for original ancient medical symbols at museum catalogue... Maybe some Bowl of Hygieia with the snake? Or that panax leaves? Anyway, I can't remember any controversial symbols at other popular RTSes. Age of Empires franchise? Na-ah... WCIII? Not sure...

  12. 13 hours ago, Grapjas said:

    I suppose you could make this a mod for personal use if you want to / are able to.

    Well, speaking honestly, I've just suddenly found old news at different game forums about ICRC's pretensions to "Prison Architect" developers for using their "copyrighted" symbol. Therefore, I decided to lightly offer an idea with a reserve for the future. I just noticed, that 0 A.D. tries to avoid copyright issues...

    https://www.pcgamer.com/how-the-prison-architect-developers-broke-the-geneva-conventions/

    Also, my offered idea tries to prevent possible pharmaceutical and apothecary "green cross issues" in the future.

  13. On 12/12/2021 at 6:57 PM, alre said:

    well techically when you are under siege in 0 AD, you use arrows too. all fortification shoot arrows.

    I must admit that is very odd... The non-archers civilizations shoot arrows from buildings. Devs, you are really should do something with that inconsistency. It's remind me Skyrim shooting with riekling spears from bow.

    Spoiler

     

     

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