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m7600

civ: Zimbabweans

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According to wikipedia: "The architecture of Zimbabwe is composed of three architectural types: the Hill Complex, the Valley Complex, and the Great Enclosure.[1] Both traditional and colonial architectures have influenced the history and culture of the country.[2] However, post-1954 buildings are mainly inspired by pre-colonial, traditional architecture,[1] especially Great Zimbabwe–inspired structures such as the Kingdom Hotel, Harare international airport, and the National Heroes' Acre.[2]"


With that in mind, here are some traditional houses.

house_01.jpg

house_02.jpg

house_03.jpg

house_04.jpg

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Whoa, those concepts are actually really good. The person who made them clearly knows what he/she is doing. The wonder seems to be based on Khami.

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16 minutes ago, m7600 said:

Whoa, those concepts are actually really good. The person who made them clearly knows what he/she is doing. The wonder seems to be based on Khami.

The boulders  on Khami are intriguing, i wonder if they were kept there on some ceremonial/decorative purpose rather than just left lying around.

This thread may be of interest  (Page i am linking has some images of Zimbabwe and Ethiopia):

https://historum.com/threads/the-diversity-of-early-african-architecture-ruins-thread.58840/page-25

 

Edited by Ultimate Aurelian
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@Ultimate Aurelian Very cool thread. Some of the links to the images are broken, especially on the first pages, but there is a lot of cool stuff still there. This image for example, from a book called "Life at Great Zimbabwe" if I understood correctly. I'll see if I can find a copy of that book.

img_0889.jpg

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1 hour ago, Ultimate Aurelian said:

The boulders  on Khami are intriguing, i wonder if they were kept there on some ceremonial/decorative purpose rather than just left lying around.

 

No idea, but in the first image below, the artist incorporated them into a depiction of a ceremony.
 

064551f76f0334da9e9ae2ab8356eab3.png

4c11aad0-9ec0-43ec-9180-7c494ec8afe6.jpg

archaeology-010.jpg

qa1c04f39.jpg

ZIMBABWE.jpg

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Some passages from Duarte Barbosa describing Mutapa  (After Zimbabwe but still useful since it is one of the first historical accounts of the region):

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/38253/38253-h/38253-h.htm#FNanchor_7_7

Quote

On entering within this country of Sofala, there is the kingdom of Benamatapa, which is very large and peopled by Gentiles, whom the Moors call Cafers. These are brown men, who go bare, but covered from the waist downwards with coloured stuffs, or skins of wild animals; and the persons most in honour among them wear some of the tails of the skin behind them, which go trailing on the ground for state and show, and they make bounds and movements of their bodies, by which they make these tails wag on either side of them. They carry swords in scabbards of wood bound with gold or other metals, and they wear them on the left hand side as we do, in sashes of coloured stuffs, which they make for this purpose with four or five knots, and their tassels hanging down, like gentlemen; and in their hands azagayes, and others carry bows and arrows: it must be[7] mentioned that the bows are of middle size, and the iron points of the arrows are very large and well wrought. They are men of war, and some of them are merchants: their women go naked as long as they are girls, only covering their middles with cotton cloths, and when they are married and have children, they wear other cloths over their breasts.

Quote

Leaving Sofala for the interior of the country, at xv days journey from it, there is a large town of Gentiles, which is called Zinbaoch; and it has houses of wood and straw, in which town the King of Benamatapa frequently dwells, and from there to the city of Benamatapa there are six days journey, and the road goes from Sofala, inland, towards the Cape of Good Hope. And in the said Benamatapa, which is a very large town, the king is used to make his longest residence; and it is thence that the merchants bring to Sofala the gold which they sell to the Moors without weighing it, for coloured stuffs and beads of Cambay, which are much used and valued amongst them; and the people of this city of Benamatapa say that this gold comes from still further off towards the Cape of Good Hope, from another kingdom subject to this king of Benamatapa, who is a great lord, and holds many other kings as his subjects, and many other lands, which extend far inland, both towards the Cape of Good Hope and towards Mozambich. And in this town he is each day served with large presents, which the kings and lords, his subjects, send to him; and when they bring them, they carry them bareheaded through all the city, until they arrive at the palace, from whence the king sees them come from a window, and he orders them to be taken up from there, and the bearers do not see him, but only hear his words; and afterwards, he bids them call the persons who[8] have brought these presents, and he dismisses them. This king constantly takes with him into the field a captain, whom they call Sono, with a great quantity of men-at-arms, and amongst them they bring six thousand women, who also bear arms and fight. With these forces he goes about subduing and pacifying whatever kings rise up or desire to revolt. The said king of Benamatapa sends, each year, many honourable persons throughout his kingdoms to all the towns and lordships, to give them new regulations, so that all may do them obeisance, which is in this manner: each one of the envoys comes to a town, and bids the people extinguish all the fires that there are in it; and after they have been put out, all the inhabitants go to this man who has been sent as commissary, to get fresh fire from him in sign of subjection and obedience; and, whoever should not do this is held as a rebel, and the king immediately sends the number of people that are necessary to destroy him, and these pass through all the towns at their expense: their rations are meat, rice, and oil of sesame.[10]

So they could have swordsman.

On another passage they say Mutapa bought cloth from Arabic merchants; i think it's possible Zimbabwe did  as well (They found foreign articles like a chinese teapot in the region; and cloth rarely leaves physical evidence since it deteriorates with time).

Edited by Ultimate Aurelian
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For the roster, in addition to spearmen, archers, and swordsmen, I'm thinking there could be infantry slingers. In fact, maybe even champion slingers (is there a champion slinger unit in the main game? I don't remember any civ having one).

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13 minutes ago, m7600 said:

For the roster, in addition to spearmen, archers, and swordsmen, I'm thinking there could be infantry slingers. In fact, maybe even champion slingers (is there a champion slinger unit in the main game? I don't remember any civ having one).

My idea for roster was something like this:

Infantry spearman

Infantry Axeman (Maybe basic rank has club )

Infantry javelin

Infantry archer (Bushman mercenary ?)

Champion Swordsman infantry

Champion infantry 2 (Either spearman or bowman).

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31 minutes ago, Ultimate Aurelian said:

My idea for roster was something like this:

Infantry spearman

Infantry Axeman (Maybe basic rank has club )

Infantry javelin

Infantry archer (Bushman mercenary ?)

Champion Swordsman infantry

Champion infantry 2 (Either spearman or bowman).

So, no cavalry? That's gonna be rough... unless the infantry is really good.

Pinging @balduin since this thread might be of interest to him.

Edit: If this civ won't have cavalry, it needs to have 2 things in order for it to work in terms of game mechanics:

1) its army must have a strong anti-cavalry component, since running away from the enemy is not an option. Spearmen in general serve this purpose. In particular, I think they should go the whole 9 yards on this point: they should have citizen spearman, mercenary spearman, and champion spearman.

2) They need to have a good option for scouting without having horses. In this sense, they could have a unique building, let's say an outpost made of stone, that can be constructed in neutral territory but does not decay.

Another idea is to make their walls and defense towers especially strong, like those of the Iberians.

Edited by m7600
Stuff
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2 hours ago, m7600 said:

 

1) its army must have a strong anti-cavalry component, since running away from the enemy is not an option. Spearmen in general serve this purpose. In particular, I think they should go the whole 9 yards on this point: they should have citizen spearman, mercenary spearman, and champion spearman.

2) They need to have a good option for scouting without having horses. In this sense, they could have a unique building, let's say an outpost made of stone, that can be constructed in neutral territory but does not decay.

 

For mercenary spearman, maybe use Sotho or Nguni.

Perhaps they could start with a fast Bushman unit for scouting and hunting like aoe2's eagle (Bushmen are known to chase their prey over great distances).

Edited by Ultimate Aurelian
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Yes, a bushman will work well for an early scout/hunter.

Another idea is that they could also have mercenary javelineers and archers with a 1.5x bonus attack against cavalry. The reason being that it would further strengthen their anti-cavalry skills. In the vanilla game, when your cavalry is about to be slaughtered by spearmen, you can simply run away. Usually the enemy chases your units with their own cavalry. Since this would not be an option for the Zimbabweans, they could have ranged units that specialize in attacking the enemy's cavalry.

An unrelated idea is for them to start like the Iberians: with walls around the perimeter of the civic center. I think this would be in line with their culture.

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46 minutes ago, m7600 said:

An unrelated idea is for them to start like the Iberians: with walls around the perimeter of the civic center. I think this would be in line with their culture.

My first thought was to make the UB a  fortress/civ center blend.

But the Iberian bonus is a better idea.

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1 hour ago, m7600 said:

Civic center work in progress

zimb_cc.png

I think it might look better with only one stair case and some wooden beams supporting the roof.

Based on the images you posted it's possible to have two different patterns in the same building (Checkered foundation and zizag pattern in the building).

Also maybe give the steps a rougher cobblestone texture.

stone-steps-ruins-of-great-zimbabwe-zimb

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@Ultimate Aurelian Duly noted, thanks.

Here's how they start the game, with walls like the Iberians. I'll have to fix the textures though, and the models I made are a bit crude, gotta keep working on them. But I think this screenshot conveys the general idea.

zimb_start.png

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House variations. These are a work in progress, I need to vary them more, especially the checkered pattern, I have to make some of the houses have a zig-zag pattern.

zimb_house_variations.png

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1 hour ago, m7600 said:

House variations. These are a work in progress, I need to vary them more, especially the checkered pattern, I have to make some of the houses have a zig-zag pattern.

zimb_house_variations.png

I think it might be better to keep stone fences for more important buildings, and have houses be made of clay.

Also i like how you made Zimbabwean roofs brown and Ethiopian ones black helps them to stand out.

Edited by Ultimate Aurelian
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20 minutes ago, Ultimate Aurelian said:

Also i like how you made Zimbabwean roofs brown and Ethiopian ones black helps them to stand out.

It's challenging, because they also have to look different from the Britons and the Gauls (and from the Nuba Village of the Kushites). Although I think I went overboard with the Ethiopian roofs, thatched straw / leaf never becomes that dark. I think I'll make it a medium gray.

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Storehouse WIP. I need to fix the texture, but this would be the general idea for the shape.

zimb_storehouse.png

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