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PhyZik

3vs3 Mainland (Destruction of JC)

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Emperior (1437), faction02 (1360), PhyZic (1774) VS Boudica (1666),  merlin1 (1635), DoctorOrgans (1314)

 

Funny JC fail. Have to upload this or it "never happened".  JCs beloved move to run into enemy's base with light infantry and to kill women and traders took a dramatic turn this time and did end in a "total annihilation" (borg-).

3(!) times the naval supremacist, Dr. Genozide fell into the same trap and lost his organ eating squads without doing any noticeable damage. To save him from the unstoppable counterattack, merlin1 had to leave Boudica 1vs2 against Emperior and faction02. As result, they started loosing on both flanks and JC got steamrolled.

2017-12-30_0003.zip

Edited by PhyZik
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@JC (naval supremacist) Unless you're able to give a very good reason that was the final straw and you will be banned from the forums. Joking about suicide is not something that should be tolerated in our forums, and given your history, it's sadly hard to find much room for sympathy/will to assume you didn't mean anything negative.

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 i don't get it :  i just said i was happy to see that he found a sense in his life which will help him to stay alive. I never said he will commit suicide in 2018 ; but archiving 0AD replays might be safer activity for him than running after cars in the street. 

 

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Let me explain how one can come to such a conclusion:

You do have a history of if not being at least appearing arrogant. Then someone posts a topic in which he tells of your defeat in no uncertain terms (and to be fair in a way that ridicules you). Then a couple of months later, so one can not really assume that it is an immediate reaction, but a deliberate response, you reply basically saying that you assume that gloating over your defeat is the only reason he has to stay alive. And that you think he's a lonely person.

Do you truly not see how that could be interpreted as you, if not wishing him dead/saying he should die, at least making it sound as if it is something you thought he was at risk of? I don't think anyone would think that you actually thought it was likely, which is why I said that you shouldn't be joking about such matters.

The beginning of your defense sounds fine, but then you mention running after cars, what is that even about? Completely unnecessary. It would have made a lot more sense if you just would have admitted that you were angry or something, but (although I hope you're not being serious even in a small way) more or less questioning their sanity (you are after all basically saying that you thought he might be going out running after cars if he didn't spend time in front of his computer instead) doesn't exactly tell me that you have any interest in respecting other people.

Have I been interpreting things more strongly because of past experiences? Sure. Is it fair? Not really no. But, is the best way to combat that to just be silly and not expressing any interest in being taken seriously? Let me tell you the only way for you to change my opinion of you: to go the other way completely, and be more serious, more polite, more respectful than the situation requires. Of course it's not easy, but it's worth it if you want to continue being a part of this community. It's your choice though, but I think there are more people than I who would be more likely to interpret your actions favorably after a period of more positive behavior from you.

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I have no clue on what happened besides what's posted in this thread, but:

Warning: Propaganda On The Value Of Having A Healthy Morality

It's hard to judge why anyone did anything. Imo Feneur's assumption of what consists immediate (mechanical/hot-headed?) reaction versus deliberate (delayed) response is probably wrong and I'll go on explaining why, while proposing reasons for being kind and understanding instead of antagonistic and rude to people.

Our morals and the way they influence our behavior, among other things, mostly depend on our definitions, knowledge and general understanding, all that being subjective. We're born with biological traits that we never chose, so acting prideful, arrogant or as deserving more based on them comes of as, to say it simply, stupid. On the other hand, our personality takes basis on those biological traits, while being shaped, to the largest degree, by our experiences, which we also never chose (call it the lack of truely free will, unless we need to go into metaphysics to make an argument). Even if I'm wrong on the last point, which I won't analyze to avoid further going off-topic, no one can deny that we have no say on the vast majority of what life throws at us. Either way, little by little everyone of us evolves into a person with many attributes we'd like to dismiss. In most modern societies, the majority of people have at least some semi-serious psychological problems (again, I won't argue on why, because that would lead further off-topic, perhaps to politics). Some are better at hiding them than others, even from themselves, especially if many things go well for them. If we want a sense of community and getting it's benefits, we need to admit our imperfections, at the very least to ourselves, while respecting those of others. Else we come across as ignorant or complete hypocrites and a community largely acting that way will fail.

JC could possibly have no real choice but to act the way he did, even in the long run. That's not to give him a pass, nor the fact PhyZik wasn't that polite does. Nor I propose passivity towards agression as the best reaction (that's another big discussion). I don't like outcasting people, though sometimes it's useful, towards those who try to make others outcasts (or worse) and refuse to change their minds.

I used this chance to get some things of my chest (I try that a lot lately) and hopefully be a little helpful.

Edited by Prodigal Son

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Since I am not totally informed about the happenings on this issue I will refrain from drawing conclusions.

 

We may all agree that JC is indeed special in the history of 0 A.D. and that (s)he is quite aware of the received elevated status.

Following the removal of the belgacom banmask this player was an excessively unruly, arrogant, hotheaded and obnoxious individual. Randomly creating new accounts, habitually posting profanity in the lobby, demeaning the worth of others - these were just a select few of the countless clashes with the Terms of Use. Indeed, it is almost certain that (s)he currently holds the record number of accounts created and likewise accounts banned.

 

Nevertheless, over the past year or so the subject of our discussion has amazingly started to be more moderate in terms of behaviour - while not really reaching the level of pristine civility - and no longer posts profanity nor insults in the Multiplayer Lobby. True, there is absolutely no connection between the Lobby and the Forums but this does prove that things can take a turn for the better.

After having gotten to know the age of the given person (I will not disclose private information) it is rather easier to explain and forgive erratic behaviour such as has been shown. We thank @Prodigal Son for the lecture in Morality that (s)he has chosen to share with us. At such an age a person might have several problems to cope with: aftereffects of a disharmonious childhood, relationship- or work issues etc.

PhyZik was not very polite in the summary of the game replay, yet what may be judged based on that? Merely a reflection of JC cast by other eyes, it may hurt but it may be true, who are we to judge?

Yes, JC should be banned from the Forums for such behaviour, re-posting after the warning. Yet would that be the solution to the problem? Will it make us feel better now that such posts no longer are visible? Some might say so, yet it is rooted in human nature to act impulsively and disregard the consequences of our actions, everyone probably has said (in one form or another) some things that would have been better off left unsaid.

The purpose of this post was not to tip the balance to either side of the argument but to help with the overall outlook of the issue being presented to us, even though we may not know the contents of the hidden posts we may deduce the core meaning.

 

Note: Mentioned people mustn't take offence over the use of the form (s)he. It is better to be safe than to presume and be sorry.

 

Edited by Hannibal_Barca
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1 hour ago, Hannibal_Barca said:

We thank @Prodigal Son for the lecture in Morality that (s)he has chosen to share with us.

You're not being ironic here, right?

Anyway I largely agree with your points and my post was partly ment to encourage understanding of such issues, here and in general. Especially to some of the younger or very selfish ones among us, who are often kept away from such thoughts, as if they strangely are general knowledge and yet taboo, or too boring to discuss. Perhaps then they can understand and improve their behaviour, be it rude, dangerous for others, hypocritical or whatever. Perhaps not and it's not neccesarily up to us in every case. No guaranted ideal solutions here, as with most problems.

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Since @Hannibal_Barca has got experience with improved behavior I think the best course of action is to hide this entire topic (the first post was rude after all. I have to admit I hadn't even looked at it beforehand though, which might be something to consider in general - it's not always to one's benefit to answer to an insult since it might call more attention to the insult.), but not to ban @JC (naval supremacist).

I do encourage you to please overcompensate with good behavior though, and see it as an opportunity to impress us with being nice and humble. And I think it's probably good for all of us (definitely including myself) to interpret what others say/write in the most positive way possible and to consider that what we say will most likely be interpreted in the most negative. That would probably be helpful in quite a few situations online :)

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@feneur While I partly stand by your decision not to ban JC (I'd be divided on this either way), I disagree with "censoring" this thread, I think it contains interesting bits of discussion that we shouldn't sacrifice for the shake of a couple of rude words. Understanding and an effort to improve intensions matters more. I know I'm probably wrong by forum policy terms though...

40 minutes ago, feneur said:

And I think it's probably good for all of us (definitely including myself) to interpret what others say/write in the most positive way possible and to consider that what we say will most likely be interpreted in the most negative. That would probably be helpful in quite a few situations online :)

My disagreement with your "immediate reaction/deliberate response" bit was used to make a point. I want to clarify this because I've noticed some of the rest of that post of mine could be read as directed towards you if read in the most negative way possible.

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4 minutes ago, Prodigal Son said:

@feneur While I partly stand by your decision not to ban JC (I'd be divided on this either way), I disagree with "censoring" this thread, I think it contains interesting bits of discussion that we shouldn't sacrifice for the shake of a couple of rude words. Understanding and an effort to improve intensions matters more. I know I'm probably wrong by forum policy terms though...

2

Sure, there might be some value to that. However, while this thread sure can stay visible for a couple of days so everyone has got a chance to see it, I don't think the benefits of having it around in the future are very big. It will still exist if it's needed for reference, but to leave it visible could just as likely cause tension as learning.  :unsure: 

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Oh someone removed my post. Please write at least why...

No? Then I try again. :D

 

index.jpg

Edited by PhyZik

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18 minutes ago, PhyZik said:

Oh someone removed my post. Please write at least why...

Have you read the posts in this topic? There is no reason to add to the conflict, so please don't. It only makes me more inclined to delete/hide the entire topic.

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27 minutes ago, feneur said:

Have you read the posts in this topic? There is no reason to add to the conflict, so please don't. It only makes me more inclined to delete/hide the entire topic.

But but, it's the only way to keep me alive :D. Not sure I can stop mocking JC. Just kidding, you can delete this topic, I don't mind.

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